No start condition

[kaluce]

Ok, so I'm a bit lost what to check now. My car won't start, Here is the situation.

 

1. Battery is fully topped up.

 

2. Starter is new and exhibits the same problem as the old starter.

 

3. I sit in the car, and put the key into the ignition. hear the beeps

 

4. I put my key into ACC, and hear the fuel pump hum as it should.

 

5. Clutch is depressed.

 

6. I attempt to start the car. I hear a hum from in front of me, seemingly to come from inside the car, but no crank. The lights turn off, all accessories turn off, the radio turns off as they all should. When the key is released, these devices come back on as they should.

 

Again, the battery has been topped up, and just for giggles I tried using another car to jump it in case it wasn't enough.

 

What else do I check. Where do I begin.

[kaluce]

After looking at the diag procedure, I'm going to try and hook a multimeter up to the starter relay and see if I can get anything out of it, or if I need to go further and try checking something else.

[Wasted Potential]

If it humms and has no clicks and yet all the kights dim/go around when it is suppose to crank, i think its still a power issue.. not sure though. Yes, check starter operation to rule the lines out

[JazzAvi8r]

might seem like common sense, but I would also clean your battery terminals and verify the leads are connected snugly.

[Darth SpecB]

I would verify all grounds are good including the 2 straps that lead to the heads from the body.

 

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[relative4]

might seem like common sense, but i would also clean your battery terminals and verify the leads are connected snugly.

+1

[BarManBean]

did you attach the small wire with spade terminal to the bottom of the starter when you reinstalled it?

[Infosecdad]

Can you turn your engine over by hand? What were the last things that happened leading up to the no-start condition?

[kaluce]

1. Battery terminals are cleaned. Initially I thought it was a dead battery before I replaced the starter, so I took it off, cleaned the posts, and threw it onto a battery tender to top it up. Battery is less than a year old too, and voltage is nominal.

 

2. Both wires were reinstalled on the starter, power and ground. The original starter and the replacement starter have the same problem, and I got the old one bench tested after I removed it. No problems, but I was told it was "borderline", so I kept the reman, especially because I don't want to go outside and freeze my ass off putting the old one back in like I did getting it out, just to have it die on me in the snow.

 

3. Grounds were recently replaced, this weekend I'll be able to check everything again to make sure that nothing fell off since I'm doing all this outside and in the dark with just a really bright light.

 

4. @infosecdad I'm not sure what you mean by turning the car over by hand. I was able to put the car in 5th and roll the car around to see if there was chipped teeth on the flywheel or something. so I don't believe the engine is seized, if that was what you're asking.

Last things leading up to no start:

 

1. swapped the OBXT suspension out to the Legacy GT suspension a few weeks back. Couldn't get the rear toe bolts to cooperate so I ordered replacement arms so I can cut them out. The car worked just fine at this point. I didn't want to wear the new tires out without getting an alignment, and the shop I drove it to didn't want to do it "in the condition it was in" (rusted suspension bolts that looked bad, that I didn't replace) so I parked it, replaced the fasteners, but couldn't get the rear arms off, so I bought some tools to cut the arms so I could get it aligned.

 

2. I decided that I was going to move the car, run it, and let it charge after a recent snowstorm. I turned the key, started it, and let it relearn the tuning process.

 

3. Once the car started, it started the idle relearn procedure. As I read on NASIOC, I didn't touch the pedal and just let it do it's thing. (approx 10 minutes) AFR looked normal for learning, as it tried to figure everything out. Oil pressure looked good too.

 

4. After the idle smoothed out and the engine was all warmed up, I took it around the block just to shake down the engine because it's been sitting. Nothing hard, since the car still wasn't aligned at this point. I was keeping it or under 3000 rpm shifts, just around the point of boost. At no point did I have to stop (no stop signs). At the end of it, I parked it in front of my house. it felt a bit shaky, so using my foot I held it at 2000 rpm in neutral thinking maybe the battery was dying.

