EL34 Posted October 8, 2011 Share Posted October 8, 2011 I am buying a 97 Legacy Outback AT from a buddy of mine this Monday. This will be my first Subaru, I have been driving a S10 chevy truck since 1991. My buddy has owned the Outback and driven it for about 30,000 miles It now has 155K I am not sure what the previous history of the vehicle is He purchased it from a Subaru dealer, so I guess it was a trade in. He has changed the oil and filter with synthetic religiously at 4000 miles and had the dealer service it a couple times. Valve cover gaskets were done for some reason, probably chasing the oil leak mentioned below. I purchased a Haynes manual on Amazon. Should be here soon. I have been looking at all the head gasket videos on Youtube. I checked out the stickies at the top of the board I will be going over the vehicle when I get it. I do know that it has an oil leak and I am thinking that it may be the separator plate, and it may have a plastic plate. [ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ByYR4asTnjQ]Subaru Separator Plate - YouTube[/ame] Anywho, I am looking for a general To-Do list of things to go over on the Outback. I am pretty sure I need to dig in and have a look at the timing belt, idlers and water pump. Other than that, can anyone chime in with other things I should look out for? Thanks so much Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I Donated broknindarkagain Posted October 9, 2011 I Donated Share Posted October 9, 2011 They Haynes book as well as the factory service manual (there is a link in the Engine FAQ thread for it) should be all the instructions for DIY you will ever need. When I first get a car, I usually flush all the fluids. If the car has over 75k miles on it, I do a timing belt as well...unless i know for sure that its already been done. -broknindarkagain My Current Project - Click Here COME AND TAKE IT "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnegg Posted October 9, 2011 Share Posted October 9, 2011 i would go to the dealer and ask for any service history they may have. it would be nice to know what all was done when the timing belt was changed. belt and pump or just belt, any idlers? and of course when was it done. there is a chance that they will have some info. the timing belt is due every 105k miles or 105 months. and it sounds like you are the kind of guy that keeps cars for a long time. so if you were to do the timing belt now you would be good for 100k miles or 9 years, which ever comes first. the timing belt was probably done before your buddy got the car so he won't know what was done. kudos on doing your home work. not many people do this much when buying. obviously the head gaskets are the big thing but there isn't much you can do about them. they will either fail or they won't. they have been done or they haven't. but all in all think you will enjoy the car. if you do a lot of hiway driving, you might consider removing the cross bars on the rack, unless you use them a lot. i here it can improve you mileage. be sure to test drive the car in tight slow circles looking for binding. maybe not a deal killer, but better to know than to be surprised 2 days later. it could put a strain on your friendship. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I Donated broknindarkagain Posted October 9, 2011 I Donated Share Posted October 9, 2011 You can also register at http://www.mysubaru.com and it will show you any kind of dealer service the car has had in the past. -broknindarkagain My Current Project - Click Here COME AND TAKE IT "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnegg Posted October 9, 2011 Share Posted October 9, 2011 oil leaks oil pump o-ring on the front of the engine crank seal (do with oil pump) cam seals oil sep plate on the rear valve cover gaskets - done most of these get done when you do the timing belt. i don't usually replace the rear main seal unless it is really leaking badly. they usually don't leak until some replaces them . and if the oil sep plate is leaking badly, you might consider pulling the engine and doing the timing belt and rear plate all at once. a lot of work for a plastic plate but it is the only solution. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EL34 Posted October 9, 2011 Author Share Posted October 9, 2011 Aesome guys! Thanks I'll check with the dealer and the on line link. Yeah, I grabbed the service manual early this morning that was linked here on the forum. The Haynes manual should be here next week. Picked one up for Under $12 with shipping on Amazon. I did plan on doing all the fluids. My buddy has run synthetic oil in it for the last 30k miles. He is giving me the oil and a filter with the vehicle, it's due right now for another change. it sounds like you are the kind of guy that keeps cars for a long time Yeah, I do. My S10 is an 89, but I got it off a dealer lot brand new in 91. It was loaded with the Durango package, R700 Automatic tranny, factory air, tilt steering, cloth interior and many other goodies, but.......... they somehow ordered it with a 2.5 - 4 cyl engine. No one wanted it. It sat on the lot two years without selling. I picked it up at a discount and it has been and awesome truck ever since. It has 160K and it is 20 years old. As far as highway miles go??? No dice, I work at home and maybe only drive 50 miles a week at most. I put less than 4000 miles a year on my truck since I moved to the mountains of Western, NC in 2001. Most all the mileage was put on when I lived in Florida. The reason I am getting the Outback is because I get stranded if it snows here. (west of Asheveille in the mountains) I got stranded several times the last few years, but no more. The S10 is a piece of crap when it comes to traction and steering on slick surfaces, but it's great for hauling trash, getting loads of mulch and fetching lumber from Lowes, so I am keeping it, but I will be driving the subbie most of the time. I am going to get under the subbie and have a good look in good light. I can tell if the oil leak is the separator plate. (Or coming from that general area). I'll also be having a look at the cylinder head on the driver side. I have seen a bunch of pics that show the most common spot the gasket fails. There should be some funk on the heads. I do know that the coolant is very clean, no oil residue and it does not smell of hydrocarbons, so at this time, my buddy and I believe the head gasket situation is not an issue. He would not knowingly sell me a problem car, he's a good guy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnegg Posted October 9, 2011 Share Posted October 9, 2011 the 96 - 99 ej25 head gaskets usually leak internally, not externally. but if the coolant is clean you should be good, for now. there is a chance that they have already been done. and there isn't really anything you can do to prevent them from going bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EL34 