Engine rpm related vibration felt in shifter when changing gears

[heiche]

That looks way too loose, although I don't know what the clearance is supposed to be (but surely not 1/4" inch!)

 

I think you're getting closer to finding the problem. Is the big nut on the back of the input shaft (top shaft) still tight? Sometimes they back off and cause many problems. I vaguely remember mine was still staked in place, indicating it hadn't backed off at all, but yet the 5th gear pieces had a lot of play somehow. This was because some parts (5th gear itself in my case) had worn down a lot, which introduced play for the whole assembly. When I replaced 5th gear with a new piece, all of that extra play was gone. Maybe those pieces you found are from something in that area, and since that piece no longer takes up space, there's a lot of extra play, giving that extra clearance on the plate you are asking about in your video.

 

Do you have a shop press? I needed one (thank you harbor freight) to do my 5MT work, but it was something I wanted anyway

[xt2005bonbon]

That looks way too loose, although I don't know what the clearance is supposed to be (but surely not 1/4" inch!)

 

That's exactly what I thought. But then again, I watched this video (see

); you will see that theirs appears as loose as mine . So it may normal after all..

 

 

I think you're getting closer to finding the problem. Is the big nut on the back of the input shaft (top shaft) still tight? Sometimes they back off and cause many problems. I vaguely remember mine was still staked in place, indicating it hadn't backed off at all, but yet the 5th gear pieces had a lot of play somehow. This was because some parts (5th gear itself in my case) had worn down a lot, which introduced play for the whole assembly. When I replaced 5th gear with a new piece, all of that extra play was gone. Maybe those pieces you found are from something in that area, and since that piece no longer takes up space, there's a lot of extra play, giving that extra clearance on the plate you are asking about in your video.

 

I sure hope I am getting closer! I have not checked if the big nut is still tight. It appeared so but did not carefully check. I will though.

But I had the same thought process as you: if a 'washer' or whatever it was broke, then it gave that extra play that should not be there.

 

I think I will have to separate the trans case halves to be sure that there are no debris in there. Although it is really strange cause I changed the oil a couple of months ago, drained it two weeks ago, and there was no big chunk at all on the drain plug. I would surmise that if something broke in the front of the trans (where the gears are), the drain plug would have at least picked up one piece!

 

When you worked on your trans, did you also separate the case halves?

 

 

Do you have a shop press? I needed one (thank you harbor freight) to do my 5MT work, but it was something I wanted anyway

 

I don't, but I think I will get one there too. I also need to press new LCA bushings anyway. It will pay for itself I guess.

[heiche]

Yes, I did split the case. I confess though, it's been several years since I worked on that engine and transmission, and my memory of it is getting foggy.

 

And definitely, as you said, a shop press is great to have for pressing out/pressing in suspension bushings too. You may only use it once in a while, but it sure is nice to have.

[xt2005bonbon]

Yes, I did split the case. I confess though, it's been several years since I worked on that engine and transmission, and my memory of it is getting foggy.

 

It's never too late to get back in the game .

[heiche]

It's never too late to get back in the game .

 

[xt2005bonbon]

update...

 

Transmission case halves are separated. Everything appears just fine and no debris whatsoever here . So debris were only present in the transfer case area and extension case (where the center diff seats).

 

Edit: I think I found the issue!!! Will post a video soon.

[xt2005bonbon]

Here is the video. Let me know what you guys think.

 

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4KHsL8vmLCA]another look at guts of 5mt from subaru outback xt - YouTube[/ame]

[xt2005bonbon]

Here is another one. So basically, yeah a couple of washers within the center diff shattered.

 

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e5D91bJ-xk8]subaru outback xt 5mt center diff---spider gears - YouTube[/ame]

[heiche]

congrats on finding the issue!

[xt2005bonbon]

So you agree with my findings then?

 

Still trying to find the other pieces. Nowhere to be found

 

btw, can this center diff piece be 'upgraded'?

 

I like to do some light offroad and as soon as one wheel comes off the ground, you can't really move forward. I know it is the open diff fault, but I keep hearing this vlsd stuff is better. Would this help? Don't even know if this stuff applies to the center diff.

[heiche]

Absolutely agree with your findings! The pictures you found match up perfectly with the remnants, and you can see how they are missing in yours, along with the huge amount of extra play.

 

Not sure though of where to procure a replacement and/or upgrade though.

