SOA Response to No Manual NAVI Compalaint

[dmitrik4]

hahaha...i know that guy (Samir) from NASIOC.

 

i'm not sure how Subaru is going to respond to "demand" for manual/navi combos they don't offer. most people aren't going to write in to ask for it; they'll just go buy something else.

[IwannaSportSedan]

Well, I've been on the fence about buying the LGT manual for months. I'm begrudgingly leaning towars buying the MazdaSpeed6 because of lack of Navigation with the 5-speed, lack of MP3 or MP3 player support, and the ridiculous HVAC/Radio integration. I wrote to Subaru hoping someone would pay attention for the 2007 freshening. They were actually pretty cool and didn't give my an expected canned response. Here it is:

 

 

Dear Mr. Thomas:

 

Thank you for visiting the Subaru Web site and for taking the time to contact us. The most valued opinion of any business is that of its customers. Your comments are valuable to us in that they provide us with a clear picture of our products as seen by our customers.

 

I can tell this is going to need "translation" already. Meaning: "Thanks for letting us know what sort of comments we should be prepared to ignore."

 

We appreciate your suggestions for changes to our products. We have taken the liberty of forwarding your suggestions to our Product Planning Department for their possible consideration on future Subaru Legacy models. Input from our owners has been helpful in initiating changes to our newer models. We hope to continually improve our products and we appreciate your comments.

 

Translation: "We will promptly forward this to a real or virtual box that will be periodically shown to executives to convince them that we are doing marketing work. We regularly throw away these suggestions and do what we want to anyway. Because we know more about what we do, than you possibly could. Thanks anyway, though."

 

The decision to offer Navigation with automatic transmission models only was based on the demand for this combination. Should the demand change, we would certainly take that into consideration.

 

Translation: "We didn't offer the GT with a manual transmission and Navigation, because we want the profits from marking up the GT Spec B, and the dealers want them too. We don't offer the Navigation in the wagon bodystyle at all, nor a manual transmission, to bolster the sales of the Outback, specifically the XT, LL Bean and VDC, which have higher profit margins, and more brand identity as a Subaru. And just to screw with the few enthusiast who are meticulous enough to notice. If that is you, it's your problem. You don't count enough to affect our marketing projections."

 

The Subaru philoshophy is less about content on paper and more about the driving experience, bottom line performance, and Symmetrical All-Wheel Drive that is engineered into the vehicle from the ground up, not an afterthought or modification to a Front Wheel Drive or Rear Wheel Drive vehicle. Understandably, our philosophy will not necessarily be understood nor appreciated by all, but this is the core of what makes a Subaru customer come back to Subaru over and over again.

 

This is the best part, Translation: "We know what makes a subaru, and we've decided. if you don't agree, then you obviously aren't intelligent enough to see our grand design. To mollify and appease you we're going to tout our AWD system, and if you don't like it, then buy a plebian FWD or RWD car, and leave us alone. We don't need you. We have people who are blindly enthralled by our aura of genius enviro-counter-culture reputation. We'll get 10 more LGBT repeat-buyers through our highly directed marketing campaign for every one of you technical types that we don't care about."

 

 

I mean, C'mon... how can that SOA paragraph be seen as anything more than a "Piss-off, you!" comment? Some will understand, but not all??? Why not just say ", but not you." That is borderline rude.

 

Base line performance emphasis? Driving experience? That is why the US legacy has barely average brakes, and soft handling, even compared to other market Legacy offerings? That is why we canned the wagon's Manual transmission? Yah. Really making that point there, SOA

 

If you have any further comments or should you need assistance in the future, please contact our Customer Dealer/Services Department by phone at 1-800-SUBARU3 (1-800-782-2783) or by email through our Web site ' Contact Us' section. Thank you for your comments.

 

Best wishes,

 

-name withheld, because this is a corporate brush-off policy form-letter...

Subaru of America, Inc.

Customer/Dealer Services Department

 

Translation: "Here is our standard corporate closing so that it doesn't appear that we are brushing you off... If you want more contact, submit another worthless correspondence, as you just did, and we'll send you another one of these form letters, worded slightly differently, so that our intentions aren't blatantly obvious."

