Tires are bad. Whats with this?

[jk]

[quote name='Opie'] [img]http://www.subaruchallenge.com/Wills/re92poster.jpg[/img][/quote] :lol:

[Limeydriver]

I see this forum is quickly lowering itself into the gutter because people cannot debate an issue without resorting to personal attacks. Very sad. I am very happy for you if you drive in Florida and think the RE92 is an OK tire. Florida roads are much smoother and better drained than what we deal with in Chicago. In my opinion (and the opinion of many reviews on Tirerack and other forums) clearly many people feel the RE92 is not a good tire. Also I think a poor tire is exaggerated in the Outback due to the larger size used. AWD will hide a bad tire much more than a FWD or RWD until the AWD is unable to compensate anymore - then watch out. A hard compound for a tire will never produce good wet weather characteristics and poor slalom speeds. I cannot think of too many other higher performance vehicles on the market that uses this tire as OE. Certainly Audi, Acura, BMW, Nissan, Lexus don't. The Legacy is a high performance vehicle and tire choice is certainly a factor in the overall dynamics and safety of the vehicle. I am always looking for tires that will provide a wider margin of safety with the weather we get in the Midwest, while displaying a quiet and controlled ride. Hence I will be replacing mine. If you are happy with your tires fine. However the lack of tolerance for other peoples views and opinions in this fine country is really sad.

[Dr. Zevil]

A few things.. I don't think that anyone was attacking "you". Relax.. don't let it bother you. Second, I few posts ago you said that "No AWD vehicle should be getting that squirly at 70 or 80 mph" (referring to wet weather). That's simply NOT true... Hit a puddle or some standing water in ANY car will make it get squirly nonetheless. I know, I flew off the interstate at 75 mph in a very very mild sprinkling. This was not in an AWD car, which probably would have helped.. but AWD is not the savior that everyone thinks it is. I however do agree with you, the RE92's are a substandard tire. I don't think there is any reason to run out and buy new tires ASAP, but it would be one of my first changes to any car equiped with them..

[BoxerGT2.5]

[quote name='Dr. Zevil']A few things.. I don't think that anyone was attacking "you". Relax.. don't let it bother you. Second, I few posts ago you said that "No AWD vehicle should be getting that squirly at 70 or 80 mph" (referring to wet weather). That's simply NOT true... Hit a puddle or some standing water in ANY car will make it get squirly nonetheless. I know, I flew off the interstate at 75 mph in a very very mild sprinkling. This was not in an AWD car, which probably would have helped.. but AWD is not the savior that everyone thinks it is. I however do agree with you, the RE92's are a substandard tire. I don't think there is any reason to run out and buy new tires ASAP, but it would be one of my first changes to any car equiped with them..[/quote] The RE92's came stock on my Rx-8....were crap in 6000 miles, and I'm not peeling out all over the place. I don't care care what anyone says....if you buy a new car and need to replace the tires at 6K, then the company needs to fire the prick who picked those out as "The Tire" for the car. Putting Amish wooden wheels on the car would have at least lasted 15k.

[gtguy]

Limeydriver, I don't see any personal attacks or intolerance. Believe me, if you look at my posting history you will find that I am very attuned to, and watchful of that. Like you, I don't think it belongs on boards such as this. Having said that, I'm a Chicago-area driver. I don't think anybody is saying that the RE92 is a fine tire, if you want to have fun with your car. My contention is, however, that they are fine for the driving that 90% of people who buy a Legacy will be doing. I'm running around on Dunlop 9000s, and the difference is apparent. But I also think that enthusiast boards such as these attract people who tend to drive in a more spirited (yes, some would say aggressive) fashion. Those people will run into the limitations of the RE92. So is Subaru at fault for not accounting for 10% of Legacy drivers, or the 90% who, were they given something high-performance such as an S0-3 or something not all-season, would be howling because they didn't get 50,000 miles out of a set of tires, and that their car wouldn't move in the snow. We presume a level of education from other drivers that just isn't there. There was a guy with an IS 300 with the sport package, at the tire shop complaining about poor snow performance. The stock tire on that car is a Dunlop 9000, which shouldn't be taken anywhere near snow. The mechanic explained that the car needed snow tires. The guy said something to the effect of "What's wrong with Lexus, putting tires like that on a car? Why should I have to buy new tires to drive in the winter?" Car manufacturers have to spec cars for a broad demographic and usage-based swath. For the majority of those people, the RE92 is just fine. They slow way down in the snow and the rain anyhow so again, they never understand the deficiencies of the tire, because those inadequacies don't ever manifest themselves while those people are driving. Kevin

