Bikes

[dr_sharp]

I just finished a basic riders course this weekend and am going to take the official test this week. Now I'm torn between a 250cc and 500c sport bike. I'd love to get some input from some forum members. I've heard both recommendations from friends and still can't make up my mind. I have no experience other than the 2-day course I took this past weekend but I plan to spend alot of time in the neighborhood before I take it out on the streets. I will not ride at night, in the rain, or in rush hour traffic. My only plans for the bike will be to drive a few hours west of the city on Sat. and Sun. mornings to enjoy "hill country."

 

Any input is appreciated.

 

Thanks

[ehsnils]

"Hill Country" will in my eyes mean that you would very soon appreciate the larger engine.

 

250cc is good for commuting - especially in rush hour conditions where a small light bike is a lot easier to handle but for countryside roads a 500-800cc bike would be nicer.

 

I just realized that I really miss the XT500 I had...

[IwannaSportSedan]

500-700ccs should be fine. Especially if it is a 2-cylinder with more torque, and less outright horsepower.

 

A bike like that won't be too intimidating, but will be something you won't outgrow so soon.

 

See if maybe you can find an SV650 or SV650S. a used 600-700cc base Ducati Monster is probably not too far off, either. Kawasaki had a 500cc parallel twin engine mini-ninja sport bike for a while, as well.

 

I'd probably get some miles before trying a full-on 600cc inline 4cylinder sport bike, though. They are more of an RPM light-switch. No revs, no power. High revs, LOTS of power for their size and weight.

[Irimis]

Like the guys above, 2 cyl 500-750 is your best bet, used of course. I spent a year riding a 500 v-twin beater bike my friend had before getting my F4I.

 

How big of a guy are you? If your 6' 200+lbs a 250 is going to feel sluggish and you will want something bigger after a while. If your like me and 5'7" and 155 wet then a 250 is not to bad. My x-girlfriend had a 250 and I would drive it once in a while to work cause it got 75 mpg and it was fun. So easy to toss it back and forth.

 

What you need to think about is will this bike just be a stepping bike to something more serious. If your goal is a 4cly sport bike, then just grab a cheap beater bike for a season. If you just like to cruise and relax then a 500-750 v-twin is perfect.

[05_Silver_GT]

I don't ride a street bike, i have a cruiser, which i understand is completely different. But i just wanted to say, i bought a 750 and within the first 2 months i was wanting to go bigger. It's just nice to have more power if you need it.

[sactojesse]

See if maybe you can find an SV650 or SV650S. a used 600-700cc base Ducati Monster is probably not too far off, either. Kawasaki had a 500cc parallel twin engine mini-ninja sport bike for a while, as well.

Agreed. All good choices, but the SV650 will be the best bang for the buck. The SV650 is lighter, less expensive, and makes more hp than the Monster 750 and way more hp than the EX500. IMO, SV650 is a starter bike that you likely won't outgrow.

[IwannaSportSedan]

I don't ride a street bike, i have a cruiser, which i understand is completely different. But i just wanted to say, i bought a 750 and within the first 2 months i was wanting to go bigger. It's just nice to have more power if you need it.

 

A cruiser is heavy, and their engines tend to be down on power, and older designs. But people like them for their torque, and their style, more than their outright performance, usually.

 

A 750 cruiser, or an old 750 standard-type bike may only have 50 horsepower, and a cruiser probably weighs most of 600lbs. An old steel-frame standard is probably not much lighter. Newer aluminum framed bikes with more efficient engines tend to improve on that.

 

Conversely, an SV650 or the like is probably ~80 horsepower, but tractable and not abrupt like a 100hp inline 4 600cc, which makes a lot of difference to someone learning vehicle control.

 

The SV650 is also probably about 400lbs, rather than heavier like a cruiser, but more comfortable than a torture-rack 380lb 600 supersport.

 

Horsepower level makes a difference, but it is just a part of the equation.

 

A cruiser is easy, smooth, and some find it stylish. But they also tend to be heavy, and have less horsepower than their engine displacement might indicate.

 

A super-sport is lightning quick, but not necessarily forgiving. Feather light, and quite powerful, even with 600cc engines. A scalpel, but you can cut yourself with it, too.

 

A sport standard is lighter, a bit more powerful than a cruiser, and a bit simpler and much more forgiving than a supersport.

