Is my paint ruined or is there something I can do?

[Pako]

Well dang it. Apparently no one uses the PC for polishing, no one has any pads in stock. Since my pad exploded (don't ask), I'll have to wait for my pad order from Autogeeks to get here.

[OCDetails]

I use the PC for polishing. Well, I used to until I bought the Flex 3401, but the PC still does the trick if you use a strong enough compound and the right pad. It is mostly for light to medium damage though. Heavy damage like this takes a pretty high level of skill and the right pad/product combination. If you have used the PC enough to blow out your pads, then you can probably handle the job. Which pads and product are you going to use on it?

[Pako]

Honestly not sure. It was one of those 2am online orders that I will undoubtedly regret later. Thinking back on it I will be using Pinnacle XMT #4 then #1 then glaze. I have various pads coming, Yellow, Orange, White and Black. Whether or not these products will cure the problem, I will still benefit from these products with both of my vehicles with their ongoing maintenance plan. I can get a natural gas heater for the garage at cost and have access to certified installers as a reasonable price so if all goes well, I will have a heated garage for winter applications as well. I am tired of two things....ugly cars and winter road chemicals that eats the finish off of anything it touches.

[laz]

Good deal, and for the love of God do not use degreasers to wash your car!

 

X

[Pako]

I know, I know.... Got some Meguiar's Gold Class Car Wash to have on hand for the next washing. I will keep the Simple Green around for when I want to strip the grease off the floor.

[mattg]

I wouldn't wash my whole car with simple green, but I doubt it would hurt the paint if it was diluted properly. I have however sprayed it on the front of my car full strength (car was wet) to help scrub the bugs off.

[Gire]

Sheeeet, some actual car soap at the local Pep Boys (or whatever you Yanks have down there) goes a long way.

 

Who cant afford a 10 spot for a bottle of car specific soap...

[Pako]

Sheeeet, some actual car soap at the local Pep Boys (or whatever you Yanks have down there) goes a long way.

 

Who cant afford a 10 spot for a bottle of car specific soap...

 

Lets see.... Instructions say 4 cap fulls per gallon of water. I am guessing that is about $.30 of product per wash. I don't know man..., might have to clear the purchase with the misses.

[Gire]

Don't believe everythIng you read my man...

[OCDetails]

Honestly not sure. It was one of those 2am online orders that I will undoubtedly regret later. Thinking back on it I will be using Pinnacle XMT #4 then #1 then glaze. I have various pads coming, Yellow, Orange, White and Black. Whether or not these products will cure the problem, I will still benefit from these products with both of my vehicles with their ongoing maintenance plan. I can get a natural gas heater for the garage at cost and have access to certified installers as a reasonable price so if all goes well, I will have a heated garage for winter applications as well. I am tired of two things....ugly cars and winter road chemicals that eats the finish off of anything it touches.

 

I'm not sure that XMT1 is going to do much on the haze that XMT4 causes. That stuff is pretty abrasive. It will take at least XMT2 in order to polish that haze down. I rarely have a use for XMT1 unless I'm just trying to polish off wax and really light marks on a white car or something. XMT2 is pretty much my 'go to' polish for everything else. With the right pad it can handle pretty much anything. But XMT1 is really a light light light polish. You may have to rely a lot on the cutting pad and then go over it again with a lighter pad to take care of the haze. So plan on polishing it three times. Once with 4 and a cutting pad, then once with 1 and a cutting pad, and then 1 again with a lighter polishing pad.

[Pako]

I'm not sure that XMT1 is going to do much on the haze that XMT4 causes. That stuff is pretty abrasive. It will take at least XMT2 in order to polish that haze down. I rarely have a use for XMT1 unless I'm just trying to polish off wax and really light marks on a white car or something. XMT2 is pretty much my 'go to' polish for everything else. With the right pad it can handle pretty much anything. But XMT1 is really a light light light polish. You may have to rely a lot on the cutting pad and then go over it again with a lighter pad to take care of the haze. So plan on polishing it three times. Once with 4 and a cutting pad, then once with 1 and a cutting pad, and then 1 again with a lighter polishing pad.

