Subie noob tries learning ECU tuning..

[RumblyXT]

Yes, that's me.. RumblyXT.. embarking on a totally new and uncharted territory.

First I must say, my computer knowledge is basic-medium. I know how to open/download/save/search/copy/paste, install/uninstall programs, etc, etc, the basic stuff I do with computers in general..

After recently successfully swapping a jdm ej20x on my '05 OBXT and getting it to run, you can see my thread here:

I'm now moving onto what may be the most important section to safely run this "new" motor on my car: Tuning.

On this thread, I hope to gain your helpful insights, and commentary on what you think I may be doing right/wrong and hopefully correct any mistakes on time so I don't mess up my engine I worked on for almost 5 months.

I have been reading and learning on the tools and software needed to become proficient at learning how to Tune; so far I have found these great videos below.. I am hoping this thread will not only help me, but also others, having all things related to Tuning your Legacy/Outback for the first time in one place for those who have never done this before, as myself.

So far, I have a Tactrix 2.0 port with its cable, a PC. And I know I will also need to download programs such as: RomRaider Software, the latest RomRaider's ECU Definitions, RomRaider Logger, ECUFlash Software and have proper gauges such as a Boost gauge and an O2 wide band sensor.. 

Thank you in advance.

My car finally running again on 7/3/23 after the ej20x swap which started back on 2/14/23. The motor has these mods:

Short Ram Intake (modified, I chopped a CAI and turned it into a Short Ram), Regular GrimSpeed 3-port Boost Controller and aftermarket catted 3" Down Pipe. Engine has no EGT sensor, and main O2 sensor is now right after the turbo at the beginning section of the DP.

Some general info about this swap: Engine is a jdm ej20x 2.0L. I kept the jdm twin scroll VF38 turbo and twin pipe exhaust manifold. The transmission is Automatic.

Since the 20x is a dual AVCS, I deleted the exhaust AVCS function by tapping/capping the oil ports on the ex. cams and added ej255 ex. gears. The ex. gears were retarded about 7 degrees ~ 1 pulley tooth to closer mimic the ej255 timing.

Great video on how to start and what files to download: RomRaider and ECUFlash..

Begginer's guide to Start Tunning using ECUFlash..

The basic foundation of Tuning..

And that's all I have for now.. I will be adding content as I learn and build my foundation on Tuning.

Edited April 8 by RumblyXT
video removed

[motorbreath]

I just went through an e-tune last year using open-source tuning. I don't know much about the tuning itself, but the process was not that bad, apart from needing to use my wife's Windows laptop.

I did look at the changes that the tuner was making after each revised tune. They were pretty interesting and if I had a simple way to compare tunes, like diff'ing text files, it would have been really useful.

One question I have for you, doesn't your wideband sensor also measure temperature? These are always an issue for me when at sustained WOT and highway cruising. In fact, I always keep my eye on EGT when on the highway, so I think it would be a useful measurement to avoid damaging your catalyst.

[m sprank]

Good luck with the endeavor.  But, your 15+ years late.  No one here on this forum has enough knowledge to lead you properly.  No one who has the knowledge will do it for free.  Long ago there were a few people on the interweb who would attempt to teach the basics.  But after time it became evident that they too did not know all that well what they were doing. 

Before you dive too deep into the software that will enable you to destroy your engine, you should dig deep into how the engine mechanically operates.  Good tuners understand fuel delivery, burn rates, compression, piston angle, timing, etc.  Imho it would take a few years and several different set ups to begin to understand how everything works together.  There used to be courses/classes you could take and I suspect there still are.  I would recommend researching taking a course or two.  I learned enough taking the AEM Infinity courses that I stopped "tuning" on my own.  I had not blown my engine, but I was in over my head. 

[Enlight]

Dominic Ancia (GetaDomTune), creator of the Cylinder 4 Cooling Mod, has a Discord channel where he's currently offering a module on fueling. That specific sub-channel is behind a $90/year subscription. The HP Academy courses look interesting too, but GDT is very Subaru specific.

[RumblyXT]

Wow.. so complicated is this Tuning subject eh? Hmm..

That was going to be exactly my approach Enlight. Taking one parameter in particular, ie: AFR, Timing, Boost, etc and study it, understand it, see how it'd affect the engine's behavior, its limits, master it till I felt comfortable with making changes on a tune, then moving on to another range until I'd get a comprehensive understanding of how things work overall.

