Gelacy Posted February 9, 2014 Share Posted February 9, 2014 Um, the DCT is a computer controller manual. I didn't say anything related to say those being slower than a traditional MT. Computer controlled manual is the same as a non-manual which is an automatic by any "enthusiast" standards. If you can't row your own gears like with a "true manual" then every enthusiasts scoffs saying it's an automatic which is clear from the OP's lack of a single brain cell. Or from his huge ego he likes to stroke because he can coordinate his left foot and right hand. Oh damn, such a big boy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dgoodhue Posted February 9, 2014 Share Posted February 9, 2014 I would argue that someone is not a true enthusiasts if they don't know the difference between an automatic transmission and computer controlled mt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gelacy Posted February 9, 2014 Share Posted February 9, 2014 I would argue that someone is not a true enthusiasts if they don't know the difference between an automatic transmission and computer controlled mt. I'm glad either way honestly. Most enthusiasts appear to be someone who lacks a brain like the OP. All he can do is QQ about manuals going away and then come back with a dumbass remark like "is Subaru on drugs?" Funny how Canada gets the manual option though, lololol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StoplightAssassin Posted February 9, 2014 Share Posted February 9, 2014 Honestly anyone who is retarded enough to believe all CVT's are the same seriously needs to go back to grade school and learn the scientific method. Basing opinions on CVT's from a completely different manufacturer to another is the logic of a dumbass first of all. I'm glad either way honestly. Most enthusiasts appear to be someone who lacks a brain like the OP. All he can do is QQ about manuals going away and then come back with a dumbass remark like "is Subaru on drugs?" So someone isn't drinking the Subaru CVT Kool-Aid and you attack them personally? That's horseshit. Go back to your bridge SOA Troll. And CVTs can SMD. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alegend90 Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 I'm glad either way honestly. Most enthusiasts appear to be someone who lacks a brain like the OP. All he can do is QQ about manuals going away and then come back with a dumbass remark like "is Subaru on drugs?" Funny how Canada gets the manual option though, lololol. strong statement Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GEE-OTTO Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 Manuals represent the purest form of spirited automotive enjoyment. Period, yes a DSG is faster than a 6MT and yes a CVT keeps the underpowered FB25 in the "powerband" but dammit folks want options. MT lowers production cost, lowers trim cost for those buyers looking to come to the brand that maybe like MTs. CVT only does two things: 1. Brings in the "typical" mid-size car buyer 2. Pushes away the "typical" sport oriented mid-size car buyer If does No.1 much better. While I am disgusted and will never buy a newer Legacy at this point, I could see myself in a WRX oddly. At this point I think im going to buy a either a 14' 6MT 2.5i keep my LGT and slowly forget about Subaru until the models I care about (Legacy and OB) regain a little "sportiness". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gelacy Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 Manuals represent the purest form of spirited automotive enjoyment. Period, yes a DSG is faster than a 6MT and yes a CVT keeps the underpowered FB25 in the "powerband" but dammit folks want options. MT lowers production cost, lowers trim cost for those buyers looking to come to the brand that maybe like MTs. CVT only does two things: 1. Brings in the "typical" mid-size car buyer 2. Pushes away the "typical" sport oriented mid-size car buyer If does No.1 much better. While I am disgusted and will never buy a newer Legacy at this point, I could see myself in a WRX oddly. At this point I think im going to buy a either a 14' 6MT 2.5i keep my LGT and slowly forget about Subaru until the models I care about (Legacy and OB) regain a little "sportiness". I'm pretty sure that "lower production cost" means nothing if dealers have a harder time (or are scared to death to even order manuals) selling less expensive models with manual transmissions compared to CVT equipped models they receive in bulk. You're incorrect either way. CVT's have and will do more than just that. You're mistaken if you think manuals paved the way for Subaru at all. Your mindset is about 5 decades old. People who bought "non-sportiness" vehicles from Subaru are what made the GT and XT trims possible. That should be apparent to anyone who realized a long time ago manuals were not going to last for much longer in Subaru's lineup when they offered even a 4EAT in the Impreza GT line. The Forester XT has had an automatic option for the longest time even though it was a 4EAT too. People still bought it even WITH the 4EAT. That told Subaru a LOT by the standards of today. It should not have been a surprised to anyone they dropped the manual transmission from the Forester XT with the third generation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrueWhiteBoy Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 Curious to see what they're going to go with for the Legacy GT, if it'll be only manual or be offered in both. Even within Subaru itself I've heard the CVT being great and horrible depending on the car that it was in. I've now heard 2 personal accounts on the FXT being great and 2 personal accounts of the base Impreza w/ CVT being terrible. To be honest, I don't think I've encountered a large, manual family sedan in nearly 10 years out here (a few 2 door Accords back in the 98-2002 range I think) other than the Legacy and even then most of the base models were automatics. