Top Hat Question: Attn: apexjapan, nicd, drift money, etc.

[SC GT]

[b]CLIFF'S NOTES: [/b] Can anyone post a picture of the piston tops of the USDM and the JDM Bilstein struts, and can you let us know the size of the nut that connects the USDM and JDM struts to the top hats? [b]LONG VERSION:[/b] Based upon nicd's pictures on page 6 of this thread ([url]http://www.legacygt.com/viewtopic.php?t=1357[/url]), drift monkey and I are of the opinion that the spring perches of the USDM and JDM Spec B struts are the same, which would seem to indicate that you can use JDM springs with USDM struts. We are not saying anyone should, but physically, it seems they will fit. Now, there is another question as to whether USDM top hats would fit on JDM struts, and vice versa. The pictures in nicd's threads show that there is a definite difference between the front JDM and USDM tophats. The rears look the same, but might be different. However, all appear to have the same bolt pattern. In my mind, the only reason why the USDM and JDM top hats would be incompatible would be if there was: (1) a difference in the size of the bolt that attaches the struts to the top hats, or (2) a difference with respect to the piston tops as is the case with the latest STi suspensions (see this thread [url]http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=563382&highlight=top+hats+sti[/url]). So, Paul and nicd or anyone else, can you supply pictures of the JDM and USDM piston tops, and can you let us know what size the connecting nut is for them? Short of someone being able to actually try to put the USDM top hats on JDM struts and springs, that should give us a clearer indication as to whether it is possible. Thanks to anyone that can help or clarify.

[Drift Monkey]

As far as top hats go, methinks nicd is the only qualified person to get us pics of the two since he has both sets. DM patiently waits for pics.....

[SC GT]

I'm less interested in pictures of the top hats than pictures of the tops of the pistons on the struts. Those should tell us how the struts sit in the top hats. Members that might have pix: Paul, nicd, Xenonk or anyone else that has removed his/her stock suspension, Opie or anyone else at SOA or a dealership.

[Drift Monkey]

[quote name='SC GT']I'm less interested in pictures of the top hats than pictures of the tops of the pistons on the struts. Those should tell us how the struts sit in the top hats. Members that might have pix: Paul, nicd, Xenonk or anyone else that has removed his/her stock suspension, Opie or anyone else at SOA or a dealership.[/quote] Right...I understand now that I read that NASIOC thread. nicd can test fit them for us I think....

[nicd]

Well I would love to answer the question but as they are on the cars it is a little difficult to see I will see if I can get a good look but for the pics it will not be easy.

[Drift Monkey]

[quote name='nicd']Well I would love to answer the question but as they are on the cars it is a little difficult to see I will see if I can get a good look but for the pics it will not be easy.[/quote] Would it be too much to ask for you to take one off (front and rear) some day in the near future to confirm for us? :idea:

[SC GT]

nicd, would it be possible for you to get a shot of the USDM/Canadian piston tops? That Bilstein article you posted shows the JDM piston tops somewhat, and we might be able to get better photos through Paul, Yahoo Auctions Japan, or somewhere else.

[racerdave]

I've wondered this too... but I really think the smart thing to do is get the whole shebang... springs, struts, hats.

[Drift Monkey]

[quote name='racerdave']I've wondered this too... but I really think the smart thing to do is get the whole shebang... springs, struts, hats.[/quote] You're probably right, but who knows...we could have a decent setup for minimal costs (mostly research).

[racerdave]

True enough, DM. I still find it somewhat puzzling why there hasn't been a definitive answer yet, but oh well...

[Drift Monkey]

[quote name='racerdave']True enough, DM. I still find it somewhat puzzling why there hasn't been a definitive answer yet, but oh well...[/quote] All in good time my man... 8)

[nicd]

I wil post pics of the parts you ask about but there is also a guy in the forum that has an un-mounted set without the coils I am sure that would fulfill your requirments, lemme see if I can spot him. PS it seems that many many people in Japan opt for the blistein shocks with the STI coils. This could be what we are looking for, well I do not have to many issues with my present setup, but yeah it is sometimes a little harsh.l

[Drift Monkey]

[quote name='nicd']I wil post pics of the parts you ask about but there is also a guy in the forum that has an un-mounted set without the coils I am sure that would fulfill your requirments, lemme see if I can spot him. PS it seems that many many people in Japan opt for the blistein shocks with the STI coils. This could be what we are looking for, well I do not have to many issues with my present setup, but yeah it is sometimes a little harsh.l[/quote] Maybe the STi coils could help? 8)

[nicd]

here you go hopes that helps. I will probably be buying the STI coils and match them with the Bilstien Spec B shocks.

[SC GT]

nicd - thanks for the pics, although I'm looking for pics like the ones attached. They demonstrate why '02 STi top hats won't work with '04 STi struts. I'm wondering if there is a similar problem with JDM/Bilstein and USDM struts.

 

Why have you decided to go with the STi springs?

[nicd]

Ah I see the pics you want well, these springs are compressed so I do not think that I will be able to do this but one of the board members does have just the Bilstien shock I could however do this for the stock shock. If you look at the Bilstien threds he was trying to sell a set minus the coils. I will try and get the pics for you. Why the sti coils well I do get some bounce at low speed on small bumps, and from what i could gather the pinks work very well with the Bilstien, all the road control and some better road ride. In terms of hard edge driving these work very very well, but the pinks might just fix the gap issue and the harsher ride associated with the stock spec B set-up.