 

-----------------------------------------------------------

 

To be fair, I'll translate the original message as well... Remember this is all in fun.

YOUR ORIGINAL MAIL:

 

Hi.

 

I love you Legacy GT. I can well afford it and have been on the fence for months about purchasing it. Great job for the most part bringing a contemporary, fun to drive, turbo, understated adult car sedan to market that's not pretensious.

 

I am a potential customer. (bad misspell on 'you' instead of 'your', gives it an alternate meaning... do I really love a car via personification? I think pretentious is the correct spelling, also.) I want you to know I have money, whether I do or not, and incinuate that I am someone to be listened to. Here is a complement with a lot of adjectives to show you that I am not trying to be unreasonable, even though I am fairly steamed.

 

I have to say though that I'm really leaning away from your car towards the MazdaSpeed6. I'm sad to say it because I like the Legacy GT package better. However, your poor decision to not offer the 2006 Legacy GT Manual with the Navigation system, combined with the terrible idea of integrating the radio system with the HVAC system has turned my to Mazda.

 

I want you to know that I know you have competition for my money. I am technically swayed away from your vehicle, but I am also trying to not put you off by emphasising an emotional response in your favor. But hidden in my velvet glove is an iron fist of complaint. I am frustrated about a couple of detail decisions that I want to be different, and I am going to let you know about it. I told you I was frustrated!

 

Yes, I'm aware of the Spec.B features. However, it's limited production, it's MSRP is thousands above the Legacy GT and dealers are gauging on top of it. The features above are common place on all mid-priced entry-level-luxo performance sedans (Speed6, 330xi, A4, TL, 93 Aero, etc.) except yours. I sincerely hope that Subaru makes some improvements and better decision making about the GT package for 2007. Perhaps I will change my mind then.

 

Thank you.

 

In case you thought so, I am not a moron. I realize that you are trying to fleece me by offering another car with one of the options I am actually complaining about, but I then have to complain about the higher price. Everybody else is doing it, but I am upset that your product isn't. You had better get on the stick, or else! Or else I am threatening to withhold my one sale, and buy a different car.

 

[/end translation]

 

Don't take it personally, Sublo, or Samir/SOA. This whole response is supposed to be somewhat satirical and humorous, and I am sure Samir was just doing his job of answering a million and one such complaints that he receives in a day... You can't please everyone all the time.

 

I actually topically agree with Sublo, and I have made some of the same complaints, many a time. Seach for some of my posts, and you'll see that I expound at great length on the topic, and others.

 

I do however think that a more well thought out, and carefully prepared correspondence to SOA probably would have appeared more appropriate. I mean no offense, but just offer constructive criticism.

 

I do agree that it is boneheaded of Subaru to claim demand concerns for options they refuse to offer, or have not offered in the past. Basing demand figures on a lack of hard demand data is guessing, and I think they guessed incorrectly. Some of the logic behind their Legacy product planning decisions defy rational thought, regarding MUCH more than just the Nav availability with certain transmissions or bodystyles.

 

If it were logical, Navigation would be optional with no body or drivetrain restrictions, and demand would determine how many option units are sold, with which configurations, and real data could be gathered. Same with color, interior, amenities options, etc...

[spec.B-Jay]

Buy a spec.B

[Flanders]

As someone that deals with complaints every day I have to say this is an extremely smooth response. Makes you feel good about things and takes the blame off the writer. As a coworker says about replying to harsh comments, "kill them with kindness."

 

I think Manville Smith made the comment that SOA is having trouble getting the Japanese to buy in to their ideas.

[IwannaSportSedan]

That is a very interesting comment...

 

Does that mean that SOA will be falling slightly more into line with the products offered in the rest of the world? that can likely be a great idea.

[Ovcoursitsilver]

Well here in Canada there's no sign of the Navi system but at least we can still get an LGT wagon with a MT and our LGTs are built in the US. I'm shopping for a Garmin or Tom Tom or....

