mjpetty64 Posted October 24, 2017 Share Posted October 24, 2017 Wondering what the easiest way to get a 2.5 into my 99 legacy would be. Currently had an ej22 phase 2 in it. Anybody have any experience with this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Setnev Posted October 24, 2017 Share Posted October 24, 2017 Plug and play swap with any EJ251 from a 99-04 Fozzy, 00-04 Legacy/Outback, 99-01 Impreza RS. You don't even need to swap your ECU. You will, however, need the matching exhaust manifold from the EJ251 or aftermarket headers as your 99 has single port exhaust and the EJ251 has dual port. Secondary thought...why do you want to go EJ222 to EJ251? Most people go the other way around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MilesA Posted October 24, 2017 Share Posted October 24, 2017 The EJ22s are tough motors that seem to go to very high mileage. They are down on power a bit compared to the early EJ25s, but none of them are really powerhouses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Setnev Posted October 24, 2017 Share Posted October 24, 2017 The EJ22s are tough motors that seem to go to very high mileage. They are down on power a bit compared to the early EJ25s, but none of them are really powerhouses. 30 more HP and 22 more ft. lbs of torque. I loved my old EJ222 for reliability but not much else. I love the torque of my EJ251 in my Forester and the EJ25D in my Outback. The two motors have the same HP, but the 251 in the Fozzy has 5 more ft lbs of torque than my Outback. They also weigh the same too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MilesA Posted October 24, 2017 Share Posted October 24, 2017 Good point. I have been thinking about building a junkyard dog Outback with EJ22 that I can just use as a beater camping car and not have to worry about. The job description is basically: "It runs". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Setnev Posted October 25, 2017 Share Posted October 25, 2017 Good point. I have been thinking about building a junkyard dog Outback with EJ22 that I can just use as a beater camping car and not have to worry about. The job description is basically: "It runs". Exactly the purpose of my Forester. It's got 204k miles on, I'm the 3rd owner, well documented maintenance history by the previous owner who bought it at 120k miles. Head gaskets were done right before he got it. It's sole purpose is a reliable backup car, camping vehicle, and to haul a small trailer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo F Posted October 25, 2017 Share Posted October 25, 2017 I've read where phase 2 EJ22's were not as reliable as phase 1's- any truth to that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Setnev Posted October 25, 2017 Share Posted October 25, 2017 I've read where phase 2 EJ22's were not as reliable as phase 1's- any truth to that? Nope. The 22E and 222 are nearly identical. The major difference is the new head design (identical to the 251 heads with the exception of the bore size), thrust bearing moved to number 5 position, and improved lubrication system for the crankshaft. The improved head design helped boost the horsepower to 142 HP compared to 135 HP on the EJ22E. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wtdash Posted October 25, 2017 Share Posted October 25, 2017 I've read where phase 2 EJ22's were not as reliable as phase 1's- any truth to that? No offense to Setnev...but depends on whom you ask. There's a few regulars(mech/tech) on the USMB site that aren't too fond of the P2 EJ222....it's just another EJ251/3, as far as they're concerned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Setnev Posted October 25, 2017 Share Posted October 25, 2017 No offense to Setnev...but depends on whom you ask. There's a few regulars(mech/tech) on the USMB site that aren't too fond of the P2 EJ222....it's just another EJ251/3, as far as they're concerned. None taken... It's true though. I am biased because I have had both the EJ222 and the EJ22E and I've never had a single issue before. The 222 was snappier, but that was because of the reworked head, otherwise the internals are the same sans the crank. There was someone here who built a EJ22D out of a 222 block and 25D heads. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DOHCEJ22E1 Posted October 26, 2017 Share Posted October 26, 2017 No offense to Setnev...but depends on whom you ask. There's a few regulars(mech/tech) on the USMB site that aren't too fond of the P2 EJ222....it's just another EJ251/3, as far as they're concerned. Well, they're wrong, even though the basically layout is EJ251/3. When it comes to the bottom end, it is still very much an EJ22. And they are pretty stout, deserving of the EJ22 nomenclature. None taken... It's true though. I am biased because I have had both the EJ222 and the EJ22E and I've never had a single issue before. The 222 was snappier, but that was because of the reworked head, otherwise the internals are the same sans the crank. There was someone here who built a EJ22D out of a 222 block and 25D heads. I am the one that made such a hybrid (it was actually an EJ20D/EJ222 hybrid, among many other 2.2 hybrids I have constructed), but my thread got screwed over in the Photobucket fiasco, so I will have to allow it to fade into obscurity and make a new one, in which I will reveal a truly awesome discovery. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MilesA Posted October 26, 2017 Share Posted October 26, 2017 ...I will have to allow it to fade into obscurity and make a new one, in which I will reveal a truly awesome discovery.Awesome discovery sounds good. Looking forward to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DOHCEJ22E1 Posted October 26, 2017 Share Posted October 26, 2017 Awesome discovery sounds good. Looking forward to it. Finished it last night. It is under this thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjpetty64 Posted October 26, 2017 Author Share Posted October 26, 2017 Secondary thought...why do you want to go EJ222 to EJ251? Most people go the other way around. Threw a rod bearing in my ej22. Already have a full 2.5" exhaust and dual port headers. I've gotten a good ej251 before for $150. Mainly because It doesn't matter that much, single port heads sound lame, and the added power. It would be worth it IMO. I've tried doing the swap before with an ej251 with no success. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjpetty64 Posted October 26, 2017 Author Share Posted October 26, 2017 Plug and play swap with any EJ251 from a 99-04 Fozzy, 00-04 Legacy/Outback, 99-01 Impreza RS. You don't even need to swap your ECU. You will, however, need the matching exhaust manifold from the EJ251 or aftermarket headers as your 99 has single port exhaust and the EJ251 has dual port. Secondary thought...why do you want to go EJ222 to EJ251? Most people go the other way around. And any of these motors are plug in play in my phase 2 EJ22 car? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DOHCEJ22E1 Posted October 26, 2017 Share Posted October 26, 2017 If you are trying to find a viable 2.5 dual port counterpart, get an EJ253 wherever you can find it for cheap, throw on your crank gear and cam gears, intake manifold and wiring, and she will be a turnkey start car. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo F Posted October 27, 2017 Share Posted October 27, 2017 Well, they're wrong, even though the basically layout is EJ251/3. When it comes to the bottom end, it is still very much an EJ22. And they are pretty stout, deserving of the EJ22 nomenclature. I remember reading about your EJ22D build a while back- very interesting. As I recall, It was quite robust at higher RPM's. I am the one that made such a hybrid (it was actually an EJ20D/EJ222 hybrid, among many other 2.2 hybrids I have constructed), but my thread got screwed over in the Photobucket fiasco, so I will have to allow it to fade into obscurity and make a new one, in which I will reveal a truly awesome discovery. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DOHCEJ22E1 Posted October 27, 2017 Share Posted October 27, 2017 I remember reading about your EJ22D build a while back- very interesting. As I recall, It was quite robust at higher RPM's. Hey Steve, it has been some time! It was an extremely robust engine up until it was destroyed. I have built dozens since then, and my latest project has just been posted up as "EJ22D powered '96 Legacy LSi." I've got some good material in there. Those who told us we couldn't get good N/A power from our EJ22's lied to us. I am 65whp above what a stock EJ22E puts down on a mustang dyno with plenty of room for more power to be extracted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Setnev Posted October 27, 2017 Share Posted October 27, 2017 Yep, any Phase 2 from 99 to 04 will work. Stay away from 05+, those are drive by wire and use and ECM and BCM as they're CANBUS cars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjpetty64 Posted March 19, 2019 Author Share Posted March 19, 2019 A year and a half later and I just got around to trying this swap. Got a motor from an 02 Forester. Everything hooked up just fine; only had to swap a knock sensor and the coolant crossover pipe to get all the sensors to match up. the 2.5 has a couple of extra grounds coming off the block. Got the motor in last nigh and it turns over, but refuses to start. The gas looks good, and I have swapped plugs, wires, and coil. the 2.2 that i pulled ran when i pulled it, and the 2.5 I'm putting in ran before it was pulled. The throttle bodies on the two cars look pretty different. It seems like it's an issue with compatibility since I can not think of anything else. the cam/crank gears had the same number of teeth on both motors, I don't believe it is a timing issue. Any thoughts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wtdash Posted March 19, 2019 Share Posted March 19, 2019 99% sure Subaru changed up the cam/crank gears between '99 and '02- regardless of how they look. It's suggested that they stay w/the car - not the engine. Probably move over the sensors, too. Read up on other Subie sites for more info, as I've not done this..just read it. GL, TD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doublechaz Posted March 20, 2019 Share Posted March 20, 2019 How long has that fuel been sitting? Modern fuel is more sensitive to storage than the old days. I can't use fuel from a jug in the spring if I bought it in the autumn even in a lawn mower. I definitely wouldn't put that kind of crap through my $500 worth of fuel injectors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Osei Posted March 20, 2019 Share Posted March 20, 2019 Did you check the IACV hose? Also, sometimes the crank teeth count is the same but a lobe is different in length. O. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjpetty64 Posted March 20, 2019 Author Share Posted March 20, 2019 Thanks for the replies guys. -I'll swap all the remaining knock sensors/crank position sensor. -The gas is old, but my car ran recently. before the swap. I'll swap the gas but it really should at least fire if there's not significant water. - IACV hose... I'll check it. Should be good to go. It looks like I'll be swapping over crank/cam gears tonight if the gas isn't bad. I had a feeling i might have to do it, but they appeared identical so I figured I'd be all good. I appreciate the input and will let you know how it shakes out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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