Track Day advice/suggestions?

[hadvw]

kyb tophats are probly fine.

 

I use a mishimoto on my auto, works fine. No cooling issues when fluids are topped off.

 

motul or ATE synthetic brake fluid - i have a ton extra if you need some.

 

Bridgestone RE-71's are top notch if you can afford em.

 

skip the e85, none of our local tracks provide it at the track. You'd have to bring multiple jugs of it with you to last a day. I just add a couple things of octane booster to my tank just in case. Or you can do like others say and add a couple gallons of the 104+ octane.

 

Try to find a dry day in the spring to go out, summers can be brutally hot.

 

FWIW I may be selling my RCE coils with 9k/9k springs when you're ready for them down the line.

 

Ok, all of that sounds good. Mishimoto with custom trans cooler, I assume? Do you use a thermostat on the cooler? I have all the other parts except that.

 

I'll bring the front brake kit to the meet for you to check them out.

I'm not a fan of EBC brake pads. Carbotech pads are great. Bobcats would be a good rear choice with the front R4S.

 

ATE brake fluid is a great value. I also really like Prospeed RS683. It's the least compressible brake fluid I've found under $50/bottle.

 

Thats a great price for the Michelins. Bridgestone RE71 are the other ones. I need to buy a new set of wheels and tires for street and put my slicks on the SSR comps.

 

You may also want to replace the turbo oil feed line to a braided line if you haven't already done that. Cheap insurance since I have heard of the stock hard line fatiguing and cracking. Oil pressure gauge is nice to have if you don't already have one.

 

Would it be bad to run 225/45-17 PSS on OEM wheels? Just read a review of PSS and how good they are (relatively speaking) in the wet, so I wouldn't even mind running those all year.. Too much sidewall roll with a 17x7 wheel? Go back to 215/45-17?

 

I have an IP&T oil line kit - I think that replaced the line you're talking about? Is there an easy spot to plumb an oil pressure gauge? Just bought a "blemished" Cubbypod..

[boxkita]

Would it be bad to run 225/45-17 PSS on OEM wheels? Just read a review of PSS and how good they are (relatively speaking) in the wet, so I wouldn't even mind running those all year.. Too much sidewall roll with a 17x7 wheel? Go back to 215/45-17?

 

I have an IP&T oil line kit - I think that replaced the line you're talking about? Is there an easy spot to plumb an oil pressure gauge? Just bought a "blemished" Cubbypod..

Here's the part where you are overthinking it.

 

Going to the track is 4 days a year, maybe. If your car doesn't blow up on the street, it won't fail at the track either.

 

However, if you want to get into tires. Get a 2nd set of wheels. Cheapest wheels possible. Get them in 17x8 +45 (+1 sizing for a LGT). Mount a set of 225/45 or 40/17 PSS on them. Its a really good deal. If nothing else, you can run them in the summer and save the AS3 for the winter.

 

The tire theory says you want square shoulders for track setup. A 225 on a 8 inch rim is square, in theory. In reality, not so much. Different makers define 225 tires differently. Look on tire rack to see the spec sheets.

 

However, at this point, in your HPDE career, it only matters that you have tires with sufficient tread depth that hold air.

 

The technical minutae of track days can bury you. Don't let it. Just worry about signing up for your first day, getting your inspection done, getting an instructor, showing up well rested, and having a good time. After that, you can start making the life changing decisions like kid's college fund or new set of Ohlins.

[Th3Franz]

I ran 225s on the stock 7" wide wheels. It was fine for getting started.

The IP&T oil line kit has you covered for the turbo line.

 

You can use the oil galley port where the stock dummy light is near the front of the engine. otherwise you can use the rear galley port for an oil pressure gauge. The stock oil pressure light does not come on until under 10 PSI I think, so it's basically letting you know your engine is done. I removed mine and put my oil pressure sender for my gauge in its place.

[hadvw]

The reason I asked about 225s on stock 7" wheels is because I'm getting new tires anyway. So I'll just get PSS for daily driving this time around. And take 'em to the track with the understanding they might not last the summer. At the end of the summer, I'll figure out about a second set of wheels. And who knows - there might be a wheel sale on in the meantime

 

Got the donut gasket, exhaust hangers and GS TMIC done today.