[rao]

The RE-92 is a fine tire - there :wink:

[Limeydriver]

[quote]Scapegoat Hey here is a novel idea, it was your fault dumb ass[/quote] I spent the last four years on Jeeps unlimited.com which has degenerated into a mess from a forum that was ( and in some respects still is) a great source of information. I just don't appreciate being called a dumbass when I get a vehicle squirly or when another member crashes their vehicle. In the four years I had my 265hp 330lb/Tq Jeep I never experienced such a white nuckle ride. I guess when I slam the wall on I294 it will be my fault for being such a dumass as to not recognize the warning signs of a bad tire and changing them. Remember it was this level of denial by the public that allowed Ford to get away with the tire fiasco on the Explorer for years. If I am being over sensitive then I apologize to all.

[racerdave]

Well, my 0.02 is that the RE-92s do they impossible -- they both suck *and* blow at the same time. They're going to be the first thing I do to the car upon delivery. If some people can live with them, great. Enjoy. To me, however, they're an abomination and I'll change them out. To each their own.

[Dr. Zevil]

I don't know if anyone thought that I was defending the Re92's, because I wasn't.. I too think that they are, I repeat, a substandard tire. I hope that the original poster of the dumbass comment wasn't aiming that at you Limey and posted it more in a humorous manner.

[powbmps]

Sure the RE-92's are pretty lame, but I'll keep them on the car until they wear out. Then I'll replace them with something better. So far they haven't been a problem for me (so I must drive like a total p***y). Up here in Maine we have some not-so-pretty roads and a little snow, but I still ran the RE-92's on my WRX until they wore out without any issues. Maybe I subconsciously adjusted my driving style and reduced my speeds in those situations where traction may have been diminished. Not a big deal. Chris S.

[outahere]

FWIW, when tirerack tested the RE92 against 3 other AS tires on a wet track, their lap times were 1 second slower than with Goodyear RS-A tires. In wet braking it was bettered by the Goodyear and Kuhmo. But they did praise the dry road handling, dry braking, and steering response of the RE92, and criticized the ride for having more impact harshness than the other tires (Goodyear, Kuhmo,and Sumitomo) [url]http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tests/value_hpallseason.jsp[/url]

[Opie]

Geez Limey, relax...that picture I posted has been floating around the web for years, it wasn't meant to be an "attack". :roll:

[RobY]

To those who apply. Thanks for being respectful and really debating the issue in a thoughtful and meaningful manner. Scapegoat? Sorry I have enough road experence to realize when I am riding on a substandard tire. God forbid you get into a situation which requires evasive action and you find yourself spinning out of control becuase some other driver wasent careful and didnt realize you had to be "more careful" in the wet because of your tires. If you like the tire hey I repect your opinion. To each his own. But here in Western New York Id be willing to wager the overall road and weather conditions are diffrent than they are in some of the warmer southern states.

[Opie]

I guess I forgot the rules here... I'm not allowed to have an opinion. Everyone is an expert driver Equipment failures and deficencies are the causes of every accident :roll: The RE92, as I've always stated, is an "adequate" tire. Anyone IMHO that is pushing a brand new car past the limits of the RE92's before every learning the characteristics of the car is foolhardy. People can blame location, road conditions, weather, or whatever for every problem they have / will have but what it comes down to is that they did not adjust their driving habits accordingly taking into consideration the equipment they have and the conditions present. Trust me, I've had plenty of "road" experience in addition to plenty of track experience. I've never, ever had an "incident" that I didn't eventually realize was directly related to something I did, or didn't do. A car and all it's parts only react to what the person behind the wheel requests of it. Scapegoat is an entirely perfect term.

[RobY]

[quote name='Opie']I guess I forgot the rules here... I'm not allowed to have an opinion. Everyone is an expert driver Equipment failures and deficencies are the causes of every accident :roll: The RE92, as I've always stated, is an "adequate" tire. Anyone IMHO that is pushing a brand new car past the limits of the RE92's before every learning the characteristics of the car is foolhardy. People can blame location, road conditions, weather, or whatever for every problem they have / will have but what it comes down to is that they did not adjust their driving habits accordingly taking into consideration the equipment they have and the conditions present. Trust me, I've had plenty of "road" experience in addition to plenty of track experience. I've never, ever had an "incident" that I didn't eventually realize was directly related to something I did, or didn't do. A car and all it's parts only react to what the person behind the wheel requests of it. Scapegoat is an entirely perfect term.[/quote] I never said you werent allowed to have an opinion. You certainly are. But if people start making personal attacks indirectly suggesting that thier opinion is invalid because it is a "scapegoat. " don't expect not to elicit a reaction. I never said I was an "expert driver" But I do realize the limits of the RE-92's and its unfavorable characteristics near the limit. In my opinion the characteristics make a substandard tire. Again the next time sombody decides to pull in front of you and you loose control because the tires suck in the wet. Yell at the other driver for not realizing the limits of YOUR equpment. The bottom line is that every day you share the road with other drivers and face variable beyond your immediate control. Its good to have a tire that will react predicatbly in these situations. Compared to the other tires I have used, the RE-92's are NOT. It kinda sucks when you realize that a 2 ton 4runner with knobby truck tires and a live rear axle have more PREDICTABLE characteristics than a supposedly performance tire on a performance car. Although I do admit the RE'92s have more absolute grip. They just get real squirly real fast. This is the reason why many choose to purchace snow tires. If I were the only person on the road I wouldnt waste my money I would just drive slower and allow more time to brake. Unfortunately this is never the case. I choose to buy better equipment not becuse I don't know the limits of my car can do it is becuse I don't know what everybody else will do.

[SUBE555]

I look in my mirrors way more than I'm looking forward it seems. For most drivers the biggest hazard is other drivers as you mentioned Rob and their lack of predictability, I am in that situation everyday. Keeping your head on a pivot is never enough though, you can't ever catch everything and the little things that help your actions and reflexes, even a little are worth it to me. I think we are really beating the dead horse here (Jedi, you can throw the pic in if you want. ;)) Lets just call it even, we will never see eye to eye.

[Opie]

We are in the middle of a Hurricane here, torrential downpours, dirt and debris on the roadways and I drove home from work this afternoon in these conditions on our Expressway (that is under construction; uneven, broken pavement, potholes, puddled water, mud on road) easily at speeds between 70-90 mph...even with all the lane changes around the construction zones and Jersey barriers at either edge of the two lanes that were open. No problems at all with the RE92's. :D

[outahere]

[quote name='Opie']....People can blame location, road conditions, weather, or whatever for every problem they have / will have but what it comes down to is that they did not adjust their driving habits accordingly taking into consideration the equipment they have and the conditions present......[/quote] [quote name='Opie'].....We are in the middle of a Hurricane here, torrential downpours, dirt and debris on the roadways and I drove home from work this afternoon in these conditions on our Expressway (that is under construction; uneven, broken pavement, potholes, puddled water, mud on road) easily at speeds between 70-90 mph.....[/quote] Hmmmmmmmmm. :?

[axis008]

Come on now, no need to continue getting at each other's throats. You know you're doing it at a subconscious level :P. Like some others have said, the tire is "substandard" for enthusiasts, but for "normal" drivers, they are sufficient. That said there is nothing more to discuss and I don't want people getting offended in some shape or form. Thread closed. If another moderator feels that there is more to be discussed, please feel free to unlock it. I just don't want this to get out of hand.