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Perscitus Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 Yep, agreed. In my test driving experience: FXT + HTCVT = v good XV(Crosstrek) + CVT = horrible (Mazda CX5 was much better) base Impreza + CVT = horrible (but Nissan Sentra and Juke were worse!) A lot of this had to do with a. chassis, engine and transmission combination (curb weight vs torque curve vs CVT) b. TCU/TCM programming (simulated-manual and full-auto mode) I wouldn't be surprised if below came out like this: base Legacy + CVT = not bad Legacy 3.6R + HTCVT = good Legacy FA20DIT + HTCVT = v good WRX FA20DIT + HTCVT = v good Can someone with a a 2.5i and CVT comment please? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GEE-OTTO Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 I'm pretty sure that "lower production cost" means nothing if dealers have a harder time (or are scared to death to even order manuals) selling less expensive models with manual transmissions compared to CVT equipped models they receive in bulk. You're incorrect either way. CVT's have and will do more than just that. You're mistaken if you think manuals paved the way for Subaru at all. Your mindset is about 5 decades old. People who bought "non-sportiness" vehicles from Subaru are what made the GT and XT trims possible. That should be apparent to anyone who realized a long time ago manuals were not going to last for much longer in Subaru's lineup when they offered even a 4EAT in the Impreza GT line. The Forester XT has had an automatic option for the longest time even though it was a 4EAT too. People still bought it even WITH the 4EAT. That told Subaru a LOT by the standards of today. It should not have been a surprised to anyone they dropped the manual transmission from the Forester XT with the third generation. You missed the entire point of my post and that is: the option of MT should be present. People bought/buy Subarus for a myriad of reason but some, enthusiasts, buy them for DRIVING ENJOYMENT! Their involvement in World Rally/Motorsports isn't to promote CVTs and slushbox 4EATS its to show potential buyers that they make a car that they could possibly own and drive in such a manner e.g. WRX/STi,. Yes they need a vanilla model that fits the needs of a diverse consumer base, but MT as a option hurts none. That is the point all this nonsense of 4EATs and why MTs are a 50 year old ideas are bull. Canada got the 6MT for the 2015, EUR, AUS/JDM will as well. If anything you could say, the point I've preached since the rumors started, that American drivers don't want the MT but not the brand as a whole. My last hope is fading as Porsche is hinting at phasing out MT's across the lineup in favor of faster, DSG setups. A Porshce is a performance model, so they can't be compared but their reason for DSG and SOA reason for CVT are much different. There is still a 7MT 911 out there with my name on it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hanger Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 My 2013 2.5i with CVT feels FAST comparing to my slow 2005 2.5i with 4EAT... ○ ○ ○ Instagram: itshangertime :spin: ○ ○ ○ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gelacy Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 You missed the entire point of my post and that is: the option of MT should be present. People bought/buy Subarus for a myriad of reason but some, enthusiasts, buy them for DRIVING ENJOYMENT! No, you're the one who missed the entire point of my post. If anything my first statement addresses your post you just posted. Honestly, if you're an enthusiast, step up to the plate with the money where your mouth is and buy one. Canada is going to sell one with a manual. Otherwise if you can't then you really aren't a "true" enthusiast by your own logic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrueWhiteBoy Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 You missed the entire point of my post and that is: the option of MT should be present. People bought/buy Subarus for a myriad of reason but some, enthusiasts, buy them for DRIVING ENJOYMENT! Should is a hard argument to make though. 1. The number of manual sales for base models has been decreasing (Note: this is based on my shitty memory of figures from this site over the year), so from a sales point of view, it doesn't seem to make as much sense 2. They get worse gas mileage which is an important issue for base models. I guess they figure enthusiasts will go with the performance version of the car. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GEE-OTTO Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 No, you're the one who missed the entire point of my post. If anything my first statement addresses your post you just posted. Honestly, if you're an enthusiast, step up to the plate with the money where your mouth is and buy one. Canada is going to sell one with a manual. Otherwise if you can't then you really aren't a "true" enthusiast by your own logic. Ive bought three Subarus' to date, all have or will be modified for better handling, more power and to my feel as a driver. Don't talk to me about your definition of "enthusiast" esp if that means simply buying a new Subaru model to be that guy/girl that has the shiny new sheet metal. I'm not here to piss with you about meaningless aspects of Subaru desire or ownership. The lack of the MT as an OPTION is disheartening so some perspective buyers, that is all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StoplightAssassin Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 Ive bought three Subarus' to date, all have or will be modified for better handling, more power and to my feel as a driver. Don't talk to me about your definition of "enthusiast" esp if that means simply buying a new Subaru model to be that guy/girl that has the shiny new sheet metal. I'm not here to piss with you about meaningless aspects of Subaru desire or ownership. The lack of the MT as an OPTION is disheartening so some perspective buyers, that is all. It's not even worth arguing with her. I'm all but convinced she's paid by Subaru to come on the forums to sell her Subaru CVT Kool-Aid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GEE-OTTO Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 It's not even worth arguing with her. I'm all but convinced she's paid by Subaru to come on the forums to sell her Subaru CVT Kool-Aid. Oh so I'm not crazy Yeah I never bashed the CVT, I actually like it, I test drove a FXT with the CVT great ride. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SubieDriver Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 While I haven't yet driven the new FXT w/ HTCVT, I have driven most of the other Subaru CVTs and they are definitely programmed better than the Nissan CVT I drove in an '09 Murano. I vote two thumbs up on Subaru's CVT implementation over any others. People have to actually drive it to understand the difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wankey Posted February 11, 2014 Share Posted February 11, 2014 Can someone with a a 2.5i and CVT comment please? I have a 2.5i CVT, once it's warmed up it's very nifty and capable. I even gave my friend whip lash through accelerating. One thing I don't get - the '14 forrester 2.5i CVT feels 10000x more responsive and quicker than my '13 legacy CVT. Same engine, same CVT I want to know if I can flash or upgrade the software or something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gelacy Posted February 11, 2014 Share Posted February 11, 2014 Ive bought three Subarus' to date, all have or will be modified for better handling, more power and to my feel as a driver. Don't talk to me about your definition of "enthusiast" esp if that means simply buying a new Subaru model to be that guy/girl that has the shiny new sheet metal. I already did. Lol, just lol. The last part of your first statement is considered to be enthusiast but quantity is not the same as quality. Someone can be an enthusiast and only have one Subaru. It's nice to know you consider yourself an enthusiast but you can't be assed to buy a manual from Canada yet you bitch like no tomorrow because there is no manual for the USDM. If you don't want it enough then you really aren't an "enthusiast" anymore. Ever heard of being "enthusiastic" about something? If you couldn't care less even though a manual transmission is offered that's self-explanatory. I'm not here to piss with you about meaningless aspects of Subaru desire or ownership. The lack of the MT as an OPTION is disheartening so some perspective buyers, that is all. Too late, you already did. Funny how that works out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GEE-OTTO Posted February 11, 2014 Share Posted February 11, 2014 Ill just give up on what ever thing you are trying to argue, Stoplight was right, I thought he/she was joking. One thing I don't get - the '14 forrester 2.5i CVT feels 10000x more responsive and quicker than my '13 legacy CVT. Same engine, same CVT I want to know if I can flash or upgrade the software or something. You would think it was the other way around since the fozzy has a smaller engine 2.0L versus the FB25 of the Legacy for those years. As far as flashing the TCU I think they alter the physical characteristics to achieve a desired level of performance. As they states "friction materials" but they also program the steps for the manual mode so you never know what could be possible. Subaru CVTs and they are definitely programmed better than the Nissan CVT I drove in an '09 Murano. Agree 100% had a 11 Altima rental for a week on work travel in NorCal area, driving that thing made me numb on CVTs then I tested a 13' 2.5i and a 14' FXT it got better in that order. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
laufu Posted February 11, 2014 Share Posted February 11, 2014 Ill just give up on what ever thing you are trying to argue, Stoplight was right, I thought he/she was joking. You would think it was the other way around since the fozzy has a smaller engine 2.0L versus the FB25 of the Legacy for those years. Foresters sold in the US have the 2.5 FB while the Forester XT comes with a 2.0 FA DIT. Maybe you are thinking of the XV Crosstrek, that has the 2.0. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrueWhiteBoy Posted February 11, 2014 Share Posted February 11, 2014 Is the 2.0 newer? Perhaps there are newer computer monitors/sensors that are able to relay more information back to the transmission allowing it to adjust better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StoplightAssassin Posted February 11, 2014 Share Posted February 11, 2014 Ill just give up on what ever thing you are trying to argue, Stoplight was right, I thought he/she was joking. he! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EvilCamaroSS Posted February 12, 2014 Share Posted February 12, 2014 I'm kinda worried that a CVT cannot handle my aggressive driving style, which would be lots of downshifts, to weave in and out of slow moving traffic in the left lane, and frequent fast take-offs from lights to make it through the next one before it too turns red. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ehsnils Posted February 12, 2014 Share Posted February 12, 2014 I'm kinda worried that a CVT cannot handle my aggressive driving style, which would be lots of downshifts, to weave in and out of slow moving traffic in the left lane, and frequent fast take-offs from lights to make it through the next one before it too turns red. So far my CVT has held up to that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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