 

Need to order a new overflow coolant to turbo hose - mechanic noticed it was leaking. Am also going to get a new turbo inlet - got an AVO, but am worried it's going to make me fail smog, and I don't want to keep swapping THAT piece.

 

Also, sway bar reinforcement brackets. Starting to get excited!

[Th3Franz]

did you get a black turbo inlet? would help it stay stealthy

[hadvw]

Yeah, I did get black. Maybe I can try to grind off the "AVO" logo

 

I'll have to give it another go, I guess. I started to one day, and after removing airbox and MAF hose (have gotten good at that part!), couldn't get the first bracket they said to remove to budge at all.. May have to leave it for a professional.

 

Where's a good place around here to go helmet shopping?

[Th3Franz]

The bolt for the stock inlet is tight. I remember taking a breaker bar to that thing. Lol. You can use a sharpie and black out the logo. inlets are supposed to be exempt but most techs don't know that.

 

How big is your head? I have a new medium Bell you can try on for size. Otherwise I've gone to motorcycle shops I the past to try on for size and then find the SA version of the helmet i want.

[hadvw]

-installed new exhaust hangers, donut gasket

-re-installed GS TMIC, probably need to re-tighten a few things soon. Found that a LOT of screws were loose from when I put the OEM stuff back in November to pass smog...

 

-cranked the Konis up to max this morning. Definitely stiffer, but I like it. May still be enough life left in 'em.

-ordered rear sway brace (I have Cobb/Hotchkiss bars F/R), Fumoto valve

-about to order 3mm spacers

-getting new Pilot Super Sports in 225/45-17 on the OEM wheels tomorrow. Got $63 per tire back due to early wear on the AS3s. If I skip the "road hazard", it'll be around $440-450 OTD.

 

Edit: any suggestions for a reasonably-priced oil pressure gauge? I'll have space for one more gauge - boost? I already have a digital boost gauge.. Anything else that would be good? Coolant temp? Oil temp?

[boxkita]

I was never a fan of gauges in the cockpit, even when I had the AIM MXL headunit. Idiot lights tell you all you need to know.

 

If you are watching gauges, you can't watch the track/road. By the time you see the oil values are wrong, its too late to do anything.

 

I'd put the Konis at the level you'll use on the street. If max hard is street setting, then so be it. Extra hard setting on the track will affect handling adversely.

[hadvw]

I'd put the Konis at the level you'll use on the street. If max hard is street setting, then so be it. Extra hard setting on the track will affect handling adversely.

 

I was just playing around to see how worn out they were. Is roughly "middle" a better setting?

[Th3Franz]

-installed new exhaust hangers, donut gasket

-re-installed GS TMIC, probably need to re-tighten a few things soon. Found that a LOT of screws were loose from when I put the OEM stuff back in November to pass smog...

 

-cranked the Konis up to max this morning. Definitely stiffer, but I like it. May still be enough life left in 'em.

-ordered rear sway brace (I have Cobb/Hotchkiss bars F/R), Fumoto valve

-about to order 3mm spacers

-getting new Pilot Super Sports in 225/45-17 on the OEM wheels tomorrow. Got $63 per tire back due to early wear on the AS3s. If I skip the "road hazard", it'll be around $440-450 OTD.

 

Edit: any suggestions for a reasonably-priced oil pressure gauge? I'll have space for one more gauge - boost? I already have a digital boost gauge.. Anything else that would be good? Coolant temp? Oil temp?

 

Wideband O2 gauge? With the amounts of crap I see on the roads out here I'm surprised you don't get the road hazard.

 

Cheap oil pressure gauge: https://www.rallysportdirect.com/part/pressure-gauges/prs-216bfwaopsm-psi-prosport-oil-pressure-gauge-electrical-w-sender-amber-white-52mm

I run a Defi racer oil pressure gauge which is a little more expensive.

 

I respectfully disagree with boxkita. The gauges aren't there to stare at, but it's worthwhile on a straightaway to glance at them and just do a quick check of things. I put my gauges up high to keep my head up and vision far ahead for this reason. Still need to wire the new gauge to use with my new wideband controller though.

[Cornerz]

They seem to fade very quickly - one to two longer stops on the street, and I notice they're fading. Also, at times during harder braking, it seems the car pulls to one side. I tried the stoptech pads, liked them in between HPS (which sucked) and Bobcats (my favorite so far).

