redpill66 Posted March 10, 2007 Share Posted March 10, 2007 I have the stutter in WOT too. Here is some dyno plots of my car I did with some nice comp. software. Don't mind the end cutoff, that is where I dropped rpm, but the first two will show you what we have. One is with the SPT intake and one stock. Seems to make no difference. Those dyno charts hurt my stomach Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
autotech Posted March 12, 2007 Share Posted March 12, 2007 its an ECU problem that many STI owners have as well as us, i have 7500 miles on my 07 LGT and it i have it bad too. Subaru says its normal cuz ive asked. Cobb says when the AP tuner comes out it solves it, i guess ill wait and see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Metal2You Posted March 13, 2007 Share Posted March 13, 2007 I feel for you guys. I have an '06 that would stutter quite a bit sometimes. The dealers and SOA are worse than clueless, they are in denial. There are people on this forum as well that will say you have no idea what you're talking about. The the LGT is the perfect vehicle. How dare you blame your poor driving technique and lack of experience with turbo vehicles on the Holy LGT?!?!?! Seriously though there is obviously a problem. Luckily I was able to eliminate the stutter in my '06. I switched to synthetic gear oil, AP flashed with the Cobb Stage 1 map, and started using Shell VPower 93 octane gas exclusively. I'm not positive which one issue helped, or if they each helped a little since I did all 3 at basically the same time. I think the ECU reprogramming is what made the real difference. Good luck guys. Don't give up on the LGT right away, it is quite nice, though this kind of thing should be unheard of in a $30K+ car. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prime Power Posted March 13, 2007 Share Posted March 13, 2007 I really bet it is the programming. And denying those charts I posted is rediculous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kccobra Posted March 13, 2007 Share Posted March 13, 2007 I feel for you guys. I have an '06 that would stutter quite a bit sometimes. The dealers and SOA are worse than clueless, they are in denial. There are people on this forum as well that will say you have no idea what you're talking about. The the LGT is the perfect vehicle. How dare you blame your poor driving technique and lack of experience with turbo vehicles on the Holy LGT?!?!?! Seriously though there is obviously a problem. Luckily I was able to eliminate the stutter in my '06. I switched to synthetic gear oil, AP flashed with the Cobb Stage 1 map, and started using Shell VPower 93 octane gas exclusively. I'm not positive which one issue helped, or if they each helped a little since I did all 3 at basically the same time. I think the ECU reprogramming is what made the real difference. Good luck guys. Don't give up on the LGT right away, it is quite nice, though this kind of thing should be unheard of in a $30K+ car. I am sure it was the synthetic gear oil. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ERLoft Posted March 13, 2007 Share Posted March 13, 2007 This is over on my other thread too, but I figured I'd add the dyno chart from yesterday's pulls. Three runs are shown from six total, the best of each Si-Drive mode. As you can see, the chart shows the dip @ 3900 and the change in the A/F ratio at the same point. Mine's nowhere near as severe as Prime Power shows, but it's definitely noticable. Dan thinks this will be easily tuned out once I've got AP available and can bring it in. http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a89/ERLoft/ericloft1.jpg 2013 █S4 - Glacier White - DSG - B&O - Tech Package - Sports Diff - Napa - RS4 Grille - Stasis Exhaust - APR Intake - KW Variant 1 - Stern Control Arms - CR-15 - Stasis RSB - Moog Endlinks - PC Hyper Black Peelers - Deval Front Lip - ECS Rear Diffuser - Carbon Imports Ducktail - ECS Mirror Caps - Relak Paddle Extensions - Autostyle Floor Mats - LED Interior - V1 - Blackvue DR900s - [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Metal2You Posted March 13, 2007 Share Posted March 13, 2007 I am sure it was the synthetic gear oil. Oops. My bad. I switched to synth. motor oil, which is a little more relevant. The gear oil change is still to come. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bakasama Posted March 13, 2007 Share Posted March 13, 2007 Over 6000 miles in my stock 07 LGT and I've not been blowing smoke. I have experienced the stutter in second gear. But only WOT, and not in any other gear. And not every time. I fully expect it to go away once tuned. (whenever that is ) If you need a car that isn't blowing smoke to go to a dealership in CO and demonstrate, let me know. I'll see what I can do. -Jim (AKA 09F911029D74E35BD84156C5635688C0) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
