Chiketkd Posted May 11, 2006 Share Posted May 11, 2006 http://www.tigersunited.com/articles/MontereyHistoric/laguna-seca-track.jpg Chris or Brian, I was looking over the track map for Laguna Seca, and I was wondering if you had any issues with the inside front tire spinning in the tight Andretti hairpin (turn 2)? I know you said you're running a stock 4.11 trans and I'm wondering how the open front diff has affected the handling of the car in tight corners. Thanks! P.S. What kinda lap times were you guys turning? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xenonk Posted May 11, 2006 Share Posted May 11, 2006 Its not brake bias. Your fronts are gonna do more work in any car. You can't change weight transfer. Even in Le Mans cars the brakes ALWAYS glow in the front and rarely in the back. Thus is the nature of weight transfer and physics. I beleive Pradet did some calculations of mathmatically optimal brake bias and it wasent too far from stock. Paradoxically or not so paradoxically... the HARDER you brake the more front brake you need because you are unloading the rear wheels and its available traction and loading the front wheels. Who said they had a heat problem??? There is NO heat problem... The problem is a weight problem. http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showpost.php?p=13696960&postcount=63 Chris Lock: "the car is out handling most the cars in the field, its mostly stopping that we are having trouble with. And not because of any mechanicals, just because when you try to brake with a 2500 lb car, on the same size tire, you loose. The Racing Brake rotors and the pads that we had worked amazing. I was hammering them my whole stint and they never faded. I was told that they were glowing red hot though, even in broad daylight. Yikes!" Come again? http://img276.imageshack.us/img276/2964/2257397md6zq.jpg http://www.racephoto.com/pscr/sebring/5panoz.jpg I think you might want to reword your statement. It really depends on the car and its leverage point.. Your statement holds truth to a certain extent.. you have to also factor in the center of gravity and where the leverage point is on the car. You can certainly get the rear to do the work for you as well. Chris is dead-on that weight is the killer when the cars all use the same tire size.. it's that contact patch to weight ratio (as even in autocrossing, it shows from my 2.5RS vs the GT using the EXACT same tire and tire size.. the weight will win, even more so than the power aspect). Keefe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobY Posted May 11, 2006 Share Posted May 11, 2006 well those cars use carbon brakes they are supposed to glow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xenonk Posted May 11, 2006 Share Posted May 11, 2006 we? you are on goto racing now? haha you just cant win can ya keefe? ok, I'll rephrase , I am also talking to Racing Brake as well about a solution.. working on a solution for the possibility of running time trials in NASA. Keefe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xenonk Posted May 11, 2006 Share Posted May 11, 2006 well those cars use carbon brakes they are supposed to glow. Fact remains that you can still make the rear do some of the work Keefe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobY Posted May 11, 2006 Share Posted May 11, 2006 I never said they couldent do work. Just cause the rears are not glowing does not mean they are not doing any work. It just means they are doing less work. Appropriately so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rporter Posted May 11, 2006 Share Posted May 11, 2006 http://www.tigersunited.com/articles/MontereyHistoric/laguna-seca-track.jpg Laguna Seca is run counterclockwise? Ron Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nKoan Posted May 11, 2006 Share Posted May 11, 2006 Laguna Seca is run counterclockwise? Yup, for as long as I can remember. On of the few tracks that does. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rporter Posted May 11, 2006 Share Posted May 11, 2006 Yup, for as long as I can remember. On of the few tracks that does. Interesting. FWIW, the only time that we ran Hallett, we ran it counterclockwise (don't really recall why). Since I had never run it before, it really didn't matter. What would really screw me up would be to run a track that I've been in the other direction!! Ron Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xenonk Posted May 11, 2006 Share Posted May 11, 2006 Yup, for as long as I can remember. On of the few tracks that does. Shenandoah Circuit at Summit Point Raceway is Counter. I think it would be a neat thing to run reverse directions, and it gives you a new challenge of finding the line.. You'll see the difference between the two at different locations of the track and around certain corners (common one is the increasing radius in one direction while the reverse will make it a decreasing radius) and it's possible that with that new discovery, you can find even more time to shave off from your original direction of travel. It's also a neat way to see the difference in paving and landscape as well. If there's an opportunity for a track walkthrough, I'd do it. Keefe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nKoan Posted May 11, 2006 Share Posted May 11, 2006 I think going up the corkscrew at Laguna Seca would be really interesting, probably not in a good way either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xenonk Posted May 11, 2006 Share Posted May 11, 2006 I think going up the corkscrew at Laguna Seca would be really interesting, probably not in a good way either. I think it's still on-camber at the bottom of the corkscrew.. you would have to turn in late and literally drive straight up on the left and then use all that on-camber right hand to make late apex.. at the top of the hill, I would imagine that you have a blind right hander to make and my guess would be an early apex at that point or you'll find the guardrail/tirewall really quick when tracking out at the braking zone of the counterclockwise direction after the top of the crest. I think Infineon Raceway going counter would be nuts coming down from those uphill esses at turns 2 to 4.. Keefe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rporter Posted May 11, 2006 Share Posted May 11, 2006 Shenandoah Circuit at Summit Point Raceway is Counter. I had to go look it up. I haven't run Summit Point since 2002, and I only recall the SPC and Jefferson back then. Must be relatively new, I assume (or I have a very bad memory!!). Although the Active Systems Loop beyond Turn 1 on the SPC wasn't there either (only the gravel runoff area), so I suspect this is all new stuff. Ron Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xr7kid Posted May 11, 2006 Share Posted May 11, 2006 i've ran hallett a couple times and its always been ccw. I'm going again in september for the first time in the legacy so I hope it's still ccw so I can compare to my last time. I can't wait! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rporter Posted May 11, 2006 Share Posted May 11, 2006 In checking their website (http://www.hallettracing.net/) they say the course can be run either way, but that CCW is the "normal" direction. Nice track write-up on their site. Ron Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PGT Posted May 11, 2006 Share Posted May 11, 2006 I think going up the corkscrew at Laguna Seca would be really interesting, probably not in a good way either. do it on GT3!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xenonk Posted May 11, 2006 Share Posted May 11, 2006 I had to go look it up. I haven't run Summit Point since 2002, and I only recall the SPC and Jefferson back then. Must be relatively new, I assume (or I have a very bad memory!!). Although the Active Systems Loop beyond Turn 1 on the SPC wasn't there either (only the gravel runoff area), so I suspect this is all new stuff. the Active Loop System is the skidpad.. which was there for a long time now (for FATTers, BSR includes a 15 min run around the wet skid pad in their Caprices for the Track day, pretty fun stuff). Shenandoah Circuit is probably just 2 years old now, so it's pretty new.. they tried running it clockwise but found some of the turns just too dangerous to do (and odd to go THE OPPOSITE direction of the Karausel.. anyone that ran Nurburgring is use to having the a left hand bank.. going right is just ODD, like the NASCAR guys going clockwise for them is just ODD Actually seeing the wall at 200 mph from just inches from your own left shoulder is scary). http://www.europrints.us/06shenandoah04/HPDE4/128/index.htm http://www.europrints.us/06shenandoah04/HPDE4/128/img_0328_std.jpghttp://www.europrints.us/06shenandoah04/HPDE4/128/img_0329_std.jpg Brian/Chris, do you have any of the data that you can put on an excel spreadsheet of your lap times around 'Seca from your Motec that we can see? I would love to see the speed, rpms, and g-forces the car is going through just right before the corkscrew and the final left hander onto the front straight. I would definitely like to see the entry speeds going to each of those corners. Keefe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joel Gat Posted May 14, 2006 Share Posted May 14, 2006 Hello, Just an FYI, GOTO ran at Phoenix for the Grand Am Cup ST race this Saturday and it was quite the exciting weekend. The race is being televised today at 10AM, I believe, on Speed, and I think the Legacy will be visible on camera... Joel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rporter Posted May 14, 2006 Share Posted May 14, 2006 Hello, Just an FYI, GOTO ran at Phoenix for the Grand Am Cup ST race this Saturday and it was quite the exciting weekend. The race is being televised today at 10AM, I believe, on Speed, and I think the Legacy will be visible on camera... Joel Per Speed's online schedule, that's 1:00 PM EDT, 10:00 AM PDT. Ron Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
axis008 Posted May 14, 2006 Share Posted May 14, 2006 Hello, Just an FYI, GOTO ran at Phoenix for the Grand Am Cup ST race this Saturday and it was quite the exciting weekend. The race is being televised today at 10AM, I believe, on Speed, and I think the Legacy will be visible on camera... Joel Yesss! I was just watching it. I stopped once they hit 3rd place. Not sure if they beat those two RSXs. Great job on moving up so many places!!! Also, I didn't know NOB and Tarzan aka Taniguchi and Yamada were doing this race. I guess they were hired since they were already there for GT Live. Nice! -ben Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chiketkd Posted May 14, 2006 Share Posted May 14, 2006 Grea job guys Looks like your one pit stop & driver change took a little while, but both Chris and Brian seem to be great drivers and always adavance several places on their racing stints!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
legacy_y_tu Posted May 14, 2006 Share Posted May 14, 2006 Yesss! I was just watching it. I stopped once they hit 3rd place. Not sure if they beat those two RSXs. Great job on moving up so many places!!! Also, I didn't know NOB and Tarzan aka Taniguchi and Yamada were doing this race. I guess they were hired since they were already there for GT Live. Nice! uummm 3rd place? are you sure?. It looked like they finished 11th out of 28. I was starting to get bummed with the coverage, then finally I started to catch glimpses of the Leggy once Chris rolled into 11th place. Till then though I didn't catch one glimpse of him Chris, how off did the power feel due to the heat compared to Laguna Seca? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
axis008 Posted May 15, 2006 Share Posted May 15, 2006 Ya, they were at third place when I stopped watching. They were behind by around 9 seconds. I'm not sure when it was during the race, though. I stopped watching around 10:30PDT. They mentioned that the crew said the only problems the car was running into was overheating. -ben Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
icelatte Posted May 15, 2006 Share Posted May 15, 2006 They were as high as third place. The car got a few minutes of coverage in the early laps. On the pit stop, I think it looked like they had problems with the right front wheel. It's also a disadvantage that most of the other teams are only changing out two wheels instead of four in the pits. They moved up at least three places after that though. I guess we'll wait to hear from Chris and Brian. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GOTORacing Posted May 15, 2006 Author Share Posted May 15, 2006 http://www.tigersunited.com/articles/MontereyHistoric/laguna-seca-track.jpg Chris or Brian, I was looking over the track map for Laguna Seca, and I was wondering if you had any issues with the inside front tire spinning in the tight Andretti hairpin (turn 2)? I know you said you're running a stock 4.11 trans and I'm wondering how the open front diff has affected the handling of the car in tight corners. Thanks! P.S. What kinda lap times were you guys turning? We do not have any wheel spin problems because we use KAAZ LSD's front and rear. We used to get fron wheel spin pretty bad before we put them in. Now you can just stand on the gas and rear end rotates beautifully. My best lap during the race was a 1:43.5. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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