 

5. I released my foot from the throttle, and the engine sputtered like it was going to die but seemed to hold on. I put my foot back on the throttle and did it again, this time it died. I tried to restart it, and everything died. battery seemed to have flatlined. No lights, no gauges, no nothing. It was approximately 30 degrees, and it was a month without driving it, and I had recently installed a new radio, so I thought I had a parasitic draw.

 

6. Took the battery in, charged it using a trickle charger battery tender overnight, put the battery back in, and tried to start it, this is where the initial post takes effect. The electrics are on again, gauges, security, lights, all work as they should.

 

7. replaced starter. No change. Checked battery leads to both verify they were tight and to see if anything was out of place. New positive was installed 3 months ago, battery ground is fine.

[utc_pyro]

You battery is shot, internal resistance is too high to start the car.

[kaluce]

TL;DR: OK, I think it might be the power leads, specifically ground, cause I managed to start the car last night. Can anyone tell me what the difference between 81601AG08A and 81601AG11A are? I have a hard time believing that an Outback's power cable is $20 cheaper because Outback.

 

Here's what I did, tell me what you guys think.

 

I bought a ring terminal and a ~4 foot section of 8ga wire from autozone.

 

With the battery out of the car I then crimped it quick and stripped the other end back. I then attached this 8ga wire's ring terminal to the starter post and screwed it back on tightly. My intention was to move the key to the "on" position, and jumper the starter's positive contact to the battery directly. This would bypass the starter relay completely and all of the wiring in between, and would also prove the engine works.

 

To make what I was about to do somewhat "safe" I temporarily relocated the battery to the ground, and using heavy gauge (something like 4ga) truck jumper cables I linked the battery to the car. I tried starting the car using the key to insure the problem is the same.

 

Mind you, aside from "relocating" the battery, changing the starter (which obviously didn't fix the problem), and trickle charging the battery a week ago, everything was how I left it. It was a slow chug (it's obviously cold out), but the engine fired up.

 

This means that:

1. The starter is good.

2. The wiring and relay to the starter are probably good because it cranked on it's own.

3. What the ****.

[ehsnils]

There's also a safety switch on the clutch, and there may be a neutral switch on the gearbox (not all models though) and a safety relay in the fuse box under the hood.

 

Workaround - make sure that the gearbox is in neutral and the parking brake is pulled, then turn on the ignition and put a jumper wire between positive on battery and the small wire on the starter and see if it cranks then. Make sure that fingers and cats are out of the way from moving parts.

[Max Capacity]

, but the engine fired up.

 

So it now starts ?

 

How old is the battery ?

 

Did you have the battery tested ?

 

 

http://people.csail.mit.edu/ilh/vacation/

[ehsnils]

Note to self - don't post while tired.

[kaluce]

Engine doesn't start once the battery was put back in place. What I forgot to mention was that after the battery was put back, I turned the key to start the car again, and it acted as if it were dead, lights died, no reaction from the alarm, nothing.

 

I adjusted battery ground, and the lights went back on, that's why I'm leaning toward ground.

 

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[Infosecdad]

Definitely sounds like the ground from your battery is suspect.

[BajaTim]

Definitely sounds like the ground from your battery is suspect.

 

 

 

I just had mysterious random non-starting with my ‘05 Baja I bought in July (AAA new battery day 2 - called seller up and made him pay for it[emoji35])...

 

Noticed negative cable terminal was loose - but after “jiggling” wire power would go on and we could start it (annoying) so replaced negative with “gold” terminal from Autozone...good for 24 hours so replaced positive...that was 2 days ago - perfect since then. I sprayed everything with dirkectric grease for good measure.

 

When I get to Toronto (with indoor garages) am going to clean all accessible ground wires/connections.

 

And now, the glove box light works - did not know I had one[emoji13]

 

One thing I read...take out and reinsert all fuses...not sure you can “clean” them...but I way “wipe” with MAF cleaner, dry and reinsert...

 

My ‘05 sat on blocks for 2 years - don’t think it did itself any favours in terms of rust and connections:)

 

 

 

 

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[aj_mariner]

Best thing for batt terminals is Fluid Film. We used that on the lifeboat batteries. Terminals looked new after three years in the salty environment.

 

Edit: sold at Napa