pinesol Posted September 13, 2016 Share Posted September 13, 2016 Hi All, I've got an ongoing braking issue with my car and am going to be replacing the calipers and moving to Goodridge 24220 brake lines. I know the consensus seems to be that for street driving, the stock brakes are fine; If not for my braking issues, I would agree. But since I am going to be replacing anyways: - Has anyone with a 5th gen successfully moved to the Cadillac Brembos as referred in this thread? - If so, do these brakes fit under the stock 18" lgt wheels? The price seems right for this, but I don't quite have the money to spend if it won't work. That is to say I am pretty sure the brakes will install and work on my car, but I can't be buying new wheels right now just to accommodate this swap. Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarang Posted September 13, 2016 Share Posted September 13, 2016 Well that is interesting! In for more info. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GTEASER Posted September 13, 2016 Share Posted September 13, 2016 From what I understand, you have to drill out one of the caliper bracket mounting holes on your hub. I personally wouldn't do it. http://legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php/cadillac-ats-brembo-caliper-upgrade-your-subaru-251912.html What are these braking problems you are having?? GTEASER's 2012 Legacy GT - Sold GTEASER's 2009 XTeaser - Sold GTEASER's 1992 Legacy SS - Sold Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pinesol Posted September 13, 2016 Author Share Posted September 13, 2016 The drilling part doesn't look too bad having watched a YouTube video of someone performing the installation on a WRX, but I digress. Since shortly after purchasing the car last Summer, I have had consistent shaking felt through the steering wheel while braking. To try to resolve the shaking, I replaced the pads and rotors a while back with I can't remember which specific pads and Powerslot rotors. In retrospect I probably should have just used Centric Premium Blanks, but Powerslot and Centric are the same company, so it should be fairly high quality stuff. After initial installation and bedding, shaking was minimized, but still present. Some time later, I had the rotors turned thinking maybe I just got unlucky with the production batch, but shaking persists. When working on the car recently I noticed that the interior of the calipers is pretty rusty in the piston area. Since the lines and calipers are the only remaining brake components aside from the master cylinder, I may as well upgrade at the same time as repair. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarang Posted September 13, 2016 Share Posted September 13, 2016 Yeah that is a commitment. Here is their install vid: skip to 10:18 to see the drilling. He also taps the lower hole. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FLlegacy Posted September 13, 2016 Share Posted September 13, 2016 I think at worst you will need a small spacer, but personally I would just add a 20mm spacer and not worry about it. Although a good spacer will cost about 1/3 to 1/2 what a set of konig wheels from discount tires costs less installation, but I am sure you could haggle... There are also spacers of unknown quality on ebay for around $100. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ellesedil Posted September 13, 2016 Share Posted September 13, 2016 I had considered going with the Cadillac Brembo route, but it required a little more modification than I would have liked. It wasn't an issue of "that's too difficult" and more of a "I don't really want to modify that part" and "I'd like to avoid installing a bracket to make it work." So, I picked up a lightly used set of 2014 STI Brembos for all 4 corners instead. My impression from the thread is that the OEM rims would still have clearance issues with the spokes, but we won't know for sure until someone tries. At least spacers can remedy that. Didn't someone file down the tops of the calipers a bit to get them to clear some 17" wheels? If so, then the spokes and caliper face are probably the only clearance concern you'd have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NVAKeith Posted September 13, 2016 Share Posted September 13, 2016 OP, could you have rust on the hub preventing one of the rotors from mounting flush? http://www.brakeandfrontend.com/rotor-runout-cause-and-correction/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pinesol Posted September 13, 2016 Author Share Posted September 13, 2016 OP, could you have rust on the hub preventing one of the rotors from mounting flush? http://www.brakeandfrontend.com/rotor-runout-cause-and-correction/ I should have mentioned. I have replaced the hubs (and wheel bearing) and have replaced the front LCAs. I'm in Virginia, but the car is originally from New York and a bunch of the underbody components were pretty rusty. Aside from shocks/struts, the front suspension is almost entirely new. None of these had any effect on the brake shaking that has been experienced. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nads Posted September 13, 2016 Share Posted September 13, 2016 Seized, worn or stuck caliper guides and/or pins will do what your feeling. Also a seized caliper piston can shake too. Was any of that checked or replaced? I've also seen tires do this too, at certain speeds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pinesol Posted September 13, 2016 Author Share Posted September 13, 2016 Seized, worn or stuck caliper guides and/or pins will do what your feeling. Also a seized caliper piston can shake too. Was any of that checked or replaced? I've also seen tires do this too, at certain speeds. The guide pins appear to be in pretty good shape. The grease looks good and they move in/out without any binding. I'll admit my troubleshooting steps have been less-than-stellar but at this point I'm pretty content to just replace the calipers to (hopefully) put it to bed. With that in mind, may as well upgrade, right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iammatt Posted September 13, 2016 Share Posted September 13, 2016 Hi All, I've got an ongoing braking issue with my car and am going to be replacing the calipers and moving to Goodridge 24220 brake lines. I know the consensus seems to be that for street driving, the stock brakes are fine; If not for my braking issues, I would agree. But since I am going to be replacing anyways: - Has anyone with a 5th gen successfully moved to the Cadillac Brembos as referred in this thread? - If so, do these brakes fit under the stock 18" lgt wheels? The price seems right for this, but I don't quite have the money to spend if it won't work. That is to say I am pretty sure the brakes will install and work on my car, but I can't be buying new wheels right now just to accommodate this swap. Thanks! Just for your edification, I upgraded to slotted rotors and