lejjasie Posted May 10, 2007 Share Posted May 10, 2007 Warning: This may be a complete noob post...with lots of dumb questions. Some issues i was able to resolve after reading info but questions still linger. This started from the questions in this thread: http://www.legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php?t=61258 I read this stuff and other threads and i honestly am a little confused. It did, however make me realize i am doing a complete sh*tload of a job waxing my car and thinking i accomplished a ginormous task that i was really proud of. I never have clayed it. Honestly i had to read about it on the ocdetails site. I can't picture it because i didn't even know what it was. From reading the stuff here and on the ocd i got the sequence right: 1. WASH 2. CLAY (Please read OCDetails.com here for all about claying) 3. WASH AGAIN 4. POLISH 5. WASH AGAIN 6. APPLY WAX OR (BETTER) SEALANT. Now why am i confused? read on... 1. WASH I use Eagle one car wash liquid. I like it because i just spray droplets and it works up some serious foamy soap and i love how it picks up the dirt and grit and what not. I hope this sh*t is approved by people... is it? 2. CLAY Well no question other than i need to put it on and clean up all the stupid wax that i repeatedly put on it for weeks. OCdetails link above helped to explain why this is so important. 3. WASH AGAIN ..seems straighforward - just use as much soap to make sure the clay lube is gone. I believe the sign of successful wash is if the paint is dry and you don't see oily patches correct? 4. POLISH This is my BIGGEST confusion...so a. Does car have to cool and dry at this time? b. I do need a machine for this? I have a little simoniz rotary wax applicator/buffer thingy. Many people suggest Porter cable. c. What to use as a polish...is there a brand of polish or are we talking about using some kind of applicator on the machine and that's it? d. Do we let it dry or buff or what? 5. WASH AGAIN ??? I just polished it...washing but with SOAP? Dry it again? 6. WAX AND/OR SEALANT Doing the half (or 'no' rather) assed jobs with wax so far - i got accumulated... a. Meguirs cleaner wax b. California Gold Cleaner Wax c. Eagle one nanotex wax ... ...Are these any good? ...If not then i guess i will get S100 or do a search on the good ones. ...And then apply Sealant? ...do i let the wax dry up and then i buff with microfibre before putting sealant on? ...do i have to buff it after sealant? Sigh... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brady Posted May 10, 2007 Share Posted May 10, 2007 I'm at work, so I don't have time to address all the questions. If there aren't answers by the time I get home today, I'll attack this so you understand what's going on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OCDetails Posted May 10, 2007 Share Posted May 10, 2007 Please don't give yourself a heart attack by stressing about which products to use. It isn't about the brand on the bottle. It is more important you are using products in the right 'family'. - Car wash is car wash unless it has wax in it. Use one that doesn't have wax. -Clay is all made by the same two companies anyway, so there isn't much difference between brands. -There are more polishes out there than people using them, so you just need to do some research. Don't just ask 'what do I use' because there isn't an answer. How you use the polishes is more important than what brand or level of polish you are using. Using a medium cut polish with a light pad is like using a light polish with a heavy pad. The how is more important than the what. -And as far as waxes and sealants go, that is just art. Pick one that looks best to you. There are thousands of choices, so just start experimenting. There isn't a right or wrong answer. Where there is a right or wrong answer is in the order. Don't apply a wax first and then a sealant. Sealants won't bond to waxes. Don't get caught up in layering things anyway. You don't HAVE to layer anything. One coat of any sealant is just fine. You don't HAVE to put 20 layers of this on top of 10 layers of that in order to go to heaven. It is really just a matter of artistic preference. You can actually really impair the appearance of your car by using too much wax or sealant. You can also waste a lot of time and money putting on layers that don't matter. For beginners I suggest to pick either a sealant or a wax and just put one coat on. Don't over complicate things that aren't complicated. _________________________________________ “Cleanliness becomes more important as godliness becomes more unlikely.” O C D E T A I L S . C O M OCDETAILS BLOG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bakasama Posted May 10, 2007 Share Posted May 10, 2007 You don't HAVE to put 20 layers of this on top of 10 layers of that in order to go to heaven. It's a good thing to. Otherwise... -Jim (AKA 09F911029D74E35BD84156C5635688C0) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OCDetails Posted May 10, 2007 Share Posted May 10, 2007 And I could be wrong on that. Every time I walk through a car show where the cars are all swirled and water spotted, I always say to myself that I must be in Hell. _________________________________________ “Cleanliness becomes more important as godliness becomes more unlikely.” O C D E T A I L S . C O M OCDETAILS BLOG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RangerMan Posted May 10, 2007 Share Posted May 10, 2007 And I could be wrong on that. Every time I walk through a car show where the cars are all swirled and water spotted, I always say to myself that I must be in Hell. You'd think that they would just load up on a glaze to hide the swirls. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iyalla Posted May 10, 2007 Share Posted May 10, 2007 4. POLISH This is my BIGGEST confusion...so a. Does car have to cool and dry at this time? b. I do need a machine for this? I have a little simoniz rotary wax applicator/buffer thingy. Many people suggest Porter cable. c. What to use as a polish...is there a brand of polish or are we talking about using some kind of applicator on the machine and that's it? d. Do we let it dry or buff or what? This is not a one line answer dude. The thing about polishing is it really depends on the condition of your paint. There are several levels of abrasiveness when it comes to polishes. On a scale of 1-10 there would be one for each. Check out this old polishing chart... http://thedetailinghandbook.com/Polish_Chart.aspx Anything on the chart that is at or above a polish will work best with a machine. The exceptions are things like Scratch X or Einszett Paint Polish which can be used very effectively to fix small spots by hand (or can be used to polish a complete car by hand by someone with amazing biceps and stamina ). When using a machine you then have to factor in things like foam pad choice also. You can change the pad on a Porter Cable. If you use an aggressive pad with a mild polish you will get very different results that using the same pad with an aggressive polish. Its basically a learning experience. Usually you want to start of with the mildest pad and mildest cutting polish and work your way up in aggressiveness (pad first) until you get the correction you need. There are two types of machines for polishing a rotary or a dual action. The Porter Cable is a dual action, they are safe to use and have a very mild learning curve they kind of oscillate sideways so that they don't generate heat and burn the paint. The rotarys on the other hand just spin and they take a lot of practice to use and can cause serious damage if used wrongly. The car usually has to be cool and dry although there are some polishes like Optimum or Poorboys that do well in the sun because of their long working time. Working time is the amount of time a polish can be rubbed until it breaks down. Most polishes have to break down to a clear haze before you wipe them off finally. The mild glaze polishes are just like waxes, they haze and then you wipe them off. To determine what condition your paint is in you need to know what swirls (sometimes called spider webbings) are. They are fine scratches that look like dense spider webs on your car's paint especially if you look at the paint at a certain angle to the light. They can be really harsh or very light almost unnoticeable. The harsh ones look bad in any light and the paint tends to look like someone took a brillo pad to it. There are some polishes and finishing glazes that will hide light swirls by filling them in. The swirls will appear later after a few days of rain for example but if you have very little swirls the filler polishes work well. If your paint is in fairly could condition with hardly any swirls stick with the light polishes and finishing glazes you can use by hand and learn how to wash and maintain your car so that you don't have to move up the chart into paint correction territory So thats pretty much it about polishing (simplified of course), its all I can think off right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iyalla Posted May 10, 2007 Share Posted May 10, 2007 5. WASH AGAIN ??? I just polished it...washing but with SOAP? Dry it again? When using a machine some CUTTING polishes break down into dust as you work them into the paint. This is the reason for this step. The dust gets everywhere. Some machine/cutting polishes are notorious for this. If you are just using a polish finishing glaze or a light polish by hand this step is not necessary. Just buff off and slap a wax/sealant on top. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