 

In general, the brakes seem worse than any of the brakes I had on any of my VWs. I'm a "brake overkill" kind of guy.

 

Part of it is the ease of swapping pads as well - not having to unscrew each caliper seems like it would make pad swapping significantly easier.

Are you sure your fade issue is pads and not fluid? I ran Stoptechs hard in our time attack championship and had no issues, but I had a fresh fill of Ford Motorsport heavy duty dot 3 fluid. Really high dry boil point.

[boxkita]

I was just playing around to see how worn out they were. Is roughly "middle" a better setting?

 

I put my bc c/o in the upper 1/3. A bit softer in back. I never change them unless carrying a large load long distance.

 

I'd advise picking a standard route, then adjusting the settings until it feels comfortable.

[hadvw]

Are you sure your fade issue is pads and not fluid? I ran Stoptechs hard in our time attack championship and had no issues, but I had a fresh fill of Ford Motorsport heavy duty dot 3 fluid. Really high dry boil point.

 

It's totally possible it's fluid. Definitely not ruling that out.

 

Also noticed a slight but consistent squealing from the rear end today - I think the brakes are dragging slightly. I think it's time for new rotors/pads, but it may also be time for new calipers..

 

About to pick up the car with PSS..

[hadvw]

Tire pressure measuring - this important. Buy a small air compressor that plugs into your cigarrette lighter. $15 at Harbor Freight. Get their little tire gauge $4.

 

Are there usually regular AC outlets available at the track? Before I bought a 30-gallon compressor, I had a small AC "tire inflator" (around the size of a gallon jug) that did a decent job, and was a lot faster than those 12v compressors (I've used those before). It now lives next door at my father-in-law's house - I could borrow it any time. I also have a 400w inverter that might work, but I don't know how much that would stress my battery.. Could always run the car while running it :-)

 

As for tire gauges: do you prefer rotary or stick? I have a bunch of sticks around that I mostly got for free. These days, I usually use the one built into the air compressor inflator gun I have.

[boxkita]

Are there usually regular AC outlets available at the track? Before I bought a 30-gallon compressor, I had a small AC "tire inflator" (around the size of a gallon jug) that did a decent job, and was a lot faster than those 12v compressors (I've used those before). It now lives next door at my father-in-law's house - I could borrow it any time. I also have a 400w inverter that might work, but I don't know how much that would stress my battery.. Could always run the car while running it :-)

 

As for tire gauges: do you prefer rotary or stick? I have a bunch of sticks around that I mostly got for free. These days, I usually use the one built into the air compressor inflator gun I have.

 

As a rule, tracks don't let you connect to their power. Thunderhill had power, at the 25 hour, however, that might have been an extra cost option.

 

A little cigarette lighter powered compressor is enough. You aren't adding 10's of psi, only a couple. Don't overthink this part. It's really this easy.

 

The sticks, in my experience, are useless. I started with the gauge I used for my mtn bike. The HF circle gauge is $4 or less if you get it on sale. The longacre gauge with bleed valve came in handy when i was racing to reset pressures quickly during pit stops. Admittedly, I bought because it was geeky and I had a coupon.

 

A quick note on spending money: going to the track costs lots of money & time. Buy/use items that reduce costs and save time. The more sleep you get before you get on track and the less time you spend messing around in the pits, the more track time you get per dollar. Overly complex setup only save if you have a second person helping you. With just you, make your setup in the morning really simple. More stuff to unload and setup, means less time to get things done.

[Rhitter]

With just you, make your setup in the morning really simple. More stuff to unload and setup, means less time to get things done.

 

That's really good advice. I went and I just chucked all my tools in the back. Luckily in this area a lot of tracks are close by (don't need to get up super early to get to them). But, it's a pain, empty glove box, center box, remove floor mats, pull out all tools and pile them somewhere, remove rear mat, start to remove rear spare, decide it doesn't make any difference....

 

If you can just pull up and remove a box or two of tools, set tire pressure, it will make it much easier.

[hadvw]

As a rule, tracks don't let you connect to their power. Thunderhill had power, at the 25 hour, however, that might have been an extra cost option.