solbergfan Posted March 13, 2007 Share Posted March 13, 2007 Does anyone have any idea when the AP will be out for the 07's? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
02BlkRex Posted March 13, 2007 Share Posted March 13, 2007 Does anyone have any idea when the AP will be out for the 07's? Many posts on this but the short answer is no. Current guesses are August '07. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Codean Posted March 14, 2007 Share Posted March 14, 2007 The 2007 sti's have been having the same issue... however they made enough noise about it to have SOA attempt to make a fix by way of an ecu reflash. I say attempt because some people have noticed the issue returning within a few days to a week, but not quite as bad as before. Subaru has to know that there is an issue with the 2007 Legacy as well, however they haven’t done a dam thing about it yet. Here is the original nasioc thread: http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.phpt=1116946&highlight=hesitation Here is the “fix” thread from IWSTI: http://www.iwsti.com/forums/showthread.php?t=76772&page=21 I was planning on just letting this slide on my 2007 spec b until the Access Port came out for the 2007, however with the delay of production... I don't think I can wait till summer for an aftermarket fix. There is always the UTEC, but for the price it doesn't hold a candle to a well tuned reflash. For people that are having some trouble reproducing the issue, try it this way: Full throttle and make a shift so that the rpm’s drop to about 3000 and then full throttle after the shift. I can reproduce a bad hesitation just about every time by using this method. For example: From a slow roll, floor it in first gear and shift at about 4500-5000 rpm. After the shift and the rpms dropping to 2900-3000rpm floor it again. This should help induce the hesitation at 3800-4000 rpm. This can also be done 2nd to 3rd. We need to bring our vehicles to the dealer and make case files about this issue so we can get some kind of fix like the STI's Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redpill66 Posted March 14, 2007 Share Posted March 14, 2007 This is over on my other thread too, but I figured I'd add the dyno chart from yesterday's pulls. Three runs are shown from six total, the best of each Si-Drive mode. As you can see, the chart shows the dip @ 3900 and the change in the A/F ratio at the same point. Mine's nowhere near as severe as Prime Power shows, but it's definitely noticable. Dan thinks this will be easily tuned out once I've got AP available and can bring it in. http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a89/ERLoft/ericloft1.jpg You seem to have lucked out. My dip is so noticable, I can actually feel my head bob a little bit. Gona give Subaru a call next week to see if they can reflash me.. hopefully it will help. Didnt notice it at all on the test drive.. wonder if I did something to cause the ECU to learn wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redpill66 Posted March 29, 2007 Share Posted March 29, 2007 Bumpin this back up top for more exposure... anyone gotten this fixed yet? I am tired of waiting for an AP for the '07s Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mickeyd2005 Posted March 29, 2007 Share Posted March 29, 2007 The 2007 STi has this stutter problem as well. SOA issued a new flash for it ... oh ... one or two months ago. The ROM is floating around on the opensource websites. The 2007 STi still uses ISO9141-2 protocol so the dealers have been flashing the STis that come in with this problem. SOA may be aware of this problem and may have a fix but the dealers may not be able to implement it because the CAN hardware may not be widely available to all the dealers. Just my guess. To me, this seems like an easy fix. One crude way to resolve this is to lower the OL/CL threshold so that it goes into OL at a lower rpm. I'm assuming that SOA increased the threshold on the 2007 to improve mileage. However cruising at 60 mph = 2400 rpm so they could easily lower it to 3000 rpm without hurting fuel economy too much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Metal2You Posted March 29, 2007 Share Posted March 29, 2007 I love it when people fix problems that don't exist, thereby creating this kind of crap for all of us to deal with. SOA loves us all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