 

 

That's sound advise, if I can believe what I'm reading.... (looks over at Gire)

 

Seriously though, I appreciate it.

[OCDetails]

My pleasure. I gotta keep my Mountain Time Zone brothas hooked up.

[Pako]

Well, while I am waiting for my pads and XMT polish, I tested a small spot with rubbing compound, you know, the nasty stuff that you only want to use as a last resort? I was able to knock down the blemish a bit. With a little work, I have no doubt I could eliminate all of it. I need to be really careful at this point not to compromise the clear or I will have a nasty repair bill on my hands.

[Brady]

I'm going to back up a minute here on the dish soap. Just for clarification, OCD ... I thought you once told me using Dawn was ok if one were planning on doing a full detail from start to finish.

 

Specifically, I thought you said it was fine to use as a pre-treatment for correction ... something like:

 

Wash with Dawn

Clay

Polish

Seal

 

Outside of that, always car specific wash.

 

Did I miss on that?

[OCDetails]

I have no doubt I did tell you that once. Using Dawn is a pretty old school technique though. But even thought it is old school, if you can find the old blue version without any skin conditioners or anything extra in it then it is a very effective way to strip off wax. Of course, if it has been more than two months since you waxed your car, then there isn't any wax left on the surface anyway, so it isn't really necessary. And if you are going to be polishing the paint after claying it then there isn't any chance that the wax would survive that anyway. So I'm revising my recommendations and now just tell people to skip the Dawn or any dish soap as a washing agent and just use normal car wash soap. There are too many out there on the market now with lotions and scents in them that just aren't going to do any good for your car. I haven't seen a normal un-froo froo'd dishsoap on the shelf for a really long time anyway. Dawn (and specifically Dawn) was only recommended because it was the only straight dish soap that you could use on your car without it smelling like a potpourri of flowers afterwards.

[Pako]

Well, my pads finally arrived today so it was time for me to go outside and see what kind of damage I could do. I started with a little test area and expanded it to about 2/3's of my roof.

 

I'm pretty happy with the results. I was nervous about taking too much clear off, and I definitely took some off (I think), but it seems there is enough to go around this time. Next time maybe not, who knows.

 

 

Before

http://i.imgur.com/fJ3lD.jpg

 

After

http://i.imgur.com/DEVFC.jpg

 

 

So what finally worked for me was Turtle Wax Rubbing Compound, you know....that nasty red stuff? Yep, true story.

 

• Started with that on my heavy cutter yellow pad.
  
• Then XMT4 on my orange pad.
  
• XMT1 on my black pad.
  
• Pinnacle Polisher on my white polisher pad.
  
• finally wax.
  

It took a good while to get it right. I actually went through that whole process once but wasn't happy with the results so I went back. Used way more rubbing compound product and slowed my passes down. Some spots were really bad that I addressed by hand.

 

 

 

That portion of the roof took about 2.5 hours. Knowing what I know now, That section would take maybe an hour. I figure the hood will take a solid 1.5 to 2 hours and the trunk maybe an hour. I will keep each pad on until that step is done which will help. Like I said, tonight was more of an experiment before I unleash all of my attention on the horizontal surfaces.

[wengermi]

like said earlier, dish soap strips the wax off your car. the only time that is really needed is for painting the car so the paint sticks when you try to blend it into other panels. also wax is good for 6-8 weeks and sealant lasts 4-6 months. meguiars nxt 2.0 is marketed as a wax but its actually a sealant.

[OCDetails]

like said earlier, dish soap strips the wax off your car. the only time that is really needed is for painting the car so the paint sticks when you try to blend it into other panels.

 

Hopefully you aren't just washing the car before painting it. The process of prepping for paint includes steps that are a hundred times more effective than anything you could wash it with, so dishsoap really shouldn't be part of the equation anymore. A lot has changed since that was a common practice, so it is something people should probably get out of the habit of doing. It was recommended before the VOC changes in 2004/2005 that changed a lot of how paint is applied. I would always suggest using whatever works, but in the case of dishsoap there are a lot of other things that work better and cause less harm.

