Can someone please explain Subaru's transmission strategy?

[Drakuun]

Aussies drive on the same side of the road as in Japan, so they dont have to retool the car for that market. Even less $$

 

This is true, but 99% of the goodies were talking about have nothing to do with which side of the car the wheel is on.

[doteleven]

I read somewhere that less than 5% of the cars sold in the US come with manual transmissions. Think about the intersection of people who want to drive stick shift cars with people who want to drive wagons. That's approaching zero. As I've said before, there is statistically no reason for Subaru to give a rats ass about the 200 of us in August that actually bought a stick shift wagon.

 

I still can't believe I'm now driving a car even more rare than my previous one (R32), and my second one year limited production car, to boot. I must be a complete zero for the demographers!

 

Albert

[The B4]

I read somewhere that less than 5% of the cars sold in the US come with manual transmissions. Think about the intersection of people who want to drive stick shift cars with people who want to drive wagons. That's approaching zero. As I've said before, there is statistically no reason for Subaru to give a rats ass about the 200 of us in August that actually bought a stick shift wagon.

 

I still can't believe I'm now driving a car even more rare than my previous one (R32), and my second one year limited production car, to boot. I must be a complete zero for the demographers!

 

Albert

 

That means your opinion on anything Subaru should do is invalid... I'm just kidding!

[iyamdman]

I hear from the owner of the dealer that sold me my car in 2005, that SOA make about 150 MT wagons a month - 60% Limited.

 

That's about 90 a month - 1080 a year.

 

Let's assume they make the same number of each color (6 colors).

 

This means that there are only 180 of my car in the USA - Silver 5MT Limited Wagon.

 

Wholly shit - and you thought 500 Spec B. was a limited (pun) edition!!!

 

No wonder I don't see many Leg Wagons on the road - there aren't many.

 

So, if you are one of the 1000 5MT Limited Wagon owners - welcome to my club!!!!

[IwannaSportSedan]

Just another sign that normalcy is going out the window.

 

Your car analyst freind is probably right, but only because it is a self-fulfilling trend.

 

SOA knows that Subaru's marketshare is about 1%. For ALL subarus in the US, of which the Legacy is only beaten by the Baja as the smallest seller in the line.

 

The thing is, by SOA own reactive strategy and decision making, they are dooming themselves to just that role. With such lackluster competitive marketing, and without really putting the hammer down for the Legacy lineup, it is condemning itself to selling Outbacks and the occaisional WRX/STi. (I consider the B9 basically an Outback that has given in to the SUV Peer-pressure.)

 

They are content to hold their little all-road wagon minute niche, and sell a couple of rally-replicas to some people who know about turbos and AWD.

 

If subaru wants to break out of it's niche, it needs to concentrate on doing OTHER things well, besides what it does well know. "In business, you're either growing or your dyin'. There ain't no third direction."

 

Subaru needs to break the sport sedan market. Sell a hammer of a Legacy sport sedan. Undercut the S4 and M3 at an affordable price. Subaru isn't going to in the forseeable future compete with those nameplates. But it can sure undercut them, and replace the old e36 M3, and V6TT S4. People like me, who don't have $50k sure miss those cars.

 

Secondly...

Bring in some Coupes. This is rediculous. A company that makes NO trucks, doesn't even have a full roster of cars. No convertibles, that is somehow understandable. But not even a two-door. That is a gaping hole in the line.

 

A WRX small coupe would pull the line for the sport compact crowd. How many people will buy the new eclipse, RSX, Civic, or tC because of their coupe good looks. (or even their BAD looks, in the case of the Mitsu)

 

Even if the WRC cars stay as sedans. A coupe sells on the street, especially with the same drivetrain.

 

A larger coupe, a true GT coupe, or an RX-8 style car with reverse-opening doors. (and a fast-back hatch, with folding seats and a flat load floor.) With the Legacy GT and a Twin-turbo H6 drivetrain, it should be every bit the performance car the Sport Sedan and Sport Wagon that the Legacy is.