el5y Posted May 11, 2007 Share Posted May 11, 2007 good info guys Can't wait for my materials to get in...right now wash and wax will have to do. Eric Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lejjasie Posted May 11, 2007 Author Share Posted May 11, 2007 I am glad this information is useful to a lot of people. It is certainly going to be useful for me. The reason i resorted to so many types of waxes was to see if i could get those minor scratches removed and some sections on my hood and door panels smoothened out. I don't have crazy spider web scratches but there are a few on the hood and some that i can count on the door panels. I have to take a lamp and look closely at them all but it was depressing to keep noticing the scratches were hardly going away. In fact i felt that i was causing more scratches to appear the more i buffed even when using microfibre cloth. When i run my hand along the hood there is a patch on it that is completely invisible to the eye but my fingers can really tell something is wrong about that patch of surface. The fingers glide smoothly over the remainder of the area but in this patch i feel it hit a matty surface and there is no gloss whatsoever. Maybe it is the factory sealant that has completely depleted in this area. After three weekends of continous waxing, i was disappointed and it was time to start reading and getting my questions answered. In Canada, surprizingly the products at WalMart and Canadian-Tire are horrendously limited. Even at Performance Auto i wasn't impressed. None of the stuff discussed here is heard of. So when i travel to Buffalo next time to see the girlfriend - there is going to be a ulterior motive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcsquish Posted May 11, 2007 Share Posted May 11, 2007 Since I have never been to a car show, and I'm afraid to because my head would overflow with ideas...... Why in the heck would someone enter a show with swirls? Oh wait, nevermind I forgot, most people don't care about swirls............ ________ Infectious Diseases Advice Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OCDetails Posted May 11, 2007 Share Posted May 11, 2007 It's not that they don't care about them. I honestly don't think they see them. It has been so long since their paint was smooth and swirl free that they just don't realize that feeling rough and showing swirls isn't the way their car is supposed to look. Just feel a car the next time you are at a show and I'll bet you'll find that they haven't ever clayed it. Some of the easiest steps and most accessable products seem to be absolute mysteries to some car enthusiasts... _________________________________________ “Cleanliness becomes more important as godliness becomes more unlikely.” O C D E T A I L S . C O M OCDETAILS BLOG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iyalla Posted May 11, 2007 Share Posted May 11, 2007 Like I said in an earlier post once someone teaches you what to look for its over you'll never look at a car surface the same. Like OCD says above ignorance is bliss for those people Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OCDetails Posted May 11, 2007 Share Posted May 11, 2007 It's like the Matrix. Once you become aware of the truth there is no going back. I should have taken the other pill.... lol Nah. I actually really enjoy being enlightened in this way. People don't know why my cars look better than theirs, but they do notice. It gives me the opportunity to share the good word. I'm just a missionary of clean cars like some of you are. Brady and iyalla, for example, have really stepped up and I'm impressed with how much they have been sharing lately. You guys know what you are doing and don't need to be saved any more. My work here is done. _________________________________________ “Cleanliness becomes more important as godliness becomes more unlikely.” O C D E T A I L S . C O M OCDETAILS BLOG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DickDastardly00 Posted May 11, 2007 Share Posted May 11, 2007 I just saw a commercial for Liquid Clay bar, I wonder how that stuff works.... ♪Emancipate yourselves from mental slavery; None but ourselves can free our minds.♫ -Bob Marley, Redemption Song Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iyalla Posted May 11, 2007 Share Posted May 11, 2007 You guys know what you are doing and don't need to be saved any more. My work here is done. LOL:lol: +1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iyalla Posted May 11, 2007 Share Posted May 11, 2007 I just saw a commercial for Liquid Clay bar, I wonder how that stuff works.... I'm sort of not sure about this product yet. I have not tried it myself but it seems to be a paint cleaner similar to a cleaner wax, and it seems to have some swirl hiding characteristics like some polishes also. I'm betting its not as effective as clay because I don't know how you can make a liquid pull grit out of paint the way clay does with your rubbing action unless its some kind of glue but i'll hold absolute judgment until I try it one day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lejjasie Posted May 13, 2007 Author Share Posted May 13, 2007 I never purchsed sealant before let alone used. So i got a Mother's sealant and glaze. (quite coincidental - on mother's day too) ... now for a polish i am still confused which one to get - that chart guide in one of the posts earlier in the thread is definitely helpful. However