hawk hps pads, as well as a brake fluid flush, and i've been extremely pleased with the stopping strength and fade resistance of this setup. i don't track my car, but for daily commute that has lots of highway speeds - it's a been a great upgrade, and not very expensive. my shop even talked me out of SS lines, which i was planning on doing with the upgrade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GTEASER Posted September 13, 2016 Share Posted September 13, 2016 How many miles on the car? Could also be worn tie rods. GTEASER's 2012 Legacy GT - Sold GTEASER's 2009 XTeaser - Sold GTEASER's 1992 Legacy SS - Sold Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pinesol Posted September 13, 2016 Author Share Posted September 13, 2016 How many miles on the car? Could also be worn tie rods. Car has just under 90k miles, and both tie rods were replaced with Subaru genuine parts in April, followed by an alignment job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GTEASER Posted September 13, 2016 Share Posted September 13, 2016 Did you do the inner tie rods? GTEASER's 2012 Legacy GT - Sold GTEASER's 2009 XTeaser - Sold GTEASER's 1992 Legacy SS - Sold Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FLlegacy Posted September 13, 2016 Share Posted September 13, 2016 Did you do the inner tie rods? I didn't think rack and pinions had inner tie rods... Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337 using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pinesol Posted September 13, 2016 Author Share Posted September 13, 2016 Did you do the inner tie rods? I did not do the inner tie rods - just outer. I suppose is something else for me to consider. It would really suck if after replacing every brake component it ends up being related to the steering. I see Rockauto has Moog inner tie rods for only 17 a piece, but I'd surely need another alignment after. Or Beck/Arnley kit for 28 comes with replacement boot as well. Definitely something to consider. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wrxwhit Posted September 13, 2016 Share Posted September 13, 2016 What??? Every rack has inner tie rods, cmon guys!!!! If you buy a new or reman rack, they typically come with them or you can buy separate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GTEASER Posted September 13, 2016 Share Posted September 13, 2016 I didn't think rack and pinions had inner tie rods... Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337 using Tapatalk http://parts.subaru.com/p/Subaru_2010_Legacy25L-TURBO-6MT-4WD/TIE-ROD-COMPLETE-GEAR-BOX/49245122/34160AE000.html GTEASER's 2012 Legacy GT - Sold GTEASER's 2009 XTeaser - Sold GTEASER's 1992 Legacy SS - Sold Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pinesol Posted September 14, 2016 Author Share Posted September 14, 2016 It is settled, I'll go ahead and pick up inner tie rods from RockAuto and the tool to change them from Harbor Freight and will measure from the rack to the knuckle prior to replacement to get as close as possible. They don't look too bad to check, but if i'm going to have the wheels off and suspension apart again I'd rather just get the new ones and swap em out. If no change, I'll continue suspecting it is my brakes. Thanks guys! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FLlegacy Posted September 14, 2016 Share Posted September 14, 2016 I would suspect the brakes as well, checking for play in the steering should be pretty easy though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nads Posted September 14, 2016 Share Posted September 14, 2016 How have your tires been wearing? Bad tie rods typically cause the inside of the tire to wear. Is the vibration under all braking conditions? Does just the steering wheel or the whole car? Can you feel it in the pedal? When you had the rotors on the car turned, was it an on car lathe?n If the calipers are rusted into he bore then the piston could be getting bound. Even if they move that doesn't guarantee the move freely and to full range. Same for the pins, they maybe good but the guides they ride in may not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pinesol Posted September 14, 2016 Author Share Posted September 14, 2016 How have your tires been wearing? Bad tie rods typically cause the inside of the tire to wear. Is the vibration under all braking conditions? Does just the steering wheel or the whole car? Can you feel it in the pedal? When you had the rotors on the car turned, was it an on car lathe?n If the calipers are rusted into he bore then the piston could be getting bound. Even if they move that doesn't guarantee the move freely and to full range. Same for the pins, they maybe good but the guides they ride in may not. Tires are wearing pretty evenly as far as I can tell. I've rotated them several times so it would be hard to say definitively. It vibrates more at higher speeds and mostly tapers off by the time I'm under 5-10 mph. I feel it in the steering wheel primarily, but sometimes when it shakes more than others you can feel it elsewhere. Typically passengers don't notice it, but they may just be less attentive. I'm not certain of the turning process that the shop used, but I have had them turn rotors before and it completely resolved warped-rotor-related shaking in these instances. And that was my thinking as well. The car stops pretty well compared to other cars I've had. If not for the shaking I'd have no complaints with the brakes. Either way, I'll keep with my plan I think. I've been replacing parts over time for peace of mind anyways, and inner tie rods aren't that big a deal. Also I'll have the tool so if I ever need to do them on my other cars it'll be even easier. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GTEASER Posted September 14, 2016 Share Posted September 14, 2016 I vote for the inner tie rods, and possibly the ball joints if they haven't been replaced yet. If you're not feeling it in the pedal, and feeling it only in the steering wheel, is it under braking only, or just while cruising? GTEASER's 2012 Legacy GT - Sold GTEASER's 2009 XTeaser - Sold GTEASER's 1992 Legacy SS - Sold Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pinesol Posted September 14, 2016 Author Share Posted September 14, 2016 I vote for the inner tie rods, and possibly the ball joints if they haven't been replaced yet. If you're not feeling it in the pedal, and feeling it only in the steering wheel, is it under braking only, or just while cruising? Ball joints were replaced at the same time as LCAs - they came from Subaru pre-installed. There is a very mild shake while cruising at certain speeds, but one of the tires is out-of-round very slightly, so it makes sense. It is on the rear currently, and doesn't seem to impact the steering wheel, which primarily shakes only while braking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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