[Pako]

Well, hopefully I can finish the roof tonight and maybe do the trunk. I wish there was another rubbing compound that would apply on my cutting pad easier. I have resorted to scooping a glob with a towel and rubbing it off on the bottom of the pad. A nice squirt of something as strong would be nice.

 

Wish me luck. I hope it all turns out as nice as I am pretty excited about the possible outcome.

[OCDetails]

It is hard to squirt something that thick and abrasive. You'd need a cap sort of like a tooth paste tube in order to squirt it out. What I typically do is unscrew the cap, squeeze the product to the top, and then just dot it on the pad. You don't want to use too much because it will just fill up your pad and make it less effective, but you don't want to use too little either. I'm not sure how to explain how much to use, but I'm sure if you just keep an eye on how it is working then you'll get the feel for it.

 

It looks like you've done a great job so far. I think I see a bit of haze in the reflection of the bulb, but that could just be a smear or something. If your are seeing any fuzziness to the reflections around light bulbs then you still have some haze to contend with. If you are still seeing the haze after using the lighter polishes then you might want to try bumping up the cutting level of the pad just a bit. If that doesn't work then shoot me a PM and I'll find a small bottle and send you some XMT2 and you can try polishing it out with that. I'm pretty sure that will do the trick combined with your black polishing pad.

[Pako]

Nope, no smears it is still a bit hazy. Upon closer inspection I could actually see where I could knock it down a little more. I am a little apprehensive to get too aggressive for fear of getting past the clear, but am told from the body shop that unless I am wet sanding, there isn't anything I should be concerned about.

 

I do think the jump from XMT4 to XMT1 is too quick. I will look locally for maybe a Meguiar's product that will be in the middle somewhere that will be close the XMT2. Shipping time from Autogeek about killed me before.

[wengermi]

3m is way better. Try 3m rubbing compound. It's 12 dollars for a normal size bottle. It should take the haze out. It comes in a black bottle

[OCDetails]

Nope, no smears it is still a bit hazy. Upon closer inspection I could actually see where I could knock it down a little more. I am a little apprehensive to get too aggressive for fear of getting past the clear, but am told from the body shop that unless I am wet sanding, there isn't anything I should be concerned about.

 

I do think the jump from XMT4 to XMT1 is too quick. I will look locally for maybe a Meguiar's product that will be in the middle somewhere that will be close the XMT2. Shipping time from Autogeek about killed me before.

 

Meguiar's Ultimate Compound is something you can find locally. It is a really great polish that fits somewhere in the middle of the scale. I've had great success with it and it polishes away it's own haze brilliantly. Just keep working it till it starts to spit out little clumps of polish. That is how you know it is done doing its thing.

[Brady]

Let me say that you have done some awesome work. Regardless of whether you knock out the haze or not, the roof looks incredible comparative to what you started with.

 

Now hopefully your wife will appreciate the time and money spent on car care.

[Pako]

@Brady,

 

Thanks. It is way more work and effort than I thought. I'm sure there are some better tricks that would expedite the process but I haven't found them yet. LOL, my wife could really care less. She's happy with the vehicle as long as it starts and gets her down the road. I have taken sole responsibility for our vehicles. I came in last night after working on the rest of the roof saying, "man, I just don't know if it's worth the effort...." with her response being, "exactly". HAHA I know she secretly care....

 

As for the effort, I taped everything off and started in on the rest of the room. While I was looking at the 3M products, I noticed that they had a heavy duty rubbing compound. Almost $20 for the bottle, but if it cut my time down from using the turtle rubbing compound ($3.99) it would be worth it. Well let me tell you, it was a mess to use and it wasn't enough to knock the blemish down, it barely touched it. Upon switching back to the turtle product, I should have washed the car, re-taped and started again, but I started right in with the Turtle rubbing compound. The rest of the process through all the steps left a greasy film on all of the compounds that I couldn't buff out. It was a bit of a mess. Needless to say, I won't be using that 3M product for this type of application again. I spent close to 4 hours lastnight on the rest of the roof and only got it down to about 65% compared to the 95% knockdown on the previous attempt. Besides wet sanding, there has got to be an easier solution. If I come across it, I will be sure to share.