 

Splitting between the sport-focused cars, and the taller all-road focused cars should devide cleanly. Impreza-WRX-STI-"compact coupe", Legacy Sedan-Wagon-"GT Coupe" on one side; Forester, Outback, and B9 Tribeca on the other.

 

After all that is done, perhaps they could really shake things up... You might laugh, but it might work...

Bring back the Brat. With a much nicer name, and not "Baja." If people want four doors and a truck bed, let them get a SportTrack. The revived sportTruck should be half and half.

 

Something with a lot of power and performance, but also moderate ride-height, and some utility.

Two-doors only. Unitized body with the bed, dual-opening tailgate, etc. Something like a cross between an modern, slightly smaller el camino, and a two-door, non-ugly Honda Ridgeline. Something like the Jeepster concept from a few years back, with just a slight bit more utility.

 

If they do it right, they can have something unique on the market, if they do it even slightly wrong, it will likely be a big flop.

 

Whatever they do, they need to act like they want to grow, instead of heading in the opposite direction with decisions like canning options on the lines they already have, like the 5MT from the Legacy wagon.

 

Even if they made the manual transmission a BTO option, and shipped all inventory as automatics until 5MT wagons are specifically ordered, how much could that cost? they already have the transmissions for the sedans and the OBXT.

 

I talked with my dad about this odd decision, he thinks that the 5MT in the Outback is throwing a bone to soft-roaders who want more control with a manual trans off the pavement. That still doesn't explain why they deny that control to a sporty wagon Legacy version of the same car.

[The B4]

Just another sign that normalcy is going out the window.

 

Your car analyst freind is probably right, but only because it is a self-fulfilling trend.

 

SOA knows that Subaru's marketshare is about 1%. For ALL subarus in the US, of which the Legacy is only beaten by the Baja as the smallest seller in the line.

 

The thing is, by SOA own reactive strategy and decision making, they are dooming themselves to just that role. With such lackluster competitive marketing, and without really putting the hammer down for the Legacy lineup, it is condemning itself to selling Outbacks and the occaisional WRX/STi. (I consider the B9 basically an Outback that has given in to the SUV Peer-pressure.)

 

They are content to hold their little all-road wagon minute niche, and sell a couple of rally-replicas to some people who know about turbos and AWD.

 

If subaru wants to break out of it's niche, it needs to concentrate on doing OTHER things well, besides what it does well know. "In business, you're either growing or your dyin'. There ain't no third direction."

 

Subaru needs to break the sport sedan market. Sell a hammer of a Legacy sport sedan. Undercut the S4 and M3 at an affordable price. Subaru isn't going to in the forseeable future compete with those nameplates. But it can sure undercut them, and replace the old e36 M3, and V6TT S4. People like me, who don't have $50k sure miss those cars.

 

Secondly...

Bring in some Coupes. This is rediculous. A company that makes NO trucks, doesn't even have a full roster of cars. No convertibles, that is somehow understandable. But not even a two-door. That is a gaping hole in the line.

 

A WRX small coupe would pull the line for the sport compact crowd. How many people will buy the new eclipse, RSX, Civic, or tC because of their coupe good looks. (or even their BAD looks, in the case of the Mitsu)

 

Even if the WRC cars stay as sedans. A coupe sells on the street, especially with the same drivetrain.

 

A larger coupe, a true GT coupe, or an RX-8 style car with reverse-opening doors. (and a fast-back hatch, with folding seats and a flat load floor.) With the Legacy GT and a Twin-turbo H6 drivetrain, it should be every bit the performance car the Sport Sedan and Sport Wagon that the Legacy is.

 

Splitting between the sport-focused cars, and the taller all-road focused cars should devide cleanly. Impreza-WRX-STI-"compact coupe", Legacy Sedan-Wagon-"GT Coupe" on one side; Forester, Outback, and B9 Tribeca on the other.

 

After all that is done, perhaps they could really shake things up... You might laugh, but it might work...

Bring back the Brat. With a much nicer name, and not "Baja." If people want four doors and a truck bed, let them get a SportTrack. The revived sportTruck should be half and half.