[gargleblaster]

Don't take it personally, Sublo, or Samir/SOA. This whole response is supposed to be somewhat satirical and humorous, and I am sure Samir was just doing his job of answering a million and one such complaints that he receives in a day... You can't please everyone all the time.

I don't think Samir/SOA (I understand that Rakesh was filling in for Samir that day) will take offense - his only responsibility was to paste the phrase "Navigation with automatic transmission models only" into the third paragraph.

[SubLo]

LOL! The interpretation was hilarious!

[chuckzul]

No, you're right. I shouldn't have included it (the 330xi) in the bunch based on price.

 

What is that guy talking about???? There is no way you have a 5MT 2005 LGT with NAVI from the factory unless you have a SPEC.B. It never came, and doesn't come, OEM like that. If you believe otherwise, post some pictures.

 

BTW, I know about the aftermarket NAVI systems. I just wanted the OEM setup because it all ties together beautifully. Plus, it's hooked into the car computer. That's just what I want personally.

 

No disrespect, have you actually looked at the nav in the Legacy, it's not bad, but it is not even close to the quality of an aftermarket nav unit. Take a look at the Eclipse avn5495, it does everything you want out of a nav unit, can be gotten cheaper off Ebay and the quality and usability is far superior to the OEM nav. Plus, if you sell the car, you can remove it and take it with you. If you look at a quality aftermarket nav like the Eclispe, I promise you won't give the OEM nav a second thought.

[speeding_gaijin]

Gee, just get a 3rd party GPS, they are better anyway

[fzanetti]

No disrespect, have you actually looked at the nav in the Legacy, it's not bad, but it is not even close to the quality of an aftermarket nav unit. Take a look at the Eclipse avn5495, it does everything you want out of a nav unit, can be gotten cheaper off Ebay and the quality and usability is far superior to the OEM nav. Plus, if you sell the car, you can remove it and take it with you. If you look at a quality aftermarket nav like the Eclispe, I promise you won't give the OEM nav a second thought.

 

GODDAMN IT!!! I really wish I could fit THAT one in my car... I love Eclipse units, they are awesome!!!!!!!!!!!

 

When it becomes easy to replace the Head Unit, I ll do it in a heart bit!!!!

 

Flavio Zanetti

Boston, MA

[emorphien]

i just came back from CES (Consumer Electronics Show) 2006 and i can tell you that there will be tons of portable GPS multimedia players (w/ support for all kinds of video and audio formats, plus video games, etc) available everywhere this year.

I don't care about multimedia, but if a good GPS unit came out under $350ish I'd probably be considering one strongly.

[gt_ltd]

you should be able to find a good handheld gps w/ color screen for under $399.

[fweasel]

GODDAMN IT!!! I really wish I could fit THAT one in my car... I love Eclipse units, they are awesome!!!!!!!!!!!

 

When it becomes easy to replace the Head Unit, I ll do it in a heart bit!!!!

Double Din HU's will fit in the dash cubby. I'm having a Kendwood installed this week after a successful dryfit this weekend.

[fweasel]

How? Did you cut the cubby and clock display area out completely, and relocate the display to the ash tray/lighter area?

I ordered another OEM vent trim bezel to hack and glass up. That piece was a better canvas than the OEM nav bezel with the weird button cut-outs at the bottom. Yes, the trip computer will be relocated to the ashtray with the AVO piece (expensive, but cheaper than high quality custom) and the cubby was removed. The double din hole should run from the cubby space down to and inclucing the trip computer space. Anything extra will be glassed-up, beveled, and painted to match. My installer was going to notch and weld the steel cross bar for clearance, but after the dryfit, he said it wouldn't be necessary. I pick it up Thursday evening and should have some pictures next weekend.

[emorphien]

you should be able to find a good handheld gps w/ color screen for under $399.

Like those new nice ones with the reasonably sized touch screen? I thought those were all $700

[gt_ltd]

$400 can only get you 3.5" screen or less. but it works fine imo.