 

A little cigarette lighter powered compressor is enough. You aren't adding 10's of psi, only a couple. Don't overthink this part. It's really this easy.

 

The sticks, in my experience, are useless. I started with the gauge I used for my mtn bike. The HF circle gauge is $4 or less if you get it on sale. The longacre gauge with bleed valve came in handy when i was racing to reset pressures quickly during pit stops. Admittedly, I bought because it was geeky and I had a coupon.

 

A quick note on spending money: going to the track costs lots of money & time. Buy/use items that reduce costs and save time. The more sleep you get before you get on track and the less time you spend messing around in the pits, the more track time you get per dollar. Overly complex setup only save if you have a second person helping you. With just you, make your setup in the morning really simple. More stuff to unload and setup, means less time to get things done.

 

Totally understand/agree with all that.

 

HF compressor is now $34.99 - Amazon/Sears/etc have lots of choices at that price range too - and I already have that AC compressor. Which is why I asked - you're always telling me to buy less now, wait until I've been to the track.. So just asking if I could make it work for a few trips..

[boxkita]

The a/c compressor is too much hassle, because you need a generator, too. Leave it at home.

 

Borrow one from someone, too.

 

I did say don't buy anything yet you bought a bunch of stuff. Now, you're balking at the one thing you really do need? :-) Air pressure on a lgt wagon is touchy. Getting a simple compressor (cigaretter lighter powered is simplest), a dial tire gauge that you can read, and tire chalk; will have the biggest effect on how your car handles on track day.

 

When you get to the track and you've unloaded your car and gotten everything all arranged, ie under a tarp, take all the tire pressures and write them on the top of your fenders in tire chalk, left to right, each corner is unique. Now draw 3 lines from the tread down to the rim 120 degrees apart on each tire, preferably near the wear triangles (http://www.1addicts.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=1039963&stc=1&d=1402157553). This will show you how much roll-over you have.

 

Now go do your session. As soon as you get off track, check your tire pressure and write the number on your fender, right next to the cold number. Do all 4 tires first, as quick as you can. Once done, then look at each tire's chalk marks and note where the chalk is worn away. Now view this line in relation to the triangle. If its below the triangle (line is closer to the rim than tip of triangle), you need more air. If its above the triangle, you need less air. Add/subtract 2 psi at a time. Do it when the tires are still hot (so before the bench racing starts). The linked pic is pretty close to be correct.

 

Just before you go, check all your tire pressures and write this value on your fender.

 

Rinse and repeat until day's end. By the end, you should have a pretty good idea what tire pressures (cold) to set next time.

 

That ^^^ is why you want the little compressor. Because messing with a big unit all day long gets old. If you have just the compressed air tank, you can use that. Regardless, be sure you understand how to setup, quickly add air, and dismantle the system before you get to the track.

 

Note: The process described above is how you determine the best tire pressure to run. Otherwise known as "how to get the most number of track days from your DD tires".

 

Note2: the tire chalk wipes off easily with goof-off or a clean microfiber cloth depending on the air temp. If you have a good wax job, it'll be easier.

[hadvw]

The a/c compressor is too much hassle, because you need a generator, too. Leave it at home.

 

Borrow one from someone, too.

 

I did say don't buy anything yet you bought a bunch of stuff. Now, you're balking at the one thing you really do need? :-) Air pressure on a lgt wagon is touchy. Getting a simple compressor (cigaretter lighter powered is simplest), a dial tire gauge that you can read, and tire chalk; will have the biggest effect on how your car handles on track day.

 

Not balking, just trying to understand - I didn't see any $15 compressors anywhere. The $8.99 HF "inflator" has horrible reviews, even for HF, and has a tag that says "not for vehicle tires". The next thing is $35, so I looked around and found these at Amazon. They all include a digital gauge (easier to read!) and let you set a pressure cutoff (either higher or lower, it seems) and have decent reviews. To an inexperienced grasshopper like me, that sounds like that feature would help with the below procedure? If I set it at 38 before, and need a bit more, set it at 40 this time. I can't imagine the digital gauge to be significantly worse (when adding the "read it fast part" into the mix) than the HF dial gauge?