i don't yet have a clay bar. I would like to see how some of the rough patches of paint on my car behave after a claybar. I also want to use some dish soap on the front (bumper) of the car to clean up the bugs. I will stick to the sequence however the questions remaining... - If I use a polish or light polish to start with ... how long should the polish be on the car before i put sealant on it? Ans: I guess from reading here - i would try to dry it after wiping off the polish for at least an hour or so before putting sealant on. I would think it's better to dry in shade away from dust so that i don't have to clean it again before putting sealant on. Sometimes excess polish needs to be removed with the spray of quick detailer or water. - With sealants, do i have to put it on like polish? and then buff/wipe with microfibre? Ans: I think sealants go on like waxes as well. Some are spray on some needs to applied with a finisher pad on a machine like a wax. - How long should i hide the car after sealant in the garage before i can expose it to the sun/rain/birdiepoop. Ans: Some say let the sealant cure (do its thing) for 12 hours before you expose it to other layers or weather. PS: When i buying the sealant a dude at the shop told me you don't need sealant on a newer car because it will prevent the paint won't be able to 'breathe'. This was a pretty old guy who said in his experience he's never seen sealant being put on unless for restoring old cars for shows and stuff. What the heck is he talking about? anyone? Ans: I think this is BS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Underdog Posted May 13, 2007 Share Posted May 13, 2007 I think the "breathing" thing is covered under the myths section of OCD's site. The Crimson Dynamo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcsquish Posted May 14, 2007 Share Posted May 14, 2007 Well, I clayed my first car. And I must have done something wrong, I have streaks left over from the clay. When I was claying I had a couple of the bazillion watt work lights lighting up the car and didn't see the streaks until I was done waxing. My question now is what did I do wrong? I used Meguiar's clay kit with a detailing spray to lube the clay. I'm guessing I didn't use enough.? I also washed after claying with dawn to remove more crud. My second question is how do I get rid of them? I tried buffing them out by hand (no PC yet) without luck. A ignorant noob strikes again, yippee.......... ________ Gay video Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brady Posted May 14, 2007 Share Posted May 14, 2007 My best guess is that it's from the dawn. I THINK that you probably used too much soap in the water mixture and the soap left streaks on the car and then you covered them in with wax. Now, it COULD be that you didn't use enough lube. When you clayed, did you always rub in the same direction? If all your streaks are in the same direction as you clayed, you might have residual clay on your car. You can pretty much never lube too much, but you don't want to clay the car dry. I'm anxious to hear your response. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcsquish Posted May 14, 2007 Share Posted May 14, 2007 Yeah, I didn't use enough lube. All of the streaks go front to back and about the same width of the clay. So do I reclay to remove the residual clay? It seemed to pull more junk when it was dryer. When I lubed a lot, it felt like the clay just slid on the lube and didn't pull out the crap. Oh well......I usually do things the hard way. ________ AMATEUR COUPLE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brady Posted May 14, 2007 Share Posted May 14, 2007 yeah, unfortunately you probably need to re-clay the car. you want the clay to just slide over the car. When the clay is dry, you can't really tell at all if it's grabbing stuff or not. When it's lubed up really well, you can very easily tell the difference between dirty paint and clean paint by how smoothly the clay runs over the paint. It just glides effortlessly and silently. Dry clay will stick to the paint and since the clay is rubbing off onto the paint, it won't pick up the contaminants as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcsquish Posted May 14, 2007 Share Posted May 14, 2007 It figures, oh well. Like a CAD teacher would say after the power would blink and someone hadn't saved in a while, "It'll go faster the second time you do it." Thanks Brady, it was doing that, so I guessed (I should have known better) I had too much lube. Maybe I can swing this so I can get a PC............ Thanks again! ________ Free streaming amateur sites Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G.T.Subie Posted May 14, 2007 Share Posted May 14, 2007 I will usually leave the car a little wet after the first wash that way you don't need a lot of lube. I didn't read the whole thread so sorry if that was covered. Denial is your best friend Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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