timnwa Posted November 12, 2006 Share Posted November 12, 2006 oh god yet another car with cvt.......... 2007 Lexus GS450h Hybrid test drive From Aaron Gold 339 horsepower, no waiting Guide Rating - http://z.about.com/f/bl/star/four.gif http://z.about.com/w/bt/bc2.gif The gas-electric hybrid isn't a one-trick pony, a point that becomes clear the instant you hit the gas in Lexus' new GS 450h hybrid. Sure, hybrid systems can get great gas mileage - but as the GS450h demonstrates, they can also give a car tremendous power reserves with a minimal mileage penalty. The GS450h is fast as all get-out with EPA estimates of 25 MPG city/28 MPG highway -- but at $55,595 base ($62,744 as tested) carries a serious risk of sticker-shock. First Glance: An understated high-tech wonder Let's start with the name: GS 450h. In normal Lexus nomenclature, numbers denote engine size, and 450 would normally mean 4.5 liters, presumably a V8. Not in the hybrid's case. The GS 450h is powered by a 3.5 liter V6, which drives the rear wheels with the assistance of an electric motor. Combined output is 339 horsepower, equivalent to a 4.5 liter V8 -- hence the new car's name. Lexus exercised restraint -- almost too much of it -- in badging the GS 450h; aside from the name and small "HYBRID" badges at the back of the rocker panels, the 450h is identical to other models in the GS series. It's not my favorite shape; I've always thought the car looks a bit rump-heavy and sits too low over the rear wheels. Still, there's no mistaking the quiet, regal bearing of a Lexus. The GS 450h didn't elicit the barrage of questions I usually get in such a new, high-tech car, but it did garner respect. Like the Toyota Camry and Highlander hybrids, there's also on the little on the inside to set the GS 450h apart from its non-hybrid brethren. It's the same wood-and-leather-lined cabin you'll find in just about any Lexus -- and is that a bad thing? Not at all. Continued below… In the Driver's Seat: Stretch out, but pack light Leather seats (climate-controlled and power-adjustable up front), genuine wood trim on the dash and steering wheel, and a level of quiet normally associated with houses of worship all wait to greet the GS 450h driver. Unseen are the airbags: seat-mounted side airbags and dash-mounted knee 'bags for front passengers and side-curtain airbags to cover the windows for all passengers. Regular readers know I'm a fan of simplified control layouts. At first glance, the GS 450h appears pretty straightforward. But wait, how do you adjust the side mirrors, open the fuel door or trunk, or anything like that? The answer is a small pop-open panel on the left side on the dash. Likewise, controls for the heated/cooled seats, suspension setting (comfort or sport) and hybrid mode (power/normal/snow) are revealed by sliding back the center armrest. Comfort for front- and rear-seat passengers? Fuggetaboutit . What good would a Lexus be if it wasn't comfortable? The GS is sized to make occupants of all shapes and sizes content. Unfortunately, not all packing habits are equally well supported. The battery pack for the hybrid system lives between the back seat and the trunk, leaving much less room for cargo than a car this size ought to have. On the Road: Unrivaled acceleration The GS450h uses Lexus' Smart Access proximity key; as long as it's on your person, touching the door handle unlocks the car. Pressing the START button starts the car, but not necessarily the engine; if the engine is warm it stays dormant until needed. I'd like to think I'm not the only GS450h newbie who sat in my driveway repeatedly pressing the START button and wondering why the engine wasn't running. Put the GS450h in gear, step on the gas, and it moves off using whatever mix of gas and electric power it deems necessary. The starting and stopping of the gas engine is almost transparent. Did I say it goes? I mean it goes. The GS450h uses a continuously variable transmission (CVT), essentially an automatic with an infinite number of gear ratios. Floor the pedal and two things happen: The engine revs to the speed where it produces maximum power and the battery supplies power to the electric motor (which can produce 100% of its rated torque at any speed). The result is that you get all the power the GS450h can produce right now. Forget the 339 hp rating -- the GS450h takes off like a 400-plus horsepower car, regardless of how fast you're going when when you hit the accelerator. It is, to use a technical term, un-freakin'-real. Journey's End: A lot of cash just to prove a point So what about fuel consumption? The GS450h has EPA estimates of 25 mpg city/28 highway, and I averaged about 23 MPG in mixed driving and 28 on a long freeway run. Those are numbers I'd expect for a car in the GS' size class with a V6 engine and adequate power, but not for a car that goes 0-60 in 5.2 seconds! I've driven cars with V8 engines that averaged 15 MPG and still couldn't out-accelerate the GS450h -- and with their conventional geared transmissions they couldn’t even duplicate the GS450h's trick of making full power at any speed. And none can shut off their gas engine at stoplights or low speeds like a hybrid can. Of course, the price of entry is steep: over $55,000, and that's without a