Chris GTO TT Posted April 13, 2015 Share Posted April 13, 2015 Ouch the block cracked 2003 Baja 5MT 2016 Outback 2.5i Premium w/Eyesight Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AMileHighLGT Posted April 13, 2015 Share Posted April 13, 2015 That definitely sucks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt.Gator Posted April 13, 2015 Author Share Posted April 13, 2015 Ouch the block cracked That definitely sucks! Yep!! Of course it's cracked at the thinnest point on the cylinder wall where it's scalloped to allow the case bolt by. Seems like a bad design to me. Nothing like a race track to find the weak points in man and machine. "Good Judgement comes from Experience. Experience comes from Bad Judgement" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhitter Posted April 13, 2015 Share Posted April 13, 2015 Have you looked at the engine that was in the Spec.B to determine how / why it failed? My OBXT build Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boxkita Posted April 13, 2015 Share Posted April 13, 2015 wonder if a closed deck block would have been stronger in that area allowing for less flex? Pure speculation of course. Looks like outer edge of block is cracked, too, starting at top of block. Build my car Boxkita Track days Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boxman Posted April 14, 2015 Share Posted April 14, 2015 wonder if a closed deck block would have been stronger in that area allowing for less flex? Pure speculation of course. Looks like outer edge of block is cracked, too, starting at top of block. I would say yes, a closed deck insert would have reinforced this section of the block enough to prevent that crack. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt.Gator Posted April 14, 2015 Author Share Posted April 14, 2015 Have you looked at the engine that was in the Spec.B to determine how / why it failed? Not yet. Making slow progress though. Radiator/Fans are out. FMIC piping is out and numbered for reassembly for whoever buys it. Next up is removing the bumper so I cn get to the FMIC core. There was quite a bit of oil in every section of the FMIC piping. So far none of the oil in the FMIC shows any sign of metal particles. I'm racing this weekend but I hope to make some more progress this week. I did get the ARP head studs out of the above spare longblock. Almost all of them were in there way too tight. I had to use a cheater pipe on the Allen wrench to get them loose, I thought for sure I was going to break the Allen wrench. wonder if a closed deck block would have been stronger in that area allowing for less flex? Pure speculation of course. Looks like outer edge of block is cracked, too, starting at top of block. At first I thought that too. Now I'm 99% sure the mark you see in the pic is where hot gases marked the outer case wall when shooting thru the crack from the cylinder. There is no discernable crack, just a permanent mark. Nothing like a race track to find the weak points in man and machine. "Good Judgement comes from Experience. Experience comes from Bad Judgement" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AMileHighLGT Posted April 14, 2015 Share Posted April 14, 2015 A fully closed deck would mitigate the chances of damaging the cylinder walls. What gets me is that you weren't exactly punching out 500 horse on a non sleeved block, so what gives? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhitter Posted April 14, 2015 Share Posted April 14, 2015 A fully closed deck would mitigate the chances of damaging the cylinder walls. What gets me is that you weren't exactly punching out 500 horse on a non sleeved block, so what gives? That crack was Drew's old block. The broken one that came with the car. I think it was built wrong from the get-go. This is the build thread for that broken block - http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2264719 Don't know yet the cause of the engine failure at the HPDE event. Gator has three blocks right now I think two broken built daily driven short blocks one functioning race motor on the OEM shortblock. My OBXT build Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boxkita Posted April 14, 2015 Share Posted April 14, 2015 That crack was Drew's old block. The broken one that came with the car. I think it was built wrong from the get-go. This is the build thread for that broken block - http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2264719 Don't know yet the cause of the engine failure at the HPDE event. Gator has three blocks right now I think two broken built short daily driven blocks one functioning race motor on the OEM shortblock. From his 3 data points we can draw what conclusions? stay stock, stay happy? Build my car Boxkita Track days Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhitter Posted April 14, 2015 Share Posted April 14, 2015 From his 3 data points we can draw what conclusions? stay stock, stay happy? stay