why don't we have a 6th gear?

[elej]

Not true, depending on how hard you were initially accelerating, if you shift fast enough, your rate of acceleration slows down, but you dont necessarily decelerate.

 

1/2 true:

F=ma, no force (clutch in) = no acceleration

&

1st law of Motion: you are correct, you don't decelerate, with the exception of friction/drag.

[Xenonk]

I would love for the gearing to remain the same, but have a 6th gear that would give me 75mph at about 2750-2800 rpm. I just don't feel good about running my engine at 3000-3300 rpm for prolonged periods. Maybe the subie is strong enough to do this all day for 150,00+ miles, but it doesn't feel that way.

 

max torque is around 3600 rpms.. you're always at the helm of passing power and without the need of downshifting (of which you need to do if you were using a 6spd). 3000 to 3500 is fine at 75 to 80 mph.. why need to go faster anyways? just slow it down a bit on 5th gear and not get yourself in trouble with speeding tickets that will bring you down under 3000 rpms

 

The subie can deal with 3,000 to 3,500 rpms for long periods of time, I got about 40,000 miles on the car and it drives just fine.

[Guest *Jedimaster*]

I was thinking about this today too- at 3K, you're like right at the point where boost comes on hard. That must be why it takes off so easily oon the highway. I still miss having a V8 that barely idles at 75 though.

[Xenonk]

I was thinking about this today too- at 3K, you're like right at the point where boost comes on hard. That must be why it takes off so easily oon the highway. I still miss having a V8 that barely idles at 75 though.

 

you are correct sir, max boost should be available by 2900 rpms and it takes the motor and everything else come together and give you max torque at 3600 rpms.

 

V8 + low redline = idle at any given speed. drive an S2000.. that's a whole other world... at 6,000 rpms, it's JUST getting started.

[John M]

Nobody wants a 6spd like the STi. By this point we're quite aware how its gears are spaced. I don't need an extra shift just to say I've got 6 gears.

 

Us "normal" people want a deep overdrive 6th. Of course it wouldn't be useful except on the highway -- that's what it's for!

 

In my Stealth I never used above 3rd in most in-town traffic. I still didn't feel like I was neglecting the other gears. You use 'em when you need 'em, not just because they're there.

 

They could keep us with a 5spd if they wanted -- the car has the torque, just go with less agressive gearing. Give us something like the 3000GT/Stealth's 5spd, where 2nd went to 70 and 3rd would do 120, meaning by the time you hit 5th rpms were nice and leisurely for highway cruising.

 

No matter how they do it, the car should be under 3000 rpms at 90 mph, period. It'll help economy and it'll make it much quieter for those long trips.

[2Simpletons]

Basically Subaru did not create the USDM LGT to be a pure performance vehicle. They have a larger audience by not putting stiff susp., radical styling, and DCCD 6-speeds in the car. All of these would've driven the cost up and they would've lost a big buying group. They may, however decide to create a USDM LGT STi for a niche group.

 

And, honestly the stock power level doesn't need the STi tranny, so this would 'cause Subaru to tool up and design a "low power" new 6-speed tranny.

 

Not to mention the thing's only 2 years old. How long was the WRX here before the WRX STi? 2 years.

 

Subaru may see that it would not be cost effective to bring over a truly high performance Legacy.

[Guest *Jedimaster*]

you are correct sir, max boost should be available by 2900 rpms and it takes the motor and everything else come together and give you max torque at 3600 rpms.

 

V8 + low redline = idle at any given speed. drive an S2000.. that's a whole other world... at 6,000 rpms, it's JUST getting started.

That's why I'd like to try out an RX8- I think they redline really high- it'd be cool to feel how what kind of power it makes.

[Xenonk]

That's why I'd like to try out an RX8- I think they redline really high- it'd be cool to feel how what kind of power it makes.

 

you mean WHEN it makes power.. drove my friend's RX8 (also another 9 grand plus singer).. took soo long to get up to the meat of the power band.. I almost wanted to clutch-kick the car just to get it to the higher rpms.

 

talk about not having any torque...

[DAP]

The 5EAT could use a 6th gear for milage. Also a lower 1st gear for no boost starts from a complete stop. Have the first gear tuned such that it would shift to second just as the boost kicks in. To keep the performance guys happy, they could disable the 6th gear in "sport" mode.