Posted October 9, 2011 Author Share Posted October 9, 2011 Usually it's from the combustion chamber side over to a cooling port hole, and it corrupts the coolant but......... I thought I had also seen some videos where there was a bit of an oil leak at the very botton of the head where the gasket had failed. Could be wrong, but anywho, you are right, what can you do except keep an eye on things and catch it as early as you can. Thanks for the info, appreciate it. edit: Ok, this guy says it can also be a oil leak [ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pQkw2gcWl1Y&list=FL6QMFC-nnVtRyjCIIwNnBqQ&index=6]Subaru Auto Repairs: Head Gasket Repair; GT Automotive, South Jordan, UT; 801-302-0912 - YouTube[/ame] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stasis Posted October 9, 2011 Share Posted October 9, 2011 the 96 - 99 ej25 head gaskets usually leak internally, not externally. but if the coolant is clean you should be good, for now. there is a chance that they have already been done. and there isn't really anything you can do to prevent them from going bad. Have they not made a revised head gasket for the ej25? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jab83 Posted October 9, 2011 Share Posted October 9, 2011 They have... He's talking about for the stock ones, that are garbage . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stasis Posted October 9, 2011 Share Posted October 9, 2011 like crusty paper? lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jab83 Posted October 9, 2011 Share Posted October 9, 2011 Stasis. your gonna end up baned. lol. . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stasis Posted October 9, 2011 Share Posted October 9, 2011 Lol for what? I'm just comparing what the old revision of HG would be like compared to the new version since it looks like he'll probably be changing them anyway Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jab83 Posted October 9, 2011 Share Posted October 9, 2011 LOL. I'm just saying. The mods are ok with the crap in superwide since it was made just for spam and goofing around . but they have and will ban for gunking up someones thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EL34 Posted October 9, 2011 Author Share Posted October 9, 2011 It's ok, not a problem. My thread is not gunked up as far as I am concerned Just happy to have someone taking a look and throwing out some info. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnegg Posted October 9, 2011 Share Posted October 9, 2011 the head gaskets on the 00 - 03? ej25 leak externally. some leak coolant and some leak oil. and subaru ''strongly suggests'' a $1.75 4 oz. bottle of coolant ''conditioner'' from the dealer to help prevent the coolant leak. it is just about the only thing i have seen sold at the dealer that is not over priced.and surprise, surprise, it works. it can prevent and in some cases stop a head gasket coolant leak. for 10s of 1000s of miles. too bad the conditioner doesn't do any good on the 96 -99 engines. but absolutely nothing will prevent the explosive exhaust gas pressure from escaping the combustion chamber into the coolant once the gasket gives up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jab83 Posted October 9, 2011 Share Posted October 9, 2011 I say better safe then sorry. Its not crazy hard to do the work your self. if you dont mind pullling the engine. lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EL34 Posted October 10, 2011 Author Share Posted October 10, 2011 I am ok with yanking the engine and doing all the work myself I kind of look forward to it actually As long as it's not in the dead of winter Been many years but I have dropped and rebuilt a bunch of VW beetle and Karmann Ghia engines. Just have to purchase or update a few tools that are getting old. I have most all the metric stuff I need but I don't have a torque wrench. There a Lowes nearby, I like the Kobalt stuff and I don't need much of an excuse to buy tools. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnegg Posted October 10, 2011 Share Posted October 10, 2011 FYI: when buying a torque wrench, get one that goes down to 10 ft lbs. when doing head gaskets on the 90s engines you have to torque to 132 in lbs, that's 11 ft lbs. if you don't you will need two torque wrenches, in order to do gaskets. the water and / or oil pump bolts call for an even lower torque, i think. but i usually do them by feel, in a star pattern, with 1/4 inch drive socket. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EL34 Posted October 10, 2011 Author Share Posted October 10, 2011 Thanks, did not know that Appreciate all the great tips I should have the car here later today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I Donated broknindarkagain Posted October 10, 2011 I Donated Share Posted October 10, 2011 johnegg, I see you revised your torque wrench theory after you found out I had one that went down to 10 lol -broknindarkagain My Current Project - Click Here COME AND TAKE IT "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnegg Posted October 10, 2011 Share Posted October 10, 2011 yeah, live and learn. the only one i have ever used is the one i have. i guess i am torque limited. don't tell the women folk, it might hurt my reputation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
subikid90 Posted October 10, 2011 Share Posted October 10, 2011 Check out CDI torque wrenches, I have two 3/8" torque wrenches from them and love them. They are made by snap on but a little cheaper. I have the 10-100ftlb and 30-150inlb models. -Subikid90 1997 Legacy GT 5spd & EJ251 w/EJ25D heads ~10.5CR 1998 Legacy GT Limited waiting for EJ22T hybrid swap Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EL34 Posted October 11, 2011 Author Share Posted October 11, 2011 I didn't want to toss a bunch of money into Torque wrenches. I have to get two of them to cover the range I'll need and it's something I rarely ever use. These cheapy Neiko wrenches get good reviews by the users [ame=http://www.amazon.com/Neiko-8-Inch-Foot-Pounds-Automatic-Torque/dp/B000MB53ZE/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1318332680&sr=8-3]Amazon.com: Neiko 3/8-Inch 10-80 Foot-Pounds Automatic Torque Wrench: Home Improvement[/ame] If I used them all the time, I get a better brand name I don't even remember the last time I needed a torque wrench. The last one I remember using was the old school type with a pointy rod and a scale gauge Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnegg Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 a lot of the auto parts stores have a tool loaner program. you buy the tool, it's used, and you get a full refund when you return it. the one you get may not go down to 10 ft lbs, but at least you won't have to buy 2 of them, just the smaller one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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