 

Something with a lot of power and performance, but also moderate ride-height, and some utility.

Two-doors only. Unitized body with the bed, dual-opening tailgate, etc. Something like a cross between an modern, slightly smaller el camino, and a two-door, non-ugly Honda Ridgeline. Something like the Jeepster concept from a few years back, with just a slight bit more utility.

 

If they do it right, they can have something unique on the market, if they do it even slightly wrong, it will likely be a big flop.

 

Whatever they do, they need to act like they want to grow, instead of heading in the opposite direction with decisions like canning options on the lines they already have, like the 5MT from the Legacy wagon.

 

Even if they made the manual transmission a BTO option, and shipped all inventory as automatics until 5MT wagons are specifically ordered, how much could that cost? they already have the transmissions for the sedans and the OBXT.

 

I talked with my dad about this odd decision, he thinks that the 5MT in the Outback is throwing a bone to soft-roaders who want more control with a manual trans off the pavement. That still doesn't explain why they deny that control to a sporty wagon Legacy version of the same car.

 

Subaru needs to find it's freaking identity. I'm all for them being premium, but they need to decide what they want to be BESIDES premium. What will put Subaru on the radar for the mainstream people looking for a premium automobile.

 

*Subaru can either be profitable niche (Porsche, Mini), Dying Niche (Saab), Profitable Mainstream (BMW,Toyota), or Diluted Mainstream (GM, Ford)

 

Subaru...THE POWER IS YOURS!

 

*just examples of each type

[Drakuun]

I think it's pretty simple..

 

Outback gained Subaru it's foothold in the US market.

Without it, I wonder if they would have ever made it over here at all.

I think it's pretty safe to say that the outback was their big break through.

I think their continued loyalty to the OB and their addition of the B9 go hand in hand.

 

Most OB owners got into one to avoid having to get a Mini-Van.

Most OB owners get out of them because they aren't big enough.

If you could offer those buyers an alternative within your own stable (B9) You'd do that. Non OB Legacys & Imprezas (even for their popularity) aren't the vehicles that gave Suby it's market share over here..they are doing more to help keep a strong market share as the aging demographic that owns and buys OB/SUV are of course dwindling. Maybe after the OB market wanes and it even outs they'll start marketing more to us legacy/Impreza owners.

 

I hope so..

 

But I can't really at this point fault Suby for remaining loyal to the brand that got them what they have today over here. They'll eventually see that we (Legacy/Impreza owners) are capable if not more ready to support their market over here.

 

That and, all god things are worth waiting for.

[iyamdman]

I don't agree on a couple of points:

 

1) The older demographic that is targeted for the OB, is not getting smaller - it is getting bigger.

 

2) Subi was and established brand in America long before the OB, which is based off of the Leg and Impreza. I do agree, that it was a big hit for Subi, but not the first.

 

I do agree that the OB and B9 go hand in hand.

 

OB has a much larger population/land area then the Leg, which seems to do best in western and souther states.

 

Most of the USA population live east of the Miss River - and that is where most OB are sold. Thanks to winter.

 

I once had winter...

 

Legs will always be around, it means too much to Subi - but don't look for the same options/choices that the OB's will have - for 1 reason: the production runs of the OB are larger.

 

This isn't to say SOA's marketing vision and competence is lacking. Think of a frightened and confussed blind dog in a glass shop, and you get SOA's situation in the USA market.

[Drakuun]

I don't agree on a couple of points:

 

1) The older demographic that is targeted for the OB, is not getting smaller - it is getting bigger.

 

Then why is there all this talk in our economy about all the baby boomers (40-60) retireing and there aren't enough next geners 25-45 to fill those jobs.. The segment is getting smaller for the OB I think, I agree though that the 25-45 segment is gaining, but I doubt it will be as large ever as the baby boomer generation was.

So at the very least, Suby restructures it's target demographic. I'm not saying that OB's will remain as popular, I think legacys will gain ground as new buyers don't want what their parents owned. SO we get Legacys instead. Good for us!