[scatman]

Jees I get sick of seeing this discussion......for 30K we should have the 6M....hell....being that it's the year 2005 (along with most other new cars) we should have gotton the 6m.

I thought I could live with it but...... I'm pissed. This car can easeily handle a 6th tog. Especially with 4:10 gearing. I can't tell you how many times I'v tried to grab 6th when cruising the freeway.

[Acil]

BTW, the optimum gear spacing has to do with landing at a the optimum acceleration in the next gear. Shift before or after that and you land at a sub-optimum acceleration. More gears get you to a higher average acceleration curve, leading to the best 0 to anything mph times. Hence the attractiveness of a constantly variable transmission, power train losses aside.

 

There is a difference between adding a 6th gear and a variable transmission. When you shift, those pauses of negative acceleration affecting your average accelleration. For performence the gain is nil as the gears are not moved much, but if you ARE forced to make that extra shift, the performence loss could be tragic.

 

A variable transmission (powertrain losses aside) provide constant power at the optimum RPM with no periods of negative acceleration.

[06 Legacy GT]

I never recommended that our cars come with constantly variable transmission, nor do I want one. My statement was in response to an earlier statement that extra gears would slow us down. Not true.

 

There are of course real world remifications, so at one limit one gear is not enough, 10 manual gears might be too many, as far as absolute acceleration from 0-x mph is concerned.

 

Somewhere in the middle there is an optimum solution. In my opinion Subaru could have optimized the 1-5 gears for accleration and made 6 the cruising gear. You can drive on many a road near I95/I81 at 75-80 mph without fear of a ticket. That's when our high rpms really hurt.

[05LegacyGT330Ci]

I just wish we didn't have such an aggressive final drive of 4:11, a nice 3:07 or 2:93 would have been just fine for the car it has plenty of power to have wider ratios while improving mileage.

[Xenonk]

I just wish we didn't have such an aggressive final drive of 4:11, a nice 3:07 or 2:93 would have been just fine for the car it has plenty of power to have wider ratios while improving mileage.

 

you're kidding right? 4.11 down to 3.07 or 2:93?? This aint no American car man.. haha. If you have GT4 for the PS2, get a stock 2.0 GT and just buy a full tranny, match the gear ratios to the Real-Life GTs gear ratios and change your final drive down to a 2.93, you'll see how dog slow it will be...

 

a 3.07 would make your 1st gear stretch out to 45 mph, and your 2nd go as high as a 80 mph.. you'll end up flooding the engine at 5th gear doing 65 mph because it's sitting lower than idle and it's trying to roll the car..

[IwannaSportSedan]

I think people are reciting rear end gearing for american rear wheel drive gears...

 

I have often wondered why the Legacy has 4.10 gears, compared to the 2.5WRX this year having 3.70 gearing with the 5MT... I wonder if 3.9 would do well with the Legacy's 5MT, and lower those cruising RPMs. but 2.9 would be way too little mechanical advantage.

 

I also agree with those here calling for a better optimized 6MT. The Legacy 3.0R Spec B ALREADY HAS THIS TRANSMISSION OVERSEAS!!! I heard rumors around here, from NASIOC that SIA has a few 6MTs that they may be test fitting for 07 production, in an also rumored full option availabiltiy of the GT Spec B. That may be speculation, it may be "pie in the sky", but it might be true.

 

I am not sure what is meant by having to re-tool the 6MT for "low power"... Wha??? The Legacy turbo doesn't have THAT much less power than the WRX STI, (and I wish the factory stock number were closer, like say 290bhp...) and the transmission doesn't need to be re-designed to handle less power.

 

Final drive ratios might benefit from lowered a tad bit from 4.25, maybe. gear ratios changed slightly for lower cruising RPM, and 2nd gear reaching 62mph, for 0-60(100kph) times to boost performance stats, but having a transmission that is capable of handling a high torque load does not preclude it from operating at a slightly smaller fraction of that torque load. It just means more tolerance margin, and less wear.

 

DCCD is a neat thing, and it were included in the LGT with a 6MT, I would think it is cool. However, VTD is probably great, without the manual control mode on the center differential, as mechanically, they are very similar otherwise.

 

I am hoping those rumorsof the 07 Legacy GT getting a Spec B option pkg materialize, with the Bilstein inverted struts, Alu control arms, and proposed 6MT, (likely from the 3.0R Spec B, perhaps with small gearing revisions...) in any of the GT-available colors. A revised color palette, and the Tribeca's three-dial ACC, and memory settings for the seats and mirrors, and a telescoping steering column would all be welcome additions.

 

My purchase timeline is looking like it might extend into the june-august timeframe, and I am hoping that I will like what I see from the 07 spec sheet.

[SWP-LegacyGT]

Honestly and this is a serious answer not a smart ass one to the OP of this thread....

 

Subaru is starting to know it's target audience. People that bought '05 Legacy's are most like going to sell and/or trade in if a LegacySTI comes out in WRB w/ recaro's, HID's, nav 6 speed Auto / Manual etc. It's just a given. Why? Most of the modern world (including OZ, N/A, Europe and Japan) have the ability to make the Legacy STI an actual car.

 

Now on one hand you've got the general market.

 

There's some guys that are like: "OMGZ GIVE MEZ THE STI FOR TEH BOOST!!"

 

But then they don't like the ride, too noisy, bla bla etc.

 

Enter the LegacySTI. Subaru is most likely in testing stages now of what suspension, brakes, engine, turbo, tranny, etc will be used. I have no doubt that in the next 5 years we'll see a LegacySTI in the states.... I also believe that when we do, it will have the same if not equal Horsepower as the WRX STI.

 

So if and when in 2007/2008 the models come out, we'll see (most likely based off projections) a Legacy STI and a WRX STI with around 350-400 HP using the same parts, but again, the Legacy is going to be more "luxury" than the STI.

 

What I find funny about that is I'm 24 and driving a LegacyGT when the rest of the modern world suggests I should be driving an STI.

 

Funny how that works out.

 

-a-

[Keredstg]

Amen...

a lil stiffer suspension, a lil tighter shifting and a modest (haha) 350-400Hp and I'd be happier than a pig in shit. and I'd pay near $40,000 for it cause it will get better performance than the M3 with better gas miliage and no expensive BMW symbols on it.

[Brady]

Did you know that some trucks have 13 and eve 18 gears?! Why not in the Legacy?! Clearly, shifting a lot is better. I want to shift 36 times every time I get on and off the freeway. And I want a freakin' jake brake!

 

Seriously, our cars aren't really all that heavy and we have plenty of power in the low-mid range. No reason for 6 gears. If our cars were about 7-800 lbs lighter, I'd be happy with a 4 speed

 

And if our cars weighed about 3000 lbs less, a Single Speed FTF'nW!

[2Simpletons]

While the STi suffers in the 0-60/1/4 from it's 6Spd gearing, it's awfully nice always having a perfect gear to grab that right in the sweet spot. That said I really wanna drive the new Spec-B and see how they geared it. Hopefully a little bit taller lower gears (1 n 2) and a nice tall 6th.

[LittleBlueGT]

While the STi suffers in the 0-60/1/4 from it's 6Spd gearing, it's awfully nice always having a perfect gear to grab that right in the sweet spot. That said I really wanna drive the new Spec-B and see how they geared it. Hopefully a little bit taller lower gears (1 n 2) and a nice tall 6th.

 

I always find that 5th is too short on the highway.

[AWD_Rules3830]

I always find that 5th is too short on the highway.

 

I must admit, i dont find it short at all, i love haveing the power in boost on the highway, i can with ease pass without a down shift.

[RockyMtnGT]

My commute takes me down some pretty wide open roads, but no actual highways. So I top out at around 50 mph....unless I'm running late. hehe

 

I can honestly say that I hardly ever even use 5th gear. I like how the car is geared...

[Brady]

I think people would complain that the car is extremely anemic if it had the tall overdrive 6th gear everyone seems to be clamouring for.

 

Instead we'd hear complaints that sixth gear is too tall and it sucks that you have to downshift just to pass on the freeway.

 

People will whine no matter what Subaru offers.

[2Simpletons]

I'm only talkin' about a slightly taller than 5th 6th... drop maybe 500RPMs.

[AWD_Rules3830]

Isnt this tranny a carry over from the last model ??

 

If it aint broke dont fix it lol