navigation system. My tester cost just shy of $63k and lacked some of the fancier toys on the GS' option sheet. A fully-loaded Lexus ES350 can be had for $46k. It's nowhere near as quick as the GS450h, but its fuel economy is similar. The GS450h proves that hybrids can do more than just produce remarkable fuel economy. They can also produce remarkable acceleration -- but at a price. Will buyers be willing to part with all that cash just to help prove a point? I can't help but think that the 450h, nice as it is, will have limited appeal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John M Posted November 12, 2006 Share Posted November 12, 2006 So you're gonna copy & paste articles on all vehicles that have a CVT now? What good is that? I never said one couldn't be fast. I said to look at the video where the fabulous Murano with its wonderful CVT balked at going up a hill. What do you have to say to that? There's no excuse for a "SUV" that does that! Lexus' 460 (the non-hybrid) uses a standard automatic transmission. Wonder why it doesn't have the all-mighty CVT? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TravisS Posted November 13, 2006 Share Posted November 13, 2006 This is getting ridiculous. Can we ban this guy? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AWD_Rules3830 Posted November 13, 2006 Share Posted November 13, 2006 well he things there can be a 6 speed CVT ... just for that he should be banned. I love my car ... basically. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2hondas Posted November 13, 2006 Share Posted November 13, 2006 How is he posting? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IanKen Posted November 13, 2006 Share Posted November 13, 2006 I noticed that.. a post count of 0... Indeed. Not only should he get banned for not understanding what a CVT is while shilling for it, he should get banned for being a trolling tool. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gire Posted November 13, 2006 Share Posted November 13, 2006 Hay guys! Don't mess with Tim. He's a member of NWA. He'll cap yo ass. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
underpowerd Posted November 13, 2006 Share Posted November 13, 2006 of course it degenerates to lgt vs. the world (+ cars that don't even exist yet) . even so, i know of at least one person that does just fine with that nearly everyday (and i'm sure ppl with cars like edmundu's are just quaking at the acuras/nissans/lexuses around them or whether they'll be getting flashed out of the left by a new gen anything in 08 :rolleyes: ). bottom line: lgt+ a few K in wise mods > sooo many of the 'lookit me i'm (kinda) fast' imports/doms out there in many many categories for the $$$ (and very often cars way outside of its class and pricetag as well). the only capable car in the world? obviously not, there are many; to each his own for whatever reasons/goals/bankroll at hand. i love how the tsx driver thought the stock lgt engine was "ridiculously powerful" -- speaks volumes...and like a couple hundred$ for sways wouldn't -- bleh, it's no point going on and on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The B4 Posted November 13, 2006 Share Posted November 13, 2006 oh god yet another car with cvt.......... last place in the comparison http://www.caranddriver.com/comparisons/11738/2007-bmw-550i-vs-2007-infiniti-m45-sport-vs-2007-lexus-gs450h-vs-2007-mercedes-benz-e550.html THE VERDICT Lexus GS450h http://www.caranddriver.com/assets/image/2006/Q4/100220061410182860.jpg Highs: Uptown interior, user-friendly secondary controls, delivers on performance-hybrid promise. Lows: Numb steering, endless cycling of CVT, asthmatic powertrain sounds. The Verdict: Engineering that's easy to appreciate in a car that's hard to love. [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AWD_Rules3830 Posted November 13, 2006 Share Posted November 13, 2006 i love how the tsx driver thought the stock lgt engine was "ridiculously powerful" -- speaks volumes...and like a couple hundred$ for sways wouldn't -- bleh, it's no point going on and on. ridiculously powerful i think they're ridiculously jealous, as if for a second they wouldnt take 250 hp and 250 lb-ft of torque engine in their TSX's. I have to admit, if I didn't drive a LGT I probably would have gotten a TSX, it has a nice interior and is a good handing car but a manual tranny was going to be pretty much impossible to find. I liked the fact that I could get around bad weather with an LGT with confidence; I would like to see a TSX do 80 mph in a thunderstorm or climb a snow packed hill. Plus what kinda of fun license plate could i have gotten with an acura ... LUVVTEC ?? I love my car ... basically. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AWD_Rules3830 Posted November 13, 2006 Share Posted November 13, 2006 what does NWA stand for anyway? I love my car ... basically. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KA81 Posted November 13, 2006 Share Posted November 13, 2006 what does NWA stand for anyway? northwest airlines Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AWD_Rules3830 Posted November 13, 2006 Share Posted November 13, 2006 northwest airlines ... Right I love my car ... basically. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timnwa Posted November 13, 2006 Share Posted November 13, 2006 last place in the comparison http://www.caranddriver.com/comparisons/11738/2007-bmw-550i-vs-2007-infiniti-m45-sport-vs-2007-lexus-gs450h-vs-2007-mercedes-benz-e550.html THE VERDICT Lexus GS450h http://www.caranddriver.com/assets/image/2006/Q4/100220061410182860.jpg Highs: Uptown interior, user-friendly secondary controls, delivers on performance-hybrid promise. Lows: Numb steering, endless cycling of CVT, asthmatic powertrain sounds. The Verdict: Engineering that's easy to appreciate in a car that's hard to love. wow its easy to quote a portion of an article (instead of posting the whole article like i do) so here is a little run down of the article you quoted.... http://www.caranddriver.com/assets/image/2006/Q4/100220061410160079.jpgHowever, when all the ponies and volts are online, the 450h is capable of respectable haste. Those electric motors and batteries add up at the scales — at 4183 pounds, the Lexus was the heaviest in a hefty foursome, 303 pounds heavier than the GS430 we tested in May 2005 — but for all that it sprinted to 60 mph in 5.5 seconds and covered the quarter-mile in 14.1 seconds at 103 mph. This was a shade quicker than the M45, as well as the GS430, and more important, the 450h posted the best 30-to-50 and 50-to-70 times in the group, performance that made it impressive in back-road passing maneuvers. And reinforcing its hybridity, it rang up the best real-world fuel economy: 20 mpg over the course of our 650-mile ramble, 3 mpg better than the next-best BMW and Benz. ..wow the car was the heaviest???..... by300 #s which we all know can make a difference .....but wait.....the 450h posted the best 30-to-50 and 50-to-70 times in the group, performance that made it impressive in back-road passing maneuvers.besides toyotas cvt.....still isnt refined as nissans (the standard of all cvts)...........point is that a cvt can (and will be) the future as far as economy and performance together ....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timnwa Posted November 13, 2006 Share Posted November 13, 2006 So you're gonna copy & paste articles on all vehicles that have a CVT now? What good is that? I never said one couldn't be fast. I said to look at the video where the fabulous Murano with its wonderful CVT balked at going up a hill. What do you have to say to that? There's no excuse for a "SUV" that does that! Lexus' 460 (the non-hybrid) uses a standard automatic transmission. Wonder why it doesn't have the all-mighty CVT? ........how many people do you know that drive a car up a f***in hill ..........lol i drive a car on the street (where i hope you do also).... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timnwa Posted November 13, 2006 Share Posted November 13, 2006 also nissan sells other suvs that are built for off road............. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timnwa Posted November 13, 2006 Share Posted November 13, 2006 also nissan sells other suvs that are built for off road............. here is onre of the latest ..........from car and driver....http://www.caranddriver.com/comparisons/10776/rock-hopper-suvs.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timnwa Posted November 13, 2006 Share Posted November 13, 2006 another review .......http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/suv/112_0305_mitsubishi_nissan_toyota_suv_comparisons/overview.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timnwa Posted November 13, 2006 Share Posted November 13, 2006 also nissan sells other suvs that are built for off road............. if you knew about the auto industry ..........you would know that there are suvs and what is called 'crossovers'.........but you cant argue with an **iot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timnwa Posted November 13, 2006 Share Posted November 13, 2006 last place in the comparison http://www.caranddriver.com/comparisons/11738/2007-bmw-550i-vs-2007-infiniti-m45-sport-vs-2007-lexus-gs450h-vs-2007-mercedes-benz-e550.html THE VERDICT Lexus GS450h http://www.caranddriver.com/assets/image/2006/Q4/100220061410182860.jpg Highs: Uptown interior, user-friendly secondary controls, delivers on performance-hybrid promise. Lows: Numb steering, endless cycling of CVT, asthmatic powertrain sounds. The Verdict: Engineering that's easy to appreciate in a car that's hard to love. http://www.roadandtrack.com/article.asp?section_id=34&article_id=3638 didnt look to me like the lexus faired to bad in this article lol........ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timnwa Posted November 13, 2006 Share Posted November 13, 2006 http://www.popularmechanics.com/automotive/new_cars/2744461.html?page=4 wow P.M. calls it the quickest lexus ever.......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wheatleya Posted November 13, 2006 Share Posted November 13, 2006 What is this guy talking about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rc0032 Posted November 13, 2006 Share Posted November 13, 2006 What is this guy talking about. Start a new thread to talka bout this timnwa. This one is way off topic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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