stock, race, stay happy. My OBXT build Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris GTO TT Posted April 15, 2015 Share Posted April 15, 2015 Because I'm too lazy to read the full build thread for the spec.B motor what was the bore? 2003 Baja 5MT 2016 Outback 2.5i Premium w/Eyesight Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt.Gator Posted April 15, 2015 Author Share Posted April 15, 2015 Because I'm too lazy to read the full build thread for the spec.B motor what was the bore? The cracked spare block/cylinder bore is 99.5 mm. Made progress on the dismantle: Bumper off, FMIC all out, Alternator off, A/C moved over. I was surprised there is no crash bar at all behind the bumper cover. On my race car the Perrin FMIC has solid bar that takes the stock crash bar's place. This RacerX FMIC installation has nothing, although I've seen the threads here and know it can fit with the crash bar. The RacerX FMIC will be for sale very soon in the classifieds. I noticed it has quite a bit of oil in it, the buyer will need to have it boiled out at a radiator shop. I learned this trick with the Sharpie Oil Base Paint pens either here or on one of the other forums I read and want to share it again here. Every hose, electrical clip, bolt, vacuum, heater, PVC, flange; literally anyplace two things that are mated up come apart, you mark with one or several colored lines. Even bolts that don't stay connected to whatever they are bolting down, I run one or more lines of colored paint over. That makes it much simpler and easier to put everything back together! If the colors and lines don't match up, it's not right. If you have a hose with a blue line and a red line, look for the connection on the engine with the same two marks. It's great for those of us that don't instantly recognize every little bolt, flange, and hose. And these builds sometimes go over months, trying to remember what goes with what is a puzzle. I'm going to do this with every connection in my race car too. In the pits I may have only 1 hour between qualifying and the rce to make a repair. As you can imagine I start tearing into the engine bay pulling vacuum hoses and electrical connectors right and left, make the repair, then try to remember where everything goes back exactly and it has to be right the first time. With this system it's a no brainer, you know if you have everything back in the right place 100% as you go. Many thanks to whoever first posted this system, I love it! [ame=http://www.amazon.com/Sharpie-Paint-Marker-Point-Based/dp/B005QEZ9YW/ref=sr_1_cc_1?s=aps&ie=UTF8&qid=1429077827&sr=1-1-catcorr&keywords=sharpie+oil+pens]The Sharpie Pens Sets[/ame] Other news, I shipped my Forced Performance 18g from the race car off to JmP6889928 for a custom rebuild as a spare for the race car, and he's building a custom VF46 to put in this Spec B. The Tomioka 20g will be for sale with the FMIC. Nothing like a race track to find the weak points in man and machine. "Good Judgement comes from Experience. Experience comes from Bad Judgement" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boxkita Posted April 15, 2015 Share Posted April 15, 2015 My miata has those markings. Been going batty trying tonfind a replacement. Thanks. You don't happen to have a source for the torque sensitive paint, too, do you? Build my car Boxkita Track days Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt.Gator Posted April 15, 2015 Author Share Posted April 15, 2015 My miata has those markings. Been going batty trying tonfind a replacement. Thanks. You don't happen to have a source for the torque sensitive paint, too, do you? Nope, and I know nothing about torque sensitive paint, but it sounds very interesting! Where do you use it? Nothing like a race track to find the weak points in man and machine. "Good Judgement comes from Experience. Experience comes from Bad Judgement" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gingerbeard Posted April 15, 2015 Share Posted April 15, 2015 I'm curious about the torque sensitive paint too, I've never heard of it and Google isn't helping. We use torque "seal" type paint regularly here but that stuff is easy to find so it can't be that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt.Gator Posted April 16, 2015 Author Share Posted April 16, 2015 Tonight I got the Crawford AOS off. As I mentioned above, all the FMIC piping from the Intake > Turbo > FMIC > Throttle had quite a bit of oil in it. The AOS was supposed to prevent that problem. I found that one of the lines from the AOS to the breather Y was bent at such a strong angle next to the intake mani that it was probably 80% pinched off. If you are familiar with the instructions, it's #19: "5/8” thick, 18” long hose with the 10” fire sleeve, and route from the middle port on the AOS to the top of the crankcase breather “Y”." I'm thinking that was the problem. The oil was backing up into the AOS and back out into the intake tract. Under normal