 

A good standard or sport standard bike strikes a very good medium for a beginner to decide if you want to go to an intermediate or advanced 1000cc sport standard, a sportier race-replica supersport, a longer-distance sport tourer or touring bike, or a chrome-gleaming hot-rod cruiser, or even a versatile adventure dual-purpose bike for on or off-road use.

 

Although some would probably suggest that if you want to ride off-road, a cheap dirt bike and some dirt riding experience on loose surface is a bit different skill set than riding on pavement. The controls on the bike are largely the same, though.

 

Learn how to ride on a versatile bike that you won't outgrow in a week or a single riding season (unless it is a free or VERY cheap bike that you don't mind passing off later. Money is money, and bikes cost a little bit. No sense spending thousands only to turn around and do it again.)

 

Once you know how to ride *a* bike... you'll know more about what you like to do with *the* bike you find that you'll really want. You can start to honestly answer what sort of specialized bike you will really get more out of.

 

I started on a 200cc two-stroke $100 bike. A chain-saw on wheels. I was young, broke, and had more guts than brains... that bike was some fun, but it was almost too slow, and borderline dangerous in traffic.

 

My second bike, which I still have... and is for sale, if someone is interested... (PM me...)

 

is a 1989 Honda Hawk GT, which is a 650cc V-twin that looks great, and is very easy to ride, but quite fun, and isn't a big bike, but is good enough not to be outgrown easily.

 

I haven't had the time to ride much in the last few years, and haven't logged many miles. If I start up again, I think I am ready for a bigger size bike, and a nice 1200cc smooth boxer-twin BMW, like the R1200R, or R1200S, or maybe an SV1000S (same as SV650 type, but 1000cc v-twin, of course) as I like the sport-standard type bikes.

[05GT Guru]

If you are looking for just a nice reliable easy to handle power it is really hard to beat a sv650. Not to mention the claimed 72hp of the sv650 is hard to outgrow in less than 2 seasons. I started on a 01 cbr600f4i, great bike imo, reliable, more relaxed seating than the newer sportbikes and the power curve was pretty easy to handle but not as easy or smooth as the sv650. I have ridden a ninja 250r and its pretty weak. I would say after a month or two of riding you would want something bigger even if you dont crave speed.

 

If i were you i might pick up an older 250r for 1,000 bucks and ride that around until your bored with it. Or just go with something that is easy to handle(sv650) but you know you wont outgrow soon. I just dont understand the guys that buy a brand new 250r and then next season trade it in for something bigger, they either had a deal worked out with the dealer or took a loss on some money during trading up.

 

The choice is yours but if i were you i would just get a bike that i wouldnt out grow, i guess i did do that 4 years ago when i got my first bike the f4i. I just took it easy until i could control it and it worked out fine, other than some lady slamming into it with her car.

[dr_sharp]

Thanks for the input guys. I'll check out the sv650. I had considered the f4i but it sounded like more power than I wanted... maybe I'll reconsider.

 

Right now I don't know how much I'll actually be riding... I can see myself loving it and riding way more than I expected, or I could see myself being scared ****less around aweful san antonio drivers and wanting to sell it.

[ehsnils]

Also consider semi-offroad bikes like the Honda Transalp.

http://www.southbayriders.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=100120&d=1191251247

[Irimis]

Thanks for the input guys. I'll check out the sv650. I had considered the f4i but it sounded like more power than I wanted... maybe I'll reconsider.

 

Right now I don't know how much I'll actually be riding... I can see myself loving it and riding way more than I expected, or I could see myself being scared ****less around aweful san antonio drivers and wanting to sell it.

 

F4I is rated at around 95 HPR and 42 torque with a dry weight of 370. SV650 is 71 HPR and 45 Torque with about the same dry weight.

 

The F4I is a big stunt bike cause its so easy to pick the front end off the ground. Thats not something you want to learn on.

[c-lo]

well being scared will certainly keep you on your toes. respecting a bike and it's power is important. always make sure you where the proper gear too.

 

I miss mine, but since my accident and since I've got a family now it'll be a long time before I get another.

 

 

 

I can see myself loving it and riding way more than I expected, or I could see myself being scared ****less around aweful san antonio drivers and wanting to sell it.

[05GT Guru]

F4I is rated at around 95 HPR and 42 torque with a dry weight of 370. SV650 is 71 HPR and 45 Torque with about the same dry weight.

 

The F4I is a big stunt bike cause its so easy to pick the front end off the ground. Thats not something you want to learn on.