t-type86 Posted March 29, 2007 Share Posted March 29, 2007 I love it when people fix problems that don't exist, thereby creating this kind of crap for all of us to deal with. SOA loves us all. Uhh this is def a REAL problem... have you driven in an 07?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Metal2You Posted March 29, 2007 Share Posted March 29, 2007 I agree it is a real problem. I experienced a bit of stutter in my '06 as well. I was trying to sarcastically say that some bozos at Subaru used this retarded tuning to fix some problem that never existed, and created this very real problem you're all experiencing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-TT- Posted March 29, 2007 Share Posted March 29, 2007 in my 05 pre-ap it bogged down just as much as this 07 i have now. its an EM problem without a doubt. its most likely to do with the closed-open loop fueling transition just like with the 05s. i haven't really cared about it, i just make sure i have more revs before i stomp it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ERLoft Posted March 29, 2007 Share Posted March 29, 2007 My stutter has lessened even more after the installation of my AutoSpeed TBE. Very slight now... Once AP for 2007 comes out I'm sure I can get it removed forever... Barring any return to a stock map & intake/exhaust, that is... 2013 █S4 - Glacier White - DSG - B&O - Tech Package - Sports Diff - Napa - RS4 Grille - Stasis Exhaust - APR Intake - KW Variant 1 - Stern Control Arms - CR-15 - Stasis RSB - Moog Endlinks - PC Hyper Black Peelers - Deval Front Lip - ECS Rear Diffuser - Carbon Imports Ducktail - ECS Mirror Caps - Relak Paddle Extensions - Autostyle Floor Mats - LED Interior - V1 - Blackvue DR900s - [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
20lgt06 Posted March 31, 2007 Share Posted March 31, 2007 My stutter has lessened even more after the installation of my AutoSpeed TBE. Very slight now... Once AP for 2007 comes out I'm sure I can get it removed forever... Barring any return to a stock map & intake/exhaust, that is... I second that ! i just installed my autospeed downpipe and less stutter but its still there and it feels like a fat woman landed on top of my car. TREY where is that ACCESS PORT ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGTBee Posted April 2, 2007 Share Posted April 2, 2007 Man I lucked out finding this thread. This is my first Subaru, and my first New Turbo car (I owned a few Conquest/Starions before), and I was really starting to get worried. I came from an S2000, and was used to really clean linear power (pre, and post VTEC). My '07 Spec B has this hesitation that everyone is experiencing, and its most pronounced after a good first gear pull in second gear, and when trying to pass in 3rd, and 4th. Personally, I am not one to take this sorta thing just on face value so I have done some testing with I, and S modes. In I I almost never get it, but of course we know that I limits maximum WOT to 50%... In S mode, I was sure it was the VCS that was causing my issues, so I started to turn it off. Then I thought it might be the A/C compressor running -- Its not. In my car, if I turn the VCS off, and turn off the A/C system completely, I get a good clean hard pull in First gear. However second through 5th all hesitate, I am due for my first Oil change here shortly, and I will be bringing it up with the dealer... Ill post back if they say anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redpill66 Posted April 3, 2007 Share Posted April 3, 2007 Definitely check back in here. I have an appt. wednesday.. might just cancel it because the tech I talked to on the phone wasnt very helpful in the first place. I figure I will lug the car down there just for them to say "turbo lag" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vader1 Posted April 3, 2007 Author Share Posted April 3, 2007 In my state if you take something in to the dealer three times and they can't fix it, lemon law. You get your money back. I don't really want to go that route. What I would actually like to see is a class action. Not to hurt the company, because otherwise I love the product. Just enough to make them address the problem and fix it. For everybody. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dr_sharp Posted April 3, 2007 Share Posted April 3, 2007 Is anybody here a lawyer? Maybe it is time to file some claims. Subaru needs to fix their mistake. Just curious... is anyone with the 5EAT experiencing these problems? lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prime Power Posted April 4, 2007 Share Posted April 4, 2007 I have the 5EAT, and have these problems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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