[emorphien]

$400 can only get you 3.5" screen or less. but it works fine imo.

Hell if they do the same thing I wouldn't complain about the 3.5" screen, that's fine. I still figured even those were absurdly expensive. I don't know which ones are any good though, but those Tom Tom ads are infinitely annoying (I hear in europe those are the best but dunno if their US maps are worth a damn).

[fzanetti]

Yeah I don't wanna have 2 HU's on my dash!!!!! Hmmm I wish we could replace the OEM one!!!

 

:-(

 

Flavio Zanetti

Boston, MA

[Jon in CT]

What is that guy talking about???? There is no way you have a 5MT 2005 LGT with NAVI from the factory unless you have a SPEC.B. It never came, and doesn't come, OEM like that. If you believe otherwise, post some pictures.

If you'd looked to the left at my profile you'd have seen that I do drive a Spec.B, which comes from the factory with a 5-speed manual, navigation system and MP3 player, exactly what you said you wanted.

 

A picture can be found here.

[lilycat]

Have you driven the new Accord sedan 6sp? Pretty quick 5.8 to sixty. 14's for quarter mile. I'd still rather have the AWD and better handling of the LGT.

 

Test drove it. Hated it.

 

First impressions only, since I didn't buy it: shifting was awkward; front wheel drive with power...hmmm...wasn't that much fun, really; rough ride too.

 

I went into the show room wanting to like the Honda. The Subie dealership was next door, thankfully.

[JohnnyBoyShoots]

don't think anyone has driven it unless they ordered one on blind faith alone (or based strictly on mag reviews). i defy you to find a honda dealership that has a single 6MT sedan in stock. 300 automatics, yes. one single, solitary manual.... no dice. i think they made just one for the car rags.

 

I test drove a V6 Accord with 6MT, and loved it. It delivered smooth power, and felt very agile, and well put together. But if I was going to spend that much, I would have gone with the LGT. I was trading in my 1.8T Passat, and didn't want to give up the torquey turbo motor.

 

I ended up compromising on the price, and getting the 2.5i. I don't regret the decision.

[JohnnyBoyShoots]

And it was definitely a 4-door sedan... 4-doors was one of my top priorities.

[mphat]

I sat in a v6 6-spd Accord Sedan at a dealership but didn't take it for a spin because the roads were slushy and I didn't want to mess it up.... cause they'd put 20 inch chrome rims on it, tinted the windows, put chrome fender guards over the wheel wells, and put a spoiler on it... It was "Carbon Bronze" and I could have taken it home for a mere $38,000! (no that's not a typo)

 

I couldn't believe a dealer would do something like that... I took one look and walked away laughing. Hell I could almost buy a TL A-SPEC for that much! The original sticker was $28,000 I think...

[pjsemmer]

I had the same dilemma when I was buying my LGT...manual vs. auto. I finally decided on the auto with the factory NAV system and haven't regretted it. The factory NAV system does cost more than an aftermarket system, true, but part of what you're paying for is its integration into the car itself. Like the fact that it will lower the radio volume when the voice gives you a direction or when you're low on fuel, it will display a "Low fuel warning" message on the screen. Also, the displays for fuel economy are much more than just a simple display of MPG. You can actually watch the graphics and see how heavy your foot is on the accelerator affects fuel economy. Also, the screen on the factory NAV system is bigger than the average aftermarket unit. It also fills up the cubby hole space better and gives the car a more luxurious feel, IMO. True, it could be more sophisticated, with voice command and other features found on other manufacturers systems. The only complaint or concern I have is about map updates, like how often will they be available. I just came back from a trip to Glen Burnie, MD and was given "incorrect" directions due to roads changing as a result of new construction.

 

While it would have been nice to have the MT, I've gotten used to the auto-manual and it's almost like having a true manual, except with no clutch pedal. I would have bought a Spec-B, except I didn't like the fact that there were no color choices (exterior and interior), no 6spd manual and no power increase above a regular LGT. I would have bought a Spec-B in a hearbeat had it been more enticing over the regular GT.