[xt2005bonbon]

good to hear.

 

As for the replacement part, it is pretty easy to find a direct replacement. Not cheap though! But not sure about 'upgraded' parts.

[xt2005bonbon]

Interesting.. I want to say they might have come from the center differential, but if you say the gears inside look ok, then I'm not sure..

 

http://subaruidiots.com/subaru-wrx-five-speed-manual-tips-and-tricks/2/

 

btw, quoting you just to say that you were right in the end .

[Flinkly]

i love the giggling in the video when you show your pieced back together washers from the center diff.

 

And congrats on finding the issue! And you have almost all the pieces of your center diff jigsaw puzzle!

[xt2005bonbon]

^Thanks man.

 

Just received the new center diff tonight and a bunch of other parts (seals and stuff). I can clearly see in the new center diff these washers. Also noticed that the bearing that is pressed into the center diff has zero play compared to mine. Mine is quiet but has some side to side play. I'll provide some pics of the new goodies.

 

One question for my audience :

 

I just received the gasket that goes between the transfer case and the case halves. The gasket was folded in the envelope . It appears fine in the end but what do you guys think?

[xt2005bonbon]

Here is another pic of it.

[heiche]

You'll probably be fine unless their is a groove in the gasket once it's flattened out. You could even add a little smear of permatex Ultra Gray to that area as insurance. Alternately you can use ultra gray instead of the gasket, but it makes reassembly of this area a little trickier. I also used ultra gray for the case halves and any other area that called for sealant, including engine work. When I had my 5MT apart I used this as a rough guide, which had some pretty good practical instructions.

[xt2005bonbon]

thanks for your feedback. The gasket does not seem to have any noticeable groove in it. So I think it'd be ok. May use a bit of permatex though.

 

And thanks for the link.

[xt2005bonbon]

Putting this link here for future reference.

 

http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/showthread.php?16706-Limited-slip-installation-instructions-with-pics

[xt2005bonbon]

A couple of questions for you guys..

 

1. After putting both case halves back together, the manual says to perform "Backlash adjustment of hypoid gear and preload adjustment of roller bearing." Do I really have to do this step, knowing that I did not touch at all the shaft which has the hypoid gear?

 

2. I've been having a hard turn cleaning up the left over residues from the paper gasket. Which chemical do you guy use for this?

[Max Capacity]

Would acetone work to clean up that ?

 

I think may want to do the backlash adjustment... I might add to tranny noise if its wrong.

 

Are you thinking about blast plates to help the 5mt shift better ? I love mine.

[xt2005bonbon]

Never answered your question... Yeah thinking of blast plates. Then again, this is the 'family car'... So, kind of low on the priority list.

 

 

Update... Almost done working on the trans until I found this (see video below). what do you guys think?

 

 

Posted this question on another related thread too.

[heiche]

I'm no expert on this subject, but I'd say that this bearing looks fine. I think ball bearings can have that sort of rocking play, but when the outer race is held firmly in place by the case it is held perfectly parallel to the shaft, so it is not allowed to rock that way.

[xt2005bonbon]

Thanks Heiche. yeah that makes sense and I thought the same.

 

For the record, I went ahead and did change a needle bearing (part # 806427060) which is part of the main shaft, just because.

Also changed the input shaft seal. And that's all really as it pertains to the main case.

[xt2005bonbon]

Maybe I should provide an update?

 

Car is back on the road as of yesterday! I put the transmission back in the car 1.5 months ago, but then spent time restoring my rear springs and swaybar. Took forever to do this...

 

Went through some drama last Saturday as well, when it was time to crank the engine. Battery was nice and full but engine sounded like it lost compression. I was afraid that somehow timing was off or something. So checked that, checked spark plugs, etc... Everything seemed fine. Anyway, it took about 20 or so crank as compression returned and engine finally started. Strange... I am a bit worried now. Although it is true that gas has been sitting in the tank for almost 6 months... Thoughts?

 

The car drives fine though, engine starts fine now, no misfire nothing.

 

 

edit: I should also note, regarding the apparent loss of compression, that after I reinstalled the trans, I turned the engine over by hand several times with a gear engaged to make sure the wheels were spinning and stuff. And as I was doing that, at one point it was super hard to turn the engine (probably compression stroke). But after more torque was applied to the crank pulley, it finally kept spinning but was pretty violent...