[nicd]

[url]http://www.legacygt.com/viewtopic.php?p=26771&highlight=#26771[/url] His name is Subysouth and he has them for sale check out the thread.

[subysouth]

[quote name='nicd']http://www.legacygt.com/viewtopic.php?p=26771&highlight=#26771 His name is Subysouth and he has them for sale check out the thread.[/quote] dat's me. :) I'm not missing the coils, I'm missing the topmounts only. But after your install pics, I didnt want to sell them to anyone until I could source the correct topmounts casue it didnt seem like they would work without the correct topmounts. Now if SC and DM can figure a way to use the USDM topmounts that would be cool too. I posted pics of the JDM strut/shock shaft tops here: [url]http://legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1766[/url] I didnt see this thread until just now. And we are almost positive at this point my set is off a BP GT not a GT-B. The struts/shocks are the same but the springs are a little softer than the GT-B springs. ss

[nicd]

Sorry about that! you should get these sold in a second as they are close to the comfort levels that most want. After having spent a month with the Spec B it is a little to harsh for our roads on a daily basis(I will probably be putting on some pink coils).

[apexjapan]

Just a question - to sum it up, the top hats between JDM and USDM are different enough that JDM springs won't seat correctly on a USDM strut? And if so, all that is needed would be JDM top hats (for bilstein)? If so, then would be reasonably easy to package up springs + tophats and ship them as a package. Of course, that ignores the matching up of spring rates with USDM dampers... Cheers, Paul Hansen [url]www.apexjapan.com[/url]

[racerdave]

And Paul... I think a lot of us would like the whole shebang... the Bilsteins, the springs and the hats. Forget the USDM dampers. So either a package of JDM GT springs/Bilsteins/hats, or a Spec B springs/Bilsteins/hats should sell nicely. In fact, I'd like the JDM GT package... Subysouth, is that what you're selling?

[apexjapan]

Well, the biggest cost right now is the dampers. Bilsteins are expensive, roughly $1500-1600 brand new. I'm not saying that they are bad, quite good actually. Just a bit expensive to go that route. :) Used is of course one path to go, but then you simply run into supply problems. I'd like to see if I can get KYB adjustable dampers, springs (Swift are excellent, btw) and top hats all as a package for less than the cost of the Bilstein dampers alone... Cheers, Paul Hansen [url]www.apexjapan.com[/url]

[racerdave]

[quote name='apexjapan'] I'd like to see if I can get KYB adjustable dampers, springs (Swift are excellent, btw) and top hats all as a package for less than the cost of the Bilstein dampers alone... Cheers, Paul Hansen [url]www.apexjapan.com[/url][/quote] Hmm... that could be interesting. :) I thought I also heard that Bilstein was developing a BTS package for the LGT (which consists of their shocks and springs in a package) Oh, and if we can get Koni to make some "Yellow" (Koni Sport) shocks for the LGT, then I just might forget about the Bilsteins altogether... (I am a BIG Koni Sport fan) ;)

[SC GT]

[quote name='apexjapan']Just a question - to sum it up, the top hats between JDM and USDM are different enough that JDM springs won't seat correctly on a USDM strut? And if so, all that is needed would be JDM top hats (for bilstein)? If so, then would be reasonably easy to package up springs + tophats and ship them as a package. Of course, that ignores the matching up of spring rates with USDM dampers... Cheers, Paul Hansen [url]www.apexjapan.com[/url][/quote] Paul, One vendor is selling the JDM STi pink springs, and has said he has successfully fit four sets on the USDM strut and top hat set up, so apparently JDM springs should fit all of our USDM set ups. The question right now seems to be whether USDM Top Hats will fit on JDM Bilstein struts. The top hats look different, but based upon nicd's experience, the complete JDM take-offs bolt up to the USDM cars, so bolt patterns aren't a problem. One [i]possible[/i] problem would be if the threading on the Bilsteins is different than the threading of the USDM struts (which was a problem with '04 WRX STi struts and older WRX top hats). Subysouth has a set of Bilstein struts here in the US, but no top hats, so he doesn't want to sell them to anyone until he either gets a set of JDM top hats or he knows that the USDM top hats will work. It looks like I can get some Bilstein struts as well, but not the JDM top hats, so I want to know whether the USDM's will work, or if not, how tough (and expensive) will it be to get a set of JDM top hats shipped to the US, new or used. Plus, based upon your spring reviews, I think some people that want the Bilstein struts are going to want to switch out the OEM springs anyway, so it could be advantageous price-wise to buy struts alone rather than complete take-offs. That about sums up the dilemma, at least from my perspective. SC GT

[subysouth]

And Paul... I think a lot of us would like the whole shebang... the Bilsteins, the springs and the hats. Forget the USDM dampers.

 

So either a package of JDM GT springs/Bilsteins/hats, or a Spec B springs/Bilsteins/hats should sell nicely.

 

In fact, I'd like the JDM GT package... Subysouth, is that what you're selling?

 

What I have got, after a lot of investigation and help from NicD, is the BP Legacy GT suspension without the topmounts. The previous owner kept the topmounts to use with coilovers. I have got front and rear struts/shocks, and front upper spring perches(the rear perches seem to be integral with the topmounts.)

 

Here's some pics of my setup: