Anyone think the new Legacy GT needs more horsepower?

[rao]

If you want a Mustang than keep or buy a new Mustang (I have one and they are fun for what they are and Kevin is afaraid to drive mine :D ). If the G35 is so amazing, then buy one of those. The Legacy dosen't claim to be faster than it is. I am not picking on you, I think that people who claim that a Subaru is not a "drag car" have it wrong, the Legacy is perfectly capable of being driven 1/4 mile in a spirited manner :lol: The facts are that no one knows yet how far one could take the stock Legacy turbo (which would be very important to keep it's excellent low rpm boost charastics.). The Short block is identical - IDENTICAL - the the Forester XT and the STi so it is reasonable to assume that its limits are te same (which puts it safetly to well over 400 crank hp). The heads are similar or the same, though the cams are different and the intercooler and intake manifold are BETTER. It is too early to know what you could resonably expect from a LEgacy, but I would bet that 300 hp would be easy, 350 would be a little less easy and over 350 will require a material sacrifice in driveability (because you would likely need a larger turbo, which would be annoying for normal driving conditions). You could easily make as much power as you want - like 600 or so- but that would take cubic dollars and ruin the car's use as normal transportation. Keep in mind that AWD is a double edged sword, it can be great when conditions are bad, but in terms of acceleration it can be the wrong answer. The last thing you want on an AWD car is really sticky tires (unless you hav tons of HP andcan easily break all 4 tires loose), you will piock up a fair amount of time if you were to downgrade to less sticky rubber so you could generate a touch of wheelspin on launch, plus your tranny and clutch would thank you, It all depends on what you want the car to do. BTW, using a manual boost controller on cars with this style of electronic engine control is asking for trouble.

[Deer Killer]

[quote name='Two-Five Sti-L'] The L-GT on paper is very close to the previous gen Audi S4, only difference being the Audi was a 6cyl Bi-turbo. I've never heard complaints of the S4 being "slow". Also, this is a sedan pkg., not a sports coupe. As for the dyno #'s, this is an AWD!!!! Typically #'s AT THE WHEELS for an AWD will be lower than #'s registered on a FWD or RWD. Actually Subaru UNDER-STATED its HP at the crank, its more in the range of 260-270hp. :twisted: I'm sure there will be alot of after-mkt. support for the L, as it is sold in Japan as well. Personally I think the availability will be less than the WRX/STi due to its projected demographics, but certainly enough to satisfy everyone.[/quote] I guess you haven't read audiworld too much :) Of course they also get peak torque at 1850rpms flat to somewhere above 5000... That's what I was hoping for with a twin-scroll turbo.. but alas...

[Mono]

Let’s back up a minute. I am not picking on the new Legacy. I like the new Legacy. So much that I am considering selling my Mustang GT to purchase one. I need four doors and more rear seat room. Last weekend went to the Subaru dealer to drive one, but they didn’t have any 5 speeds. They are going to call me when they get one in. The car looked very good. I like horsepower, but I also like refinement. My mustang is fast, but lacks refinement, 2-doors, and rear seat room. My original goal with this post wasn’t to irritate anyone. I was just wondering if anyone thought the new Legacy could use some more power. I think what’s killing me is that I really want an STi Legacy, but they don’t make one in the US. The WRX is too rough around the edges for me. I am sure it’s a nice and I could get used to it, but I think I want something more refined. As for the G35, yes it has 277 hp, but I just can’t get over the exterior. I think it’s a poor looking car. The Acura TL is super nice, but needs AWD or RWD for me to take it seriously as a sports sedan. I am hoping the new Mazdaspeed Mazda6 is going to be good option. Rumored at 278 hp and AWD. I am months before I am going to dump my stang so I hope you can put up with me.

[Drift Monkey]

Short answer: No. Long answer: Yes.

[rao]

I had a S4 and it's performance was no better then the Legacy, at least when it wasn't in the shop. Mono- No offense taken. You really should drive a five speed car. Just remember that it isn;t loud, but keep an eye on the speedo and you shouldn't be disappointed.

[Dr. Zevil]

Yeah Mono.. I don't think you are offending anyone at all. No worries. I think that you can make the car into what you want. Like Rao said, you should be able to get more than enough HP out of it with modifications. Some of us just think it's good to leave well enough alone. There will always be something faster. Also, the Mazdaspeed 6 is going to be very nice! I would consider it had I not just bought a new GT wagon!

[SUBE555]

5-speeds :lol: Don't you guys mean auto and manual? :mrgreen: Both have 5-speeds. ;) First drive the car, then evaluate power needs. I have a GT, I have some ideas for future upgrades with the car, but I am reserving judgement until after it's seen a few good AutoX's and see where it may need the most work, this aspect mostly is for handling. On the side of power, that's all in personal opinion. I'm looking at something as the Cobb Stage 2 package (turbo-back exhaust, and ECU reflash technology) in a year or two probably. That should net something around the power levels of the STi. The car is pretty deceptively quick in itself, something that has to be tried first hand though on a broken-in car. The car is very capable of being fairly decent at many things. It may be great that it comes at the power level it does, is good for so many different people, yet is decent for insurance and isn't too powerful for most, while it offers a good platform to expand and personalize from.

[crapy]

what the hell is going on? Subaru B4 GT is a 25K SEDAN!!!! it may drive like a sporty car, but it is a 100% SEDAN!!!!! NOT A SPORTS CAR!!! IF B4 GT has 280+HP, who's gonna buy WRX and STi??? B4 GT is a sedan for daily use, but also comes with nice handling, a very useful horsepower and torque, and a very balance set up! Ergo, it's not for any kinds of racing! If HP is all the only thing u concern about, why dont u get a STi or Evo or RX7 or even a Supra? mod the turbo and they will bump up to 500hp+ easily. Yes, there is Subaru B4 STi in jp, and its function is like M and AMG and JCW. (but look at the price!) however, its born to be a Sedan, not a 100% sports car. on the other hand, the STi WRX is inherent for racing. period. although B4 has the "legacy" of WRX, but, still, its a Sedan... okay? more HP is always a good thing for any kinds of cars, but this is not the selling point for B4. 250hp is more than enough for a typical sedan; TL and G35 have more than that, so what? RS6 and S4 also have a LOT more than that, but how do they perform? Check out those japanese DVDs filmed by the GT500 drivers for the reviews and comparison between the GT and other cars, and u will be sure how well the a GT SEDAN can do on track: [url]http://www.legacysti.com/viewtopic.php?t=267&highlight=bestmotoring[/url] not sure if you have ever heard of something like this before: it's not how fast you go; it's how you go fast.

[Th3Franz]

It's got plenty of power, but more importantly, plenty of torque. The car is deceptively fast and can still pass people pretty effortlessly. I think it's got one of the best HP/price ratios, too. :D

[B4_Maniac]

I have to say this thread and post like this irritate me. I know all of you who own a GT know what they are driving and shouldn't have to convince some one who has never driven the car how fast it is. Its like telling someone what a box of cookies will taste like by just reading the ingridents. Well..this box has more sugar in it so it must taste better... C'MON! Thats not the case. You have to DRIVE a car to understand its speed or lack there of. We own a Audi S8 is has over 300hp AWD, do I talk about it much or like to drive it..NO why? Cuz its a fat luxurey car. Its not fun to drive...it can actuly be realy friken scarey cus of its suspension. I would rather drive my Legacy or an RX8 or a EVO why? Because they are light well ballanced cars with good power to weight ratio's. When I first got my Legacy I was pissed at Subaru because I couln't belive they put an engine that powerfull on a supesnion that soft. Why? Because its so powerfull you can actuly over drive it. I had to learn to drive it within its limits. The engine in that car is better than the sum of its parts in its current state. The Legacy is a light powerfull GT. Will you lose to an STI in a drag? Yes. I have already.. But, was a I disapointed in how it performed?? NO. Did I crave more power..NO.. The car is light fast and has the potential to be much more so if DRIVEN BY A GOOD DRIVER and traction and handeling was given proper attention. Sorry for the rant, but I say to anyone, do not judge this car by what is written on paper. Go drive it. Then we will talk.

[axis008]

Haha, poor Mono.

[fan42025]

[quote name='B4_Maniac'] The Legacy is a light powerfull GT. Will you lose to an STI in a drag? Yes. I have already.. But, was a I disapointed in how it performed?? NO. Did I crave more power..NO.. The car is light fast and has the potential to be much more so if DRIVEN BY A GOOD DRIVER and traction and handeling was given proper attention. [/quote] I agree. Actually, I'm in Oz and drive the 2.0GT and find it has plenty of power, sometimes lethal. However, I find the suspension pleasantly hard - perhaps the US versions has a softer one, which typically happens for whatever reason. The handling is great and find it has no problem going around corners at more than twice the recommended speed limit. Going back to the power thing - if you do want more there's an EcuTek unit for it (at least for the 2.0GT in Oz). I think it adds about 24% more power, which would definitely make it a lethal weapon.

[B4_Maniac]

The U.S spec suspension is dangerously soft in my opnion. Reason being, the ,market for the Legacy is a slightly older one here..(No offence guys) :? I am only 26 myself, and I feel like I represent the bottom end of the average age buyer of the U.S Legacy. Plus, I think you have the Bilstien struts and springs that the JDM model gets. We get the good engine..but the crappy springs and struts..and every one else gets the goods suspension and the crappy engine :D ! Just kidding!

[Tide]

Mono, I'm with you. I want more power, whatever it comes with stock, I'll modify it. Even if I had an STi, I'd want more power. Why? Just because. I dont need it, I just like it and I want it. So test drive a Legacy, you'll be impressed. Sure the WHP is lower, but you have all fours hooking up. Good for stoplight dragging (up to the speed limit of course). Need more power? No problem, many tuners will have HP kits coming and we'll be able to see 300-320 chp pretty soon, and for not much money.

[John M]

Comparing HP ratings between turbo & NA engines is also misleading. A turbo car will have a lot more "area under the curve", meaning overall better acceleration. The only thing with a flatter power curve is a roots-blown engine. I'm tired of just a "fast car". I've done it for well more than 10 years now. That's why I'm selling my "[url=http://moojohn.com/stealth]fast car[/url]" and my "[url=http://moojohn.com/stealth/mercury]family car[/url]" to buy one that can do both pretty well. 250hp is plenty for any small car, and yes, 3300lbs is still small. Is 250hp enough for me? Not even remotely! Is it a good starting point? Absolutely!

[RobY]

trust me you will be able to hit 13's stock. People have done it on a stock forrester XT. Which was WAY WAY WAY underrated. [url]http://www.clubwrx.net/forums/showthread.php?s=29a9f274a97c054474925ff8501b8804&threadid=68013&highlight=xt+forester+1%2F4[/url] 210 horsepower MY ASS! [url]http://www.caranddriver.com/article.asp?section_id=3&article_id=6854&page_number=4[/url] The Legacy GT is not as underrated but still posts higher dyno numbers than the Forester XT and lacks the aerodynamics of a brick.

[awdG35killer]

if your choice is b/w the STi and LGT, just get the LGT. its more practical for your family and the ride(imo) is pretty frigggin smooth...just have to get used to the shifting of awd

[Xenonk]

you just need an STi based UTEC. That should be a good pep. Keefe

[fan42025]

[quote name='B4_Maniac']Plus, I think you have the Bilstien struts and springs that the JDM model gets. We get the good engine..but the crappy springs and struts..and every one else gets the goods suspension and the crappy engine :D ! Just kidding![/quote] Correct on the suspension. It's wonderful - as good as a BMW M3 in my opinion. Just wished they made it a little softer though - we have much rougher roads than you. As for the engine - yes I'm envious of not having the 2.5GT but I compared the stats and there's not that much difference. A 3.0GT would be nice though! Anyway, if I need more power (dangerous) I could alway EcuTek it. Some have already done it down here. I'd be even more worried about losing my license.

[B4_Maniac]

Thats another reason why I am not chomping at the bit for upgrades for my new Leggy..I am already pretty compitent with driving it stock. I am glad I didn't switch out the RE92s yet. Becuase I have learned to drive the car smooth and quickly on those tires..useing their limits. I know there are potenital changes that the U.S market can enjoy if the Legacy sales numbers are up and demand is present. The Euro R or the 3.0 GT exsits and would be very easy to make a USDM model. Or just a six speed 2.5L Turbo GT.. Either one I would spend money on, and could come out with the next model year. Even though we all know Subaru doesn't move that fast... But, I don't want to spend money on it now because I know the best is yet to come.

[kenzo]

Mono, If you search the board you'll find that several of us traded in our STi's for the LGT. The STi has the kind of horsepower/torque that you crave, but (unless you take it to the track) you'll have only brief opportunities to really enjoy its capabilities. You'll enjoy the LGT the whole time you're in it. The LGT is very much a driver's car; if you just 'ride' in it, it's nice and comfortable, but push it a little and it becomes quite entertaining. It's also a nice sleeper - you won't have punks wanting to race you all the time (which you WILL in the STi), but you can embarrass most of them if you choose. Drive one. It's faster than it feels because it's smoother and quieter than an STi, and I predict you'll enjoy the nimble handling. Since you're coming from a Mustang, remember to keep the RPMs up above 3000 to be in the 'fun zone'. Enjoy!

[gtguy]

[quote name='B4_Maniac']The U.S spec suspension is dangerously soft in my opnion. Reason being, the ,market for the Legacy is a slightly older one here..(No offence guys) :? I am only 26 myself, and I feel like I represent the bottom end of the average age buyer of the U.S Legacy. Plus, I think you have the Bilstien struts and springs that the JDM model gets. We get the good engine..but the crappy springs and struts..and every one else gets the goods suspension and the crappy engine :D ! Just kidding![/quote] Careful with that suspension comment. I can take corners and curves every bit as fast (if not faster were I not a chicken) with my Legacy GT as I could with my WRX wagon, which had the SPT suspension kit and STi rear links package. Compliant is different from soft. An M5 is compliant. A Buick LeSabre is soft. The latter makes a car dangerous, as it is a limiting factor. The former simply makes a car more versatile. You can squire Mother around, or kick out the jams in the twisties. Now, the stock WRX had "crappy" springs and struts in '02-'03 guise, which was why the fixed the deficiencies for '04, giving the WRX a very nice stock suspension. Kevin

[Mono]

[quote name='Tide']Mono, I'm with you. I want more power, whatever it comes with stock, I'll modify it. Even if I had an STi, I'd want more power. Why? Just because. I dont need it, I just like it and I want it. So test drive a Legacy, you'll be impressed. Sure the WHP is lower, but you have all fours hooking up. Good for stoplight dragging (up to the speed limit of course). Need more power? No problem, many tuners will have HP kits coming and we'll be able to see 300-320 chp pretty soon, and for not much money.[/quote] We think alike. 300 hp would be nice.

[Th3Franz]

It was about 50 degrees tonight and I was driving my GT around. The cooler weather definitely made the car faster. Man I love this car...

[Dr. Zevil]

It most certainly does.. cool, damp weather is a recipe for intercooler happiness :D