I had no idea my swap was going to work, that's why I said my car was the guinea pig for what I was trying.. but I knew others had done it in the past and got it running. I started watching videos, researching, reading the FSM, and got to work. My car is now running again. Not tuned yet, but it's running..(reason why I started this thread lol)

So what do you guys do then? Just monitor parameters on a Tune previously made by a tuner? If one understand the safe operating ranges and how the different parameters relate/affect each other, how difficult can this be? 

Granted the mechanical aspect of putting an engine together: disassembling, inspecting, measuring, assembling and testing, might be less complicated than Tuning. But in the end it's all the same, everything can be learned. 

Just saying..

Edited July 6, 2023 by RumblyXT

[RumblyXT]

6 hours ago, m sprank said:

Good luck with the endeavor.  But, your 15+ years late.  No one here on this forum has enough knowledge to lead you properly.  No one who has the knowledge will do it for free.  Long ago there were a few people on the interweb who would attempt to teach the basics.  But after time it became evident that they too did not know all that well what they were doing. 

Before you dive too deep into the software that will enable you to destroy your engine, you should dig deep into how the engine mechanically operates.  Good tuners understand fuel delivery, burn rates, compression, piston angle, timing, etc.  Imho it would take a few years and several different set ups to begin to understand how everything works together.  There used to be courses/classes you could take and I suspect there still are.  I would recommend researching taking a course or two.  I learned enough taking the AEM Infinity courses that I stopped "tuning" on my own.  I had not blown my engine, but I was in over my head. 

I got my first turbo Subaru just last year, would have probably started learning tuning sooner otherwise.

When I get into something I like, I don't tend to stop till I get it 100%. Maybe the experience will be different and I'll change my mind, we'll see.. Thanks for your recommendations. 

[RumblyXT]

3 hours ago, Enlight said:

Dominic Ancia (GetaDomTune), creator of the Cylinder 4 Cooling Mod, has a Discord channel where he's currently offering a module on fueling. That specific sub-channel is behind a $90/year subscription. The HP Academy courses look interesting too, but GDT is very Subaru specific.

I have seen a few of the HP Academy videos, very good!

Thanks for the link, but I think it no longer works.

[RumblyXT]

Found a fantastic set of videos to start the research.. this is for an EVO, but the programs and principle are basically the same. It's a pity the resolution is so low, at only 360p..

 

[Enlight]

Hmm... try this link: https://discord.com/invite/8av8AMsgmC

You will find many like minded people there. Ask about Dom's "tuning support" there and you can find out whether it's worth signing up.

[RumblyXT]

Seems like RomRaider requires Java 32-bit runtime environment. I downloaded Java, but my system is 64-bit.

Do you guys know how to get Java in 32-bit version of Java?

 

I think I found how to do it, posting video here if someone else needs it..

How to Install Java JRE (Java Runtime Environment) on Windows 11

 

Edited July 7, 2023 by RumblyXT

[motorbreath]

You have to uninstall the existing JRE and install the 32-bit version,

https://www.romraider.com/index.php/RomRaider/GettingStarted

See the link for the 32-bit version, I think it should just download without any issue from with the US.

[RumblyXT]

Thank you!

I might need to get me/use a new/different PC after all as this is my son's computer and I'm not sure if uninstalling the current version of Java might affect other programs he may need the PC for.. like school work

Edited April 8 by RumblyXT

[m sprank]

There are plenty of schools offering courses if you google "efi tuning".  I dont expect the courses to make you a super tuner, but they should offer a good starting point.  Tuning makes my head SPIN compared to mechanical work.  There are so many different OEM configurations, software, tables, etc that I dont think anyone can be great at tuning any car.  Tech changes so fast that it can be difficult to keep up with one manufacturer.   All the tuners I worked with were learning every tune even though they were already well known/established tuners with over 40 years combined experience.

I had several customers convinced they could tune their own cars. I built multiple engines for a few of them. 

I am certain you can "make it work" and probably not blow it up if you are conservative.  I was able to.  I admit the tunes could have been FAR better as the more I learned about tuning the more I realized how little I actually knew. 

[RumblyXT]

I feel very similar in regards to working on my cars. Electronics/computer related work is definitely not my forte. I feel much more comfortable wrenching/installing/fixing..

Tuning seems to involve also a good knowledge of computer skills, which hmm.. I can get by, but there are certain things I’m not there yet..

So no, I’m not going to go over my head with this project, I know where my limits can be and have learned to respect them. Otherwise the mess can be major..

I feel I can learn RomRaider, ECUFlashing, logging and understanding how to read the parameters and their safe ranges etc for now..

Tuning..? Hmm we’ll see.. I think you were right on this. It might take a long time to truly learn tuning. Yet the more we learn about it, the better we’ll understand those charts/graphics and the more comfortable we’d be making certain changes.

Already spoke to my tuner and have a set day for it. Just need to get RomRaider and the rest of the programs installed first.

[RumblyXT]

Is it possible to have Java 32-bit and Java 64-bit installed and running simultaneously on the same laptop?

Since RomRaider runs on 32 bit system, my laptop prevents me from downloading it correctly..

My other 7-8 year old LapTop with Windows 10 (the one I want to dedicate for ECU Flashing, already has Pentium, 64 bit running system, but it's super slow, only has 4GB of RAM. Working on uninstalling older programs to help it run better. Might also need to get a SSD drive and clone it to make it faster, then download Java SE to get around it.

Edited July 8, 2023 by RumblyXT

[motorbreath]

I'm not sure about running multiple JREs simultaneously, but the download issue must be a security setting that you can override.

[silverton]

I have a 32-bit laptop running the unofficial windows xp sp4 in a drawer from tuning my impreza with an emanage ultimate. You may have some luck at a local PC/electronics recycle place, we have RE*PC here in the Seattle area, I paid less than $200 for it.  I blew up 8 engines in only a few years. a few lasted days, some lasted weeks, i got a month out of a couple, the last one went over a year...even being stolen and them driving the piss out of it, it survived for some time afterwards too.  I never went full throttle under like 3,000rpm...those jackholes were building 10psi at 1800-2000 after seeing the logs that's when I learnt it could do 0-60 in less than 5 seconds and had quite a bit of fun with it.

I miss that car but it was very expensive

[RumblyXT]

I was following the YouTube instructions for all the files I need to download, but the file cars_def.dtd seems no longer available at RomRaider.

I do have the xml version of it though: cars_def.xml

Wondering if cars_def.dtd is still needed..

Edited July 8, 2023 by RumblyXT

[RumblyXT]

Found the answer to my question in their forums.. dtd file no longer needed with the last version.

[RumblyXT]

Ok, quite a few steps, definitely not easy but I got it.. Thankfully this older laptop I have had 32-bit Java installed.

I hope I did everything ok following the instructions on that first YouTube video.

I got RomRaider and ECUFlash finally installed on my laptop and they seem to be running good..

Now I just need to capture the first ROM from the car's ECU... correct?

Edited July 9, 2023 by RumblyXT

[motorbreath]

I think that's definitely the best first step, I would also compress it and back it up. The compression is important because it will create a checksum so that every time you decompress the program will verify that the file wasn't corrupted.

I suggest you do that with all ROMs, unless you are using a filesystem which implements this, which is unlikely. I am pretty sure that .zip encryption includes a checksum.

[RumblyXT]

I have the files compressed in one folder and uncompressed in the other. Will definitely back them up just in case. 
Thanks.

[RumblyXT]

Is there a longer cable from the OBD2 port to the Tactrix, this way the Tactrix port doesn’t end up disengaging/falling while one’s doing test runs? 
This video was very helpful too..

 

Edited July 9, 2023 by RumblyXT

[motorbreath]

It should be a standard USB-C cable,I use a 6'and lay my laptop on the passenger seat

[RumblyXT]

Yes I have the USB-C cable that came with the Tactrix port. I meant another OBD to OBD cable to place the Tactrix port further away, somewhere else instead of hanging it from the OBD port.. 

I saw someone had their Tactrix port placed closed to the dash by the radio/steering wheel. Maybe it’s not needed.. I’m just trying to find a way to secure it better so it doesn’t fall while I’m driving.. having the cable at the OBD port vs the Tactrix itself.

Found it..

Edited July 9, 2023 by RumblyXT