 

2) Subi was and established brand in America long before the OB, which is based off of the Leg and Impreza. I do agree, that it was a big hit for Subi, but not the first.

 

Didn't say OB was "first" I said it gave Suby it's foothold in the American market. Justy's and Brats weren't huge sellers compared to their American counterparts at the time. OB was the first Suby that made it into mainstream america's garage.

 

 

Legs will always be around, it means too much to Subi - but don't look for the same options/choices that the OB's will have - for 1 reason: the production runs of the OB are larger.

 

This isn't to say SOA's marketing vision and competence is lacking. Think of a frightened and confussed blind dog in a glass shop, and you get SOA's situation in the USA market.

 

Yeah totaly agree there. Hopefully they can reshape their market.

[jda]

One thing I dont understand, how come Canadian still get manual transmission LGT wagon?

And the most ironic part is that the car is made in Indiana

[jda]

'cause we all live in igloos and need something to keep us happy...

 

I didn't believe you at first because I thought we were losing it too, but one check on the Subaru.ca site shows its available!

 

Yeah when the dealer told me in august that mt gt waon will be available in 06 I thought he was bsing me.

[shiggins]

I pretty much find Subaru's current marketing strategy a complete failure. Since I've told people I have a LGT on order or even since I've owned it and told people what I got, they all look at me with this blank stare when I tell them I bought a new Subaru Legacy GT. Some think I got a lesbian car, some think of an Outback, but absolutely no one has ever said, "Woa! That's a cool sports sedan." I'll bet 95% of them don't even recognize the car. Granted, I really couldn't care less about what people think of my car (my previous car is a Futura Yellow GTI which has been referred to as mustard or baby poop yellow and roundly disliked by 50% of all people I know and loved by the other 50%).

 

It just amazes me that I have yet to meet one single person who even has the slightest knowledge of the car I own when I speak of it. I love it because I have a super unique sleeper. But if I were Subaru, I'd be terrified of the image and lack of knowledge about the cars I have to offer. I live in Minnesota, where all wheel drive should be an amazing selling point, yet I see a billion rear wheel drive G35s to every one LGT on the road (I've only seen 3 LGTs and probably 5 to 10 Legacys on the road ever). Subaru needs to fire all their marketing idiots and start a new campaign. How can you not sell a ton of cars that perform as well as the LGT for the price they charge......especially up here in snow land? Sure, they sell tons of Outbacks and Foresters, but you can't tell me that they aren't screwing up in the marketing of the LGT.

 

Oh well, just goes to prove what I thought of all the people that went into marketing when I was in college.

 

At least I know what kind of good deal I got. What do I care if Subaru continues to fook it all up?

 

Edited for spelling errors

[mkaresh]

The 5MT is still available in the LGT wagon in Canada?! Now I'm even more confused. That certainly tosses the volume justification out the window.

[jda]

The 5MT is still available in the LGT wagon in Canada?! Now I'm even more confused. That certainly tosses the volume justification out the window.

Yeah it's still available in Canada.

If you go to subaru.ca you will see the 06 lgt wagon comes with either 5mt or 5et.

[mkaresh]

I believe you guys. I just never would have guessed it. This just makes no sense whatsoever.

[iyamdman]

I believe you guys. I just never would have guessed it. This just makes no sense whatsoever.

 

+1000!!!!

 

SOA = Stupid On America

[iyamdman]

Then why is there all this talk in our economy about all the baby boomers (40-60) retireing and there aren't enough next geners 25-45 to fill those jobs.. The segment is getting smaller for the OB I think, I agree though that the 25-45 segment is gaining, but I doubt it will be as large ever as the baby boomer generation was.

So at the very least, Suby restructures it's target demographic. I'm not saying that OB's will remain as popular, I think legacys will gain ground as new buyers don't want what their parents owned. SO we get Legacys instead. Good for us!

 

Well, if you look at the baby boomer demographic curve, you will see that the majority are at the +50 end.

