jeffwe Posted December 9, 2006 Author Share Posted December 9, 2006 I was asking about a theoretical larger H6. The current Subaru H6 is gutless and disappointing. I'm assuming that Subaru needs to have a bigger H6 to compete with cars like: - Camry V6 - Infiniti G35 - Passat 3.6 etc. etc. There are some awful powerful six cylinders on the market now... I can't stand loud cars (and bikes) on the street. I have no interest in modifications that result in more noise. In fact, the main reason why I'm shopping for a Legacy right now is because my 02 WRX wagon is too loud (road noise is awful). So for the most part, modifications don't matter to me as they nearly always make a tradeoff (performance for noise/comfort) that I'm not willing to make for a road car. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NovaWolverine Posted December 9, 2006 Share Posted December 9, 2006 I'd take the G35 or new engines, I like Nissan engines, the torque steer is another thing, but those engines mated to our LGTs would be nice. But I agree with the powerband thing. I actually think the fact that the LGTs have all that torque at your disposal down low, that it's more usable than say a new Civic Si that has a fantastically engineered engine, but needs to be revved to 5k rpm or so for the "Vtec to kick in yo!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garandman Posted December 9, 2006 Share Posted December 9, 2006 the problem with that comparison is that those are peak numbers. The H6 hits 250hp at redline, and so does the 2.5T. The H6 also hits peak torque at redline. The 2.5T hits peak torque at around 3200rpm and holds it untill about 5000rpm. Not really, the H6 puts out about 15% less whp according to the TDC guys. The torque curve on the H6 is almost flat from 2200 rpm up. The 2.5T seems to start generating significant torque around 2600 and is probably exceeding the 3.0 by 3,000 rpm. I never did find a stock 2.5T plot here from the TDC dyno to compare. I posted my H6 dyno run at TDC here, but the thread got polluted by a bunch of turboheads and the mods did nothing so I removed the link. If you pm me I can send it to you or you can find it on other Subaru boards. A guy at work has an LGT and frankly they don't feel that different in daily-driver mode. The stock 2.5T is really quite flexible. With the SI drive in the 07's the fuel cost disadvantage is smaller. Who Dares Wins スバル Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tantal Posted December 9, 2006 Share Posted December 9, 2006 Ok, I get it now. If someone disagrees with you, then they are blind to their car's faults? Mmmkay, gotcha. Why? At some point the engine is just a box under the hood that twists a shaft. If you like the "hit" of the turbo coming into boost I'm sure we could mess around with ignition curves and fuel maps on a normally aspirated motor to provide that kind of silliness. I'm a motorcycle roadracer, I race a Honda RS125R Grand Prix Bike. Its a two stoke 125cc motorcycle that produces 44 horsepower, does 135mph, and weighs 155lbs! There is no racing motorcycle of any kind that can do corners faster than a 125GP bike. I can pass Yamaha R1s and Ducati 999s on the outside mid-corner (then they rocket away down the straight). The powerband is incredibly tight and if you fall off the power you have NOTHING until you get it back onto the pipe. While I love racing this machine that doesn't mean that I don't recognize its faults. For instance it would be completely unusable on the street due to its powerband characteristics. I feel the turbo motor in our Subarus are sort of like this... Its just less "streetable" then a normally aspirated motor. I feel like some folks here have become blind to the faults of their vehicles. I'm not asking for big-block V8, I'm just comparing two engines that probably don't weigh all that much different. I can't imagine the weight of the turbo, plumbing, and intercooler are completely negligible. If the box under the hood twists with the same horsepower and torque and weighs the same why would you prefer turbo? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnAWD Posted December 9, 2006 Share Posted December 9, 2006 Turbo lag on a stock setup? It's there, but you can learn to simply 'drive around it'. Big turbo setups lag a bit, but the stock setup is really pretty snappy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
itsme Posted December 10, 2006 Share Posted December 10, 2006 I have a 5mt and I think the lag is very small I come from a V8 street racing backround. '69 mustang 351c w 4spd, '69 mustang 390 big block w/ C6 and now a '64 Grand Prix with tri-power and a 389 and a '56 F-100 w a built chevy 327. I even raced hondas in the mid 90's. You talk about the lag. Every caar has a flat spot in it's powerband. Just like in your motorcycle you have to learn how to use it. In my '94 VTEC civic I knew under 4500 rpms any car could spank me. I think the powerband is very good in the LGT and I have seen stag 2 dyno with tq peaks as low as 2800 rpms. Some V8 peak higher then taht. It may be worst in an auto but in a 5mt I don't notice. I'm at stage 1 with a TDC map and it makes the car much more responsive and not any louder. It is much faster then my '04 WRX wagon I traded in. I know what you mean about the noise in the WRX. All the road noise and hearing the rocks hit the bottom of the car, I hated that . It made the car seem cheap and hollow. The radio sounded like crap and got worst as you turned it up. It was so bad that I couldn't drive window down on th freeway. I put up with all that because the car was build for speed not comfort. Then I got my '05 LGT 5mt LTD Wagon. It was just as fast and so much nicer and quiet. LGT people complain about the radios in these cars but, they are lightyears better then the WRX. Test drive the LGT. I think you will like the improvements over the WRX. But comming for a WRX the LGT will feel softer and has more bodyroll. You already know stock tires suck and if you get a F&R swaybars or atleast the rear swaybar you will see a huge improvement. Sorry for the long post. Every car has it's pros and cons. I think my car very smooth and at highway speed I don't have to down shift and it pulls as soon as I put my foot down. Once I put on my stage 2 parts and my TDC stg 2 map it will cut the spool time even more. Racer X FMIC for '05-'09 LGTs, '08+ WRX and '10+ LGT,'14+ FXT, and '15+ WRX TMIC Racerxengineering.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
itsme Posted December 10, 2006 Share Posted December 10, 2006 I was asking about a theoretical larger H6. The current Subaru H6 is gutless and disappointing. I'm assuming that Subaru needs to have a bigger H6 to compete with cars like: - Camry V6 - Infiniti G35 - Passat 3.6 etc. etc. There are some awful powerful six cylinders on the market now... I can't stand loud cars (and bikes) on the street. I have no interest in modifications that result in more noise. In fact, the main reason why I'm shopping for a Legacy right now is because my 02 WRX wagon is too loud (road noise is awful). So for the most part, modifications don't matter to me as they nearly always make a tradeoff (performance for noise/comfort) that I'm not willing to make for a road car. Stage 1 makes no more noise. All th car you listed are "powerful" and are over a second slower to 60 mph then the LGT(except the G35 the are very close). But it boils down to what you are looking for. Racer X FMIC for '05-'09 LGTs, '08+ WRX and '10+ LGT,'14+ FXT, and '15+ WRX TMIC Racerxengineering.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NovaWolverine Posted December 10, 2006 Share Posted December 10, 2006 I agree, like that idiot reviewer in the other thread, I think it's the stigma of 4 cylinder more than anything else. I'd like the responsiveness and displacement, but the LGT is pretty good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krzyss Posted December 11, 2006 Share Posted December 11, 2006 I see no choice for 3.0 turbo from BMW. Krzys Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TravisS Posted December 11, 2006 Share Posted December 11, 2006 I see no choice for 3.0 turbo from BMW. Krzys 335i Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.