 

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01MT0MITD

 

https://www.amazon.com/EPAuto-Portable-Compressor-Digital-Inflator/dp/B01L9WSTEG

 

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01H6G3B0Q

 

When you get to the track and you've unloaded your car and gotten everything all arranged, ie under a tarp, take all the tire pressures and write them on the top of your fenders in tire chalk, left to right, each corner is unique. Now draw 3 lines from the tread down to the rim 120 degrees apart on each tire, preferably near the wear triangles (http://www.1addicts.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=1039963&stc=1&d=1402157553). This will show you how much roll-over you have.

 

Now go do your session. As soon as you get off track, check your tire pressure and write the number on your fender, right next to the cold number. Do all 4 tires first, as quick as you can. Once done, then look at each tire's chalk marks and note where the chalk is worn away. Now view this line in relation to the triangle. If its below the triangle (line is closer to the rim than tip of triangle), you need more air. If its above the triangle, you need less air. Add/subtract 2 psi at a time. Do it when the tires are still hot (so before the bench racing starts). The linked pic is pretty close to be correct.

 

Just before you go, check all your tire pressures and write this value on your fender.

 

Rinse and repeat until day's end. By the end, you should have a pretty good idea what tire pressures (cold) to set next time.

 

According to this:

I should just be able to grab some sidewalk chalk from my kids? Got lots of that laying around.

 

Instead of writing down the pressures with tire chalk, could I get some painter's tape (maybe in a light color) and a marker/Sharpie? Seems easier to clean up - just peel the tape off.. Car is black, so not too worried about black marker leaking through .

 

Also, should I start off higher, say at 44 all around, to avoid significant rollover before my first adjustment? As opposed to going out with my 35-37 street setting?

[Rhitter]

I started off at 45 (cold) all around with my 225/55/17 DWS. This is what they looked like by the end of the day.

http://i.imgur.com/cs6UdrV.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/HOAN1JR.jpg

[hadvw]

So.. is that good, expected wear? How would you adjust the pressure?

[Rhitter]

So.. is that good, expected wear? How would you adjust the pressure?

 

I should of had a bleed valve pressure monitor and I would have reduced pressure as the day wore on. I filled them up to 45 at 55 degrees. My last session it was 85 degrees + out, so who knows what exactly the pressure was. They were for sure overfilled by the end of the day.

 

But I will lean on others with more experience to say what was wrong with those pressures.

 

I think Boxkita's advice is good. It's just a lot to do your first track day. Even if you aren't doing it every session some amount of monitoring and tracking it is helpful.

 

The PSS are going to be less inclined to roll-over than 225/55 DWS, I would start with lower PSI and monitor it in some abbreviated version of Boxkita's advice.

 

Also, something that was super helpful for me personally is I got a subscription to iRacing and I drove Sonoma raceway over and over again in the configuration of the Track day. Sure the car is going to be different, but it's super helpful for visualizing the track, recognizing tricky corners, understanding the racing line, etc.

 

There was one corner that I consistently spun out and hit the wall on in iRacing. I took it really easy at the corner on the track day. Another member who was with us didn't. And he spun out and hit the wall - exactly like I did many times in the video game.

[hadvw]

Also, something that was super helpful for me personally is I got a subscription to iRacing and I drove Sonoma raceway over and over again in the configuration of the Track day. Sure the car is going to be different, but it's super helpful for visualizing the track, recognizing tricky corners, understanding the racing line, etc.

 

There was one corner that I consistently spun out and hit the wall on in iRacing. I took it really easy at the corner on the track day. Another member who was with us didn't. And he spun out and hit the wall - exactly like I did many times in the video game.

 

Interesting point. I already have Dirt 3, Dirt Rally and Assetto Corsa (and a G27) - wonder if there's a Sonoma/Thunderhill for those? Or Project Cars, which is often available cheap? I'm thinking Thunderhill, because all the Sonoma events I've seen don't have a "rookie with instruction" session. Laguna Seca seems a little more advanced (i.e. not suited for a rookie)?

[Rhitter]

I went to Leguna Seca with for the Skip Barber driving school. Drove the Forumla Fords (small open wheeled race cars) and Mazda Miatas. As long as you have have instructor it's a great course to start on. It has significantly better run off areas than Sonoma.

Sonoma is really a take it easy course and just be on the track. If you push it, you will end up in one of the many many walls.