circumstances of cruising on the highway the boost was low enough to allow the oil to be sucked thru the system without consequence, but 20 minutes of near WOT was too much, forcing a lot of oil into the intake which causes knock and bang, dead engine. We'll know more about what failed soon, I'm almost ready to pull the engine out. Nothing like a race track to find the weak points in man and machine. "Good Judgement comes from Experience. Experience comes from Bad Judgement" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boxkita Posted April 16, 2015 Share Posted April 16, 2015 Nope, and I know nothing about torque sensitive paint, but it sounds very interesting! Where do you use it? It's on the suspension bolts. Different colors will break at different torque settings. I think its like safety wire minus the wire? A visual inspection tells you whether the bolt/nuts moved? Build my car Boxkita Track days Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boxkita Posted April 16, 2015 Share Posted April 16, 2015 I'm curious about the torque sensitive paint too, I've never heard of it and Google isn't helping. We use torque "seal" type paint regularly here but that stuff is easy to find so it can't be that. As I was only guessing about its name, this looks like it. I had assumed (because different colors) that they were differing colors for different loads. "TorqueSeal" comes in different colors however is all the same. From interwebs: An inexpensive method to detect warranty tampering; and vibration looseningUsed in production on compression fittings, studs, nuts, parts, and assemblies after they are in proper torque or position.Widely used as "Anti-Sabotage Lacquer".Inspectors can visually detect any movement or tampering; Torque Seal becomes brittle and will crackExcellent adhesion to all metals and to most other surfaces. Dries fast. Looks like I'll be getting a couple of tubes of this. [ame=http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00SU70TPG/ref=ox_sc_act_title_1?ie=UTF8&psc=1&smid=A1V49C70LFZDOS]4 color variety pack[/ame] Build my car Boxkita Track days Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt.Gator Posted April 16, 2015 Author Share Posted April 16, 2015 As I was only guessing about its name, this looks like it. I had assumed (because different colors) that they were differing colors for different loads. "TorqueSeal" comes in different colors however is all the same. From interwebs: Looks like I'll be getting a couple of tubes of this. 4 color variety pack I think the Sharpie Pens will provide the same benefit. Nothing like a race track to find the weak points in man and machine. "Good Judgement comes from Experience. Experience comes from Bad Judgement" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boxkita Posted April 16, 2015 Share Posted April 16, 2015 I ordered both. We'll see. :-) Build my car Boxkita Track days Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SSpeed Posted April 21, 2015 Share Posted April 21, 2015 Subscribed for updates on the Crawford AOS... Nice idea with the sharpies! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt.Gator Posted April 29, 2015 Author Share Posted April 29, 2015 Subscribed for updates on the Crawford AOS... Nice idea with the sharpies! The AOS is for sale along with the FMIC and GoFastBits BOV here: http://legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php/pac-nw-crawford-aos-gofastbits-bov-racerx-fmic-240388.html Rebuilt Turbo arrived today. A VF46 from JMP6889928. It looks great! Nothing like a race track to find the weak points in man and machine. "Good Judgement comes from Experience. Experience comes from Bad Judgement" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt.Gator Posted May 26, 2015 Author Share Posted May 26, 2015 The cause of my pain and the wicked knocking sound: Cylinder #4 rod bearing. Toast. As to why the bearing got destroyed, I'm not sure. The Crawford AOS is no longer a suspect in the engine's death though. Even though the intake had way too much oil and was a problem, oil in the intake causes detonation and stuff like broken ringlands and cracked pistons. The block, pistons, rings, and head gaskets all are fine. No signs of any damage other than the rod bearing and bits of bearing material in the oil pan, and fine metal particles in all the oil, and lot of oil carbonizing on the piston tops. I'm praying the hand ported heads, cams, and cam journals are not ruined. I will be able to reuse the ARP head studs and ARP rod cap bolts. A waste of the nice forged Manley pistons and rods. Nothing like a race track to find the weak points in man and machine. "Good Judgement comes from Experience. Experience comes from Bad Judgement" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SSpeed Posted May 26, 2015 Share Posted May 26, 2015 How did you rule out the AOS? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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