Synthetic Oil Woes

[gfxdave99]

im sure there is a castrol product that competes with mobil 1 too ... idk what it is though

 

Syntec

 

http://www.castrol.com/castrol/productdetail.do?categoryId=82915470&contentId=6030793

[AWD_Rules3830]

Pffft.. REAL men use castor oil in their engines.

 

Oh ... its on now !!

[AWD_Rules3830]

what grade do you guys have in yoru cars ... i have 5W-30 right now ... AND ITS SUPERIOR MOBIL ONE

[edmundu]

It isn't mileage that truly determines when you should or shouldn't switch it is also closely related to time.

 

If your car is a couple yrs old, not to big a deal, but when it is double digits, it certainly is risky. And being that it got to its 10+ yrs on dino, it can rest assured continue on that diet.

 

For the money that M1 commands, there is GC aka German Castrol, Pennzoil Platinum, Valvoline Max Life Synth., Amsoil (if your a dealer)... a few other's like BMW synthetic 5w30, that's right straight from the Beemer dealer, at about $4.50 qt.

 

Not trying to bash M1, it still is a very good product, there are just many more competitor's that do just as good and in some cases better.

 

For those that prefer dino, I swear by Chevron Delo/Supreme & Pennzoil. However, pretty much all of them are within spitting distance of each other.

 

And I now personally use Euro Platinum 5W-40(2qts) + US Platinum 10W-30(2.7qts), to get a solid 30W oil. For the summer, I'll switch to straight euro. For added protection in the heat.

[deneb]

Amsoil is a bit thicker, so the engine will vibrate more.

 

What evidence do you have to back this up? I've never heard that thicker oil makes the engine 'vibrate more'.

[fweasel]

I have heard putting any synthetic into an engine with substantial mileage already on it can have a bad outcome. If it has 60k on it, don't fix anything if it ain't broke. Just put synthetic in it in the BEGINNING and you'll be fine.

You may have heard, but I have done. Both of my 14 year old Z cars were switched to full syn at or near 60K and the only fluid falling from them is water at the tailpipe. There are annecdotes to support both claims. The truth is, the seals in some "older" cars will shrink (swell less) when switched to full syn and can develope leaks. There should be no reason that switching back to conventional oil will reverse that problem.

[AWD_Rules3830]

What evidence do you have to back this up? I've never heard that thicker oil makes the engine 'vibrate more'.

It was a study done that compared Mobil 1 to Amsoil. One of the outcomes was that is engine vibrated more on Amsoil, because it was thicker.

[AWD_Rules3830]

i will say though that that study may have been slanted to Mobil 1

[korpse]

When I had my WRX I switched to Mobil 1 at 10k and never had a problem. Most people actually recommend not switching to synthetic until you have a few thousand miles on the car because the engine won't properly break in with synthetic. I plan on switching to synthetic at 5k miles on the LGT.

[pillboy]

Our 4 cylinder Camry has 140,000 + miles on it and I go back and forth between regular and synthetic all the time (have for the past 6 years). I run synthetic only in the winter so the car starts easier in the cold and oil gets to the spinning stuff faster. I add no oil between changes (stays at the full level until the next change at another 3,000 miles), nothing leaks, and it runs the same (no better or no worse). Anyone that tells you differently is smoking something. Anyone that thinks their engine runs better (and they can tell it from the driver's seat) with synthetic...I got some property in NewOrleans to sell ya. Gaskets fail. This causes leaks. Nothing lasts forever. It's a machine. Stuff breaks.

[elpete77]

I like RedLine or Royal Purple myself, used Redline in my Buell back when and it ran much smoother than before, and I gained 20hp, and lost fifty pounds. And I stopped breaking out, and my planters warts went away.

[AWD_Rules3830]

I believe my car gained a solid 10 Hp on synthetic, just by how different it feels.

[disc0monkey]

to not use mobil1 because of your past experience is not very logical.

 

mobil1 is a great product and considered THE best synthetic oil (thats right better than castrol) along with royal purple and redline(never used this product just heard its of the same quality). synthetic being less viscous than standard oil will leak or blow by the rings if things are not tight. put synthetic in after about 7k miles on the odometer. if your over 25,000miles try it and look for burning of oil or leaks, if none of these problems your golden enjoy great protection and care free use of your synthetic oil; if it does leak or burn oil the tolerances are not tight enough either from wear or crappy factory quality.(some people say the sythetic oil will loses gummy oil deposits on the inside of an old or internally dirty motor because of the detergents used in synthetic oils and can block off oil passages which could cause something along the lines of bearing, or even worse oil pump failure), this is a very valid point and should be considered. never put anything that "cleans" your oil system, thats bad, very bad. open up and a motor that have some milage and u'll understand why really really quick

 

personally wouldn't change the oil until it becomes dirty, but change the oil filter every 4-6k miles depending on operating conditions this should keep harmful crap out of the oil. in my commuter i run mobil1 began using it after 40,000miles. i dont change the oil i just drop the filter and add a quart; the motor seems to be the only thing that hasn't failed on the car as i drive it very hard going over a 100k on the odo.