 

The Leg target demographic is 27-50, which mean the actual boomer targets are not as large as the 25-40 segment, and most of that segment will provide a actual target segment increase for the next 10 years.

 

Beyond that, it is useless to predict anything due to the economic upheavals in the auto market that will be occuring as a result of the dramatic decline in global oil production.

 

You are right in that if Subi wants to grow the Leg market and increase sales, they would actually have to do something...uh...well...intelligent.

[mkaresh]

You are right in that if Subi wants to grow the Leg market and increase sales, they would actually have to do something...uh...well...intelligent.

 

Would putting the car in your avatar into production qualify? It would certainly make the LGT wagon more noticeable.

[mmarton]

Just 2 cents from a non-GT owner pocking his head out....I wish my 2005 i L had a five-speed auto rather than the four-speed. I don't understand why they wouldn't include this on a car that's more about efficiency than performance. For years, I maintained that it was useless to drive any four-cylinder car with an auto, but living in Atlanta made me switch after driving nothing but manual since my first car. The traffic here really stinks.

 

As an aside, virtually everyone here buys the OB (as I've posted before) to grab some of the "tough and rugged" image and virtually none of them go off road. From observations over the years, there are probably more SUVs and trucks in this area than snow belt areas. That's a laugh because winter driving is only an issue one or two days a year and that usually involves ice. When we get ice, the biggest, baddest SUV in the world won't help.

[pdw]

I pretty much find Subaru's current marketing strategy a complete failure. Since I've told people I have a LGT on order or even since I've owned it and told people what I got, they all look at me with this blank stare when I tell them I bought a new Subaru Legacy GT. Some think I got a lesbian car, some think of an Outback, but absolutely no one has ever said, "Woa! That's a cool sports sedan." I'll bet 95% of them don't even recognize the car. Granted, I really couldn't care less about what people think of my car (my previous car is a Futura Yellow GTI which has been referred to as mustard or baby poop yellow and roundly disliked by 50% of all people I know and loved by the other 50%).

 

It just amazes me that I have yet to meet one single person who even has the slightest knowledge of the car I own when I speak of it. I love it because I have a super unique sleeper. But if I were Subaru, I'd be terrified of the image and lack of knowledge about the cars I have to offer. I live in Minnesota, where all wheel drive should be an amazing selling point, yet I see a billion rear wheel drive G35s to every one LGT on the road (I've only seen 3 LGTs and probably 5 to 10 Legacys on the road ever). Subaru needs to fire all their marketing idiots and start a new campaign. How can you not sell a ton of cars that perform as well as the LGT for the price they charge......especially up here in snow land? Sure, they sell tons of Outbacks and Foresters, but you can't tell me that they aren't screwing up in the marketing of the LGT.

 

Oh well, just goes to prove what I thought of all the people that went into marketing when I was in college.

 

At least I know what kind of good deal I got. What do I care if Subaru continues to fook it all up?

 

Edited for spelling errors

 

Heh. Ironically, the only people I've talked to who get what the LGT is are the current and former Audi owners on another board I hang out on. They all think it's a great car. I also have a few other friends who are into cars and they know what the LGT is. If any other usual person looks at the car they all say "wow, this is a Subaru? It's nice".

[Guest *Jedimaster*]

Subaru just realizes how serious Outback owners are about performance.

 

/thread.

[PGT]

if only Subaru would inform the aftermarket performance companies as well, all would be right with the world.

[iyamdman]

Would putting the car in your avatar into production qualify? It would certainly make the LGT wagon more noticeable.

 

Ya Mon!!!

[Guest *Jedimaster*]

if only Subaru would inform the aftermarket performance companies as well, all would be right with the world.

Touche!

[Drakuun]

I hope Suby can retain loyalty with our generation, (they got me for life I can tell you) and also are able to appeal over Honda and Toyota to gain new followers. But I don't think it'll be on the Back of the OB like it was 10 years ago, and it certainly won't be with the B9 either, they obviously need to shift their marketing to appeal to our new generation. Stiffing Legacy owners isn't a good way to start either in my opinion.