BAC5.2 Posted February 18, 2013 Share Posted February 18, 2013 Front camber should be negative, not positive. You can't change camber without changing toe dramatically. Caster is designed to be different side-to-side. Don't worry about that. [URL="http://legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php/proper-flip-key-interesti-159894.html"]Flip Key Development Thread[/URL] "Genius may have its limitations, but stupidity is not thus handicapped." - E. Hubbard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ssbtech Posted February 18, 2013 Share Posted February 18, 2013 FWIW, my Front camber is -0.7* on both sides, toe is 0.00* and caster is 5.6 on the left and 5.3 on the right. I know it's fine to run the car without a roll center kit, but what improvements will it make once I get the HD/Pinks/Spacer combination on? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Impatient Posted February 18, 2013 Author Share Posted February 18, 2013 Hey BAC, just to be "worthy", I am looking for an alternative to my front springs, although I am having no issue...at the moment. Except suspicion about the "alignment" shop. Your advice (and others re negative camber) is why I was am reasonably happy with zero camber; it's the "in spec" positive camber I fret over...and the camber "split": +0.7 vs 0.0. I still have this crazy notion that this guy in New Zealand will sell me his BTS springs he has listed "down under." Of course, my luck, they will be softer than OB springs. TradeMe.co has him all bottled up, and I can't register, email nor bid. MAYBE he has an email from me via an LGT member in NZ. Until I quit horsing around with different options, I don't want to get this professionally re-aligned at a premium. SSB: glad I could get you and BAC together . HD/Pinks/and spacers is probably lower than mine. Not knowing enough about RC kits, I can't imagine being 0.75- 1.25 lower than stock OB requires a RC kit. Am I wrong? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ssbtech Posted February 18, 2013 Share Posted February 18, 2013 No clue. I know about as much about suspension as I do about rocket science. Which is to say not much Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scoobyscoodle Posted February 19, 2013 Share Posted February 19, 2013 You should max out the front camber bolts on both sides, that should get you right around -1 or so, that's gonna be much better than 0.0, or a cross camber of -0.7 (which should be 0). You could get a roll center kit, you may see some benefits with turn in response, and will likely feel that the steering is more stable over rough, rutted road. Once you're lowering it over an inch the rc kit helps, beyond 1.5" or so I would definitely recommend it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Impatient Posted February 20, 2013 Author Share Posted February 20, 2013 Sorry, just need to be sure: in front, if I move only the front (upper) camber bolts, have I screwed up the toe?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scoobyscoodle Posted February 20, 2013 Share Posted February 20, 2013 Yes, if you change the indexing of that bolt at all, you need a new alignment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ktmrider Posted February 21, 2013 Share Posted February 21, 2013 Sorry, just need to be sure: in front, if I move only the front (upper) camber bolts, have I screwed up the toe??Not toe, it affects camber. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scoobyscoodle Posted February 21, 2013 Share Posted February 21, 2013 When you change camber, you inadvertently change toe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Impatient Posted February 22, 2013 Author Share Posted February 22, 2013 So if adjusting the FRONT camber bolt changes toe, it would follow that adjusting the front toe would affect camber. So no use to arguing that they just didn't bother with the camber (after alignment, FRONT camber virtually unchanged, toe substantially improved...toe went from -.21 each side to +.02 & +.04...meanwhile L front camber went from +0.6 to +0.7 & R camber was unchanged at 0.0). There are no SAI or Included Angle measurements shown. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scoobyscoodle Posted February 25, 2013 Share Posted February 25, 2013 A change in the camber angle effects toe more than a change in toe makes to camber, so the numbers you just mentioned seem usual if they just ignored camber and set the toe. If I were you I would just max out the front camber bolts as negative as they go then have them set toe in the front to around -1/32. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Impatient Posted March 2, 2013 Author Share Posted March 2, 2013 I wonder, would something like this work with rear Bilstein HD's instead of butt spacers?. Wouldn't that allow longer springs? http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/199/shockextension.jpg/ From: http://subaruxt.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=138146#p138375 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ktmrider Posted April 7, 2013 Share Posted April 7, 2013 In Japan again, went to my favorite UPGarage location in Kasukabe that specializes in Scooby stuff. They had THREE BTS kits! Wait for it tho none were 5056J so no ruck OB folks sorry. Pics below. The first two are easy ( BM/BR, BP/BL ) but not sure what the last one fits ( 5033 ). Good prices and much better exchange rates right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ladtig87 Posted April 7, 2013 Share Posted April 7, 2013 I had a decent 2001 outback and upgraded to the spec.B for the Bilstein shocks among other things. What a difference they make! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Impatient Posted April 7, 2013 Author Share Posted April 7, 2013 I'm sure someone would love those 5081's for latest Legacies (and some OB owner is bound to want to lower his 2010-2013 OB), and the 5026's for 04-08 Legacy. My guess (and just a guess) is the 5033's are for a 00-04 (or 99-03) Legacy....or maybe Baja???....which of course could be made to work with our Outbacks. The 5026 rear spring looks beefier (or more winds) than your & my rear 5056's, don't they? (I got the springs, but haven't put them on) Are you trying to cram these into your carry-on?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ktmrider Posted April 8, 2013 Share Posted April 8, 2013 Are you trying to cram these into your carry-on?? LOL I have one bag "credit" ( two free, only brought one ) so if the total weight was under 50# it's golden! Downside I have to lug it across three trains/subways and up 5 escalators to get to Narita check-in..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ssbtech Posted May 17, 2013 Share Posted May 17, 2013 Are the rear "shock mounts" and "rubber spring seats" transplantable from the stock suspension to the Bilsteins? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danteneon Posted May 17, 2013 Share Posted May 17, 2013 On the rear, yes. I like to cook my pets and my family. Use commas. Don't be a psycho. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ssbtech Posted May 17, 2013 Share Posted May 17, 2013 Front upper spring perch can be re-used too, correct? Obviously the top-hats need to be specific to the Bilsteins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Impatient Posted May 18, 2013 Author Share Posted May 18, 2013 In front, yes, HD & spec B for 3rd gen at least (or equiv 4G Legacy). Also, Yes, to the perches question....compatible, but must match the generation of the springs. 04 springs have more "domed" upper perches, newer are more "flattened." For <04 generation, I think the Bilstein struts use the same tophat as KYB's (has different bolt pattern to mount to fender) I've never heard of a spec B tophat or equiv for 00-04. Which begs the qestion: could you use 00-04 Bilstein HD front struts on a 05-09 with USDM tophats? Probably so. Not sure what else might be different In back, I think all compatible (within my experience with ~2000-2009 except no comment on self-leveling stuff). There are some different rear tophats available for ADM. Again match the springs to the upper mount they were designed for, but the struts shouldn't care. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ssbtech Posted May 18, 2013 Share Posted May 18, 2013 So 05 OBXT USDM front upper spring perch will work with 05 JDM Pinks? I've also got a question in my "Megan upgrade" thread regarding spring selection. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Impatient Posted May 21, 2013 Author Share Posted May 21, 2013 Mister BAC, This is probably buried in a thread here somewhere, but what is the hub-to-fender measurement on your OBXT?....before you let it go....assuming its not gone...for posterity. And what components (in your case) provided that height: I think you have Pinks (manual trans? wagon?) Bilstein HD's some spacers (how thick / front / rear?) Was there ever something (with the HD's) that you had for awhile that didn't drop it quite as much? And related: what sways did you have, and any Roll center kit or special bushings, aluminum control arms, or extra camber-tweaking stuff? For posterity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhitter Posted May 22, 2013 Share Posted May 22, 2013 Hey Impatient, I figured I would join in with my information: I have Bilstein HD with JDM wagon specific (JDM spec-b maybe) springs (that I bought a couple years ago from BAC). I have a .75 spacer in the front and a 1.5 inch spacer in the rear. The set-up has been on for a year and a half and about 25k miles. Front 15 inches, Rear 15.5 inches. My OBXT build Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BAC5.2 Posted May 22, 2013 Share Posted May 22, 2013 My car, and I'll see if I can double check today, is right around 15.25" front and 16" rear, or thereabouts. I ultimately ended up with Pinks (two orange dots), with Spec-B top hats and my spacers. Part numbers on the springs are: ST2033021010 (Legacy 2.0 Wagon 5MT front springs) ST2038021010 (Legacy Wagon Rear - Non Spec-B) I had the springs I sold to OB2.5XT. Those were JDM Rev C. Spec-B Wagon springs. I liked them, but I wanted something a little different to better match the HD valving. The Pinks were lower than the springs I sold OB2.5XT, but I designed my spacers around the Pinks. I also had the RaceComp front bump stops. Finally, I did have the whole slew of front end bushings from Whiteline (F/R LCA's, the RCK, the steering rack bushings), as well as the KCA399 rear camber bushings. I had Kartboy endlinks front and rear, with the Hotchkis 25mm-F/22mm-R swaybars from Infamous (with blue AVO brackets). I think that was most of my suspension parts, though I might be missing something. I did, of course, also have F/R Brembos. Overall, I have never enjoyed how well a car handled or rode as I did the recent revision of my Outback. I'll miss it, for sure. [URL="http://legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php/proper-flip-key-interesti-159894.html"]Flip Key Development Thread[/URL] "Genius may have its limitations, but stupidity is not thus handicapped." - E. Hubbard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ssbtech Posted May 22, 2013 Share Posted May 22, 2013 Thanks for the pinks part numbers! I'm guessing the last 4 digits somehow relates to the spring rate? I see there are 1000, 1010, 1020, etc... I'll order those from Japanparts tomorrow. Their price and shipping seem good. Any ideas on what you're going to replace the car with? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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