 

even more impressive on my '71 gto with 91,000 original miles, i took the heads off cleaned the gunk and install a new oil pump. i then put mobil 1 red cap (race formula) expecting to have to drop it because of leaks or the burning of oil (more than a quart every 1500miles) it doesnt leak or burn oil. thats right 30+ year old motor and over 90k miles and synthetics are working fine.

 

 

ps. im sure ur turbo bearings will love synthetic

[disc0monkey]

No doubt you are correct Monkey man. A nice theory and probably correct. In any case, I never let the facts get in the way of good theory.

 

I have also spoken with some guys doing track days, and they dislike Mobil 1 at the track since they said it tends to froth even when topped up.

 

As for synthetics, at 21,000 miles, I am a little leery of switching over from mineral based oil.

 

talk to any true nhra racer, i bet they are using royal purple

[disc0monkey]

remember smell also helps whether or not if your oil can still efficiently do the job

[AWD_Rules3830]

to not use mobil1 because of your past experience is not very logical.

 

mobil1 is a great product and considered THE best synthetic oil (thats right better than castrol)

 

ps. im sure ur turbo bearings will love synthetic

 

 

:whore::whore:

[what]

I changed to Mobil 1 at about 6,000 miles cause i started changing the oil myself (instead of at the dealer due to problems with the dealer). The car was smoother and seemed to just rev easier with Mobil 1. I honestly couldnt believe that I could actually notice a difference with Mobil 1 oil. I have had some weird problems with my oil getting lower and not knowing why. I thought that was kinda wierd. I'd be full when I changed the oil but by the time I get 3,000 miles my dipstick was showing about half way between full and low. I think though that my oil drain plug just doesnt seal very well. Theres probably a stupid washer on it that your supposed to replace every oil change.. atleast thats my guess, i dont know.

[iyalla]

I changed to Mobil 1 at about 6,000 miles cause i started changing the oil myself (instead of at the dealer due to problems with the dealer). The car was smoother and seemed to just rev easier with Mobil 1. I honestly couldnt believe that I could actually notice a difference with Mobil 1 oil. I have had some weird problems with my oil getting lower and not knowing why. I thought that was kinda wierd. I'd be full when I changed the oil but by the time I get 3,000 miles my dipstick was showing about half way between full and low. I think though that my oil drain plug just doesnt seal very well. Theres probably a stupid washer on it that your supposed to replace every oil change.. atleast thats my guess, i dont know.

 

Yeah...um...its called a crush washer and they sell it to you at the dealer with each oil filter.

[KartRacerBoy]

put synthetic in after about 7k miles on the odometer. if your over 25,000miles try it and look for burning of oil or leaks, if none of these problems your golden enjoy great protection and care free use of your synthetic oil; if it does leak or burn oil the tolerances are not tight enough either from wear or crappy factory quality.(some people say the sythetic oil will loses gummy oil deposits on the inside of an old or internally dirty motor because of the detergents used in synthetic oils and can block off oil passages which could cause something along the lines of bearing, or even worse oil pump failure), this is a very valid point and should be considered. never put anything that "cleans" your oil system, thats bad, very bad. open up and a motor that have some milage and u'll understand why really really quick

 

I agree with this point. My entire reason for starting this thread was to see how common my experience was and how common knowledge on this point was. I have talked to several experienced mechanics on this point and some are familiar, some not, with the issue. And I've never read anything about it in any magazine like R&T, C/D, etc., either claiming its a valid issue or a myth. It's simply not discussed (hmmm, maybe M1 is paying hush money ) But given that my car was clean of any drips at all and it began leaking within 24 hours after I put M1 in it I don't believe it's a "legend" or urban myth.

[disc0monkey]

I changed to Mobil 1 at about 6,000 miles cause i started changing the oil myself (instead of at the dealer due to problems with the dealer). The car was smoother and seemed to just rev easier with Mobil 1. I honestly couldnt believe that I could actually notice a difference with Mobil 1 oil. I have had some weird problems with my oil getting lower and not knowing why. I thought that was kinda wierd. I'd be full when I changed the oil but by the time I get 3,000 miles my dipstick was showing about half way between full and low. I think though that my oil drain plug just doesnt seal very well. Theres probably a stupid washer on it that your supposed to replace every oil change.. atleast thats my guess, i dont know.

 

you should be checking your oil every 1000 miles, in any performance app anything less than a quart every 1000 is ok, like i said im sure ur turbo bearings will leak oil so maybe with ur oil going to the turbo more than a quart every 1000 is ok. this is the trade off for using synthetic. my commuter burns about a 1/5 quart every 1000 miles. and the GTO probably more, especially when its doing track duty.

[disc0monkey]

also if ur car does leak with fully synthetic anyone think of using a castrol blend?

[pillboy]

ALL modern automotive oils have additive packages that include detergents (cleaners) in them.

[disc0monkey]

ALL modern automotive oils have additive packages that include detergents (cleaners) in them.

 

not as much as synthetic, there is a ton of soap in there

[deneb]

http://bobistheoilguy has VOA's posted, some dinos do in fact have higher levels of detergent additives than many synthetics. Although, Redline seems to have the highest levels of most additives (heck, as much as it costs, it oughta).

I didn't realize they put soap in synthetic oils...

[pillboy]

Keep it off the "intracooler".