 

Its not any easier to pick the front end on a f4i than it is on any other 600 sport bike. They like to use f4is for stunting because of the seating position and the bikes are dirt cheap these days. Same reason the kawi 636 has a huge stunt following.

 

Im not saying the f4i is the easiest to learn on or the most safe. But i did it just fine, keep the rpms below 8k and it will only put out 60hp. If the op is just looking for a nice cruiser go with the sv650.

[uberwagon]

well being scared will certainly keep you on your toes. Respecting a bike and it's power is important. always make sure you where the proper gear too.

 

i miss mine, but since my accident and since i've got a family now it'll be a long time before i get another.

 

this !!!!!!!!!!!

[GTTuner]

Here is a personal question; How much do you weigh?

 

If your under 200 pounds a 600cc bike will keep you happy for a long time. If your 220 pounds or more you might need a larger displacement bike. My R6 was crazy fast with just me on it ( 175 pounds ). Add one passenger and it was a pig.

 

I miss my bike, right now if I come across a clean RC51 I'm gonna jump on it.

[dr_sharp]

Yea I weigh about 180, not really considering anything above 650cc.

[ray916mn]

SV650 is a great suggestion in my book.

 

It is a great bike for a rider of any skill level. Quite a few people I ride with who are current or former amateur racers and MSF instructors have these bikes and enjoy them. On the street if you're not very heavy or aren't going to long distance tour, you really don't need allot of power. My 62 hp '95 Ducati 900SS is every bit of fun and fast on twisty roads as my Ducati 916 or '08 CBR1000RR.

 

The SV650 has very good resale, and is easy to put frame sliders on to provide some the tip over protection that every new rider should get with their first bike. Whatever you do, don't buy something with full bodywork.

 

Whatever you get, welcome to the world of motorcycling!

[rodan]

An SV650 is about the best beginner bike out there. They're cheap, easy to ride, and when you do move on, all the depreciation has already happened. Also, you won't outgrow an SV650 in a couple of months like most new riders will with a 250 or 500 basic bike. An SV will remain surprisingly capable as you learn, and is perfectly willing to go quite fast in skilled hands, and it's much more fun to be fast on a 'slow' bike than to be slow on a 'fast' bike.

 

A few years ago, I picked up a cheap SV because I didn't have a street bike at the time, and ended up taking it to the track just for giggles. I actually had as much or more fun on the SV than on my race bike. Once you gain some skill, you can just cane the nuts off the thing and have a load of fun, without ever feeling like it's going to kill you if you make a small mistake!

 

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y185/RodanAZ/FBE7-24-05SVT9small1.jpg

[IwannaSportSedan]

A review of the new Kawasaki 650R Ninja (replaced 500R Ninja entry bike a few years ago) just crossed my attention. This has prompted me to re-familiarize myself with this market segment... so here-goes. Mid-range sporty-standard bikes:

 

Kawasaki has updated their parallel twin (think of an inline 4, but only the center two pistons... an inline 2) Similar principles, displacement, and torque-levels to a V-twin, just a bit different layout of the engine. (a bit wider than a single or V-twin, but otherwise more compact than a V-engine)

http://www.motorcycledaily.com/26april10_2010kawasaki_ninja650r.htm

 

Supposedly the power is good, and the riding position is quite humane and enjoyable, on a sporty looking bike. but a bit more bodywork than SV650.

http://www.motorcycledaily.com/042610middle.jpg

http://www.kawasakimotorcycle.org/images/2010/Ninja650.jpg

 

The ER-6N is basically the same bike, sans the bodywork.

http://www.kawasakimotorcycle.org/images/2010/ER6N.jpg

 

Somehow I have a feeling that the Ninja 650R could lose the lower bodywork, but keep the upper half of the fairing, put on ER-6N's lower belly pan around the bottom of the engine... fiddle with the front turn signal transition between the ninja version's upper fairing, and the radiator shroud from the ER-6N... and have a half-fairing version, between the full-fairing Ninja 650R and the nearly "naked" ER-6N.

 

I still like V-twins, and the Suzuki SV650 is a very good one... The SV650S is still the half-faired version, but Suzuki has re-styled, and re-named the naked version to SFV-650 Gladius. Same bike mechanically, different ergonomics and looks.

http://www.totalmotorcycle.com/photos/2010models/2010-Suzuki-SV650Sa-small.jpg

http://www.totalmotorcycle.com/photos/2010models/2010-Suzuki-GladiusSFV650a-small.jpghttp://www.totalmotorcycle.com/photos/2010models/2010-Suzuki-GladiusSFV650d-small.jpg

 

Honda doesn't have much in this class. NT700V is a bit more touring dress of a bike. Not a successor to the NT650 Honda Hawk GT, even if the engine is a progression of the same design. Honda has let this market go by. Perhaps an older, used Honda 599 (known as Hornet 600 overseas) might be available somewhere, and worth consideration, as well as the old 88-91 Honda Hawk GT, which is what I have. I have been less than impressed with Honda for not competing with these other bikes, by making a Hawk GT successor, nor a 1000cc SuperHawk successor.

 

Yamaha has the FZ6, but it is an inline 4, and probably closer to a de-tuned super-sport. Consider, perhaps, but Yamaha has a tendency to be high-rev, high power engines, and thus more toward intermediate or advanced riders... Most of Yamaha's bike lineup is focused on super sports, like R6 and R1.

 

BMW has a nice Parallel twin lineup, the F800R (R = naked) or F800S (S = half or optional full fairing 2009 model shown). 800cc, very nice bikes, higher build quality than the similar layout Kawasakis above, but cost more, accordingly. They also have a GS (dual-sport on and off road) version of the F800 lineup. There are also previous 650cc Rotax versions of the F-GS... if the dual-sport idea is appealing.

http://www.totalmotorcycle.com/photos/2010models/2010-BMW-F800Rc-small.jpg

http://www.totalmotorcycle.com/photos/2009models/2009-BMW-F800Sb-small.jpg

http://www.totalmotorcycle.com/photos/2010models/2010-BMW-F800GSa-small.jpg

 

Triumph has their supersport Daytona 675 Triple (inline 3 engine, full fairing sport bike), and their Street Triple naked version. Similar to the Yamaha, it might be a very slightly steeper learning curve, and higher performance capability, but possibly worth considering.

http://www.webbikeworld.com/motorcycle-news/2010/2010-triumph-street-triple-scorched-yellow.jpg

 

Aprilia has a new SV and Shiver lineup, based around their new 750CC V-twin. A bit more expensive, european SV650 alternative.

http://www.totalmotorcycle.com/photos/2010models/2010-Aprilia-Shiver750b-small.jpg

 

But the European bike that precedes the SV650, is the Ducati Monster. The Monster lineup was just updated, and has a nice 696cc air-cooled L-twin (V-twin canted forward, with the rear cylinder almost vertical, and the front cylinder toward the front-wheel. The advantage to air-cooling, is that there is less service to be done on the bike, but the desmodromic valves do sometimes require more precise adjustment than a standard valve lifter system... but not that often. A bit of a premium for the bike, but well built, and very recognizable, and a big enthusiast community.

http://www.totalmotorcycle.com/photos/2010models/2010-Ducati-Monster696g-small.jpg

 

KTM has a smaller 690cc version of their bigger Duke-series bikes, which straddles the line between a hyper-motard (street legal dirt bike style motorcycle, on sportbike tires), and naked sportbike. Usually these bikes are something people don't quite "get", or they LOVE them. They tend to be very light, quick, and a bit "bonkers." At least this one isn't a 990 Duke, or a 1190 RC8 sportbike.

http://www.totalmotorcycle.com/photos/2010models/2010-KTM-690Dukee-small.jpg

 

Moto Guzzi is a different flavor of italian, and almost more like a BMW... Longitudinal engine, with v-twin cylinders bracing under each side of the gas tank, and shaft-drive between the gearbox and the rear wheel. More like a BMW boxer, than a transverse engine, chain driven bike. Also air and oil cooled, so no water radiator.

The V7 series is a bit nostalgic, but still capable of being a very competent ride. 757cc, and pictured is the Cafe Classic. Nostalgic more like the Ducati Sport Classic bikes, or the Triumph Bonneville. But hey, you could pretend to be Steve McQueen's protege, or something. I've ridden an 1100 Moto Guzzi LeMans, and it was a very nice quality ride, and isn't a bike that everyone else rides.

http://www.totalmotorcycle.com/photos/2010models/2010-MotoGuzzi-V7CafeClassice-small.jpg

[F-WDC Spec B]

 

The ER-6N is basically the same bike, sans the bodywork.

 

http://www.kawasakimotorcycle.org/images/2010/ER6N.jpg

Im actually thinking about getting this bike if i start riding. I like the "naked bike" look. and the more upright seating position.