APRace or other

[CapnJack]

Up until now, I've been letting others tune my car, but watching over their shoulder and also doing A LOT of reading on here. I'm at the point where my 07LGT will not be my daily driver anymore and I will be able to make some massive strides on it as far as upgrades go without compromising my transportation to/from work. (ie turbo, fuel system, drive train, etc.)

 

I'm looking at starting to really dig into the ECU of my car to see what it's doing, work with Infamous on e-tunes, learn, ask questions, and make minor changes. Here's my question... Am I ok to use Accessport Race to do this, or would I be better off using EcuFlash and Romraider. I already have the APRace program, AP, etc so it would cost me very little to get into it that way. However, I notice that many others on the board here use the EcuFlash/Romraider with the Tactrix cable for the 07+ models. I would like to be able to talk apples to apples comparisons with everyone. Is there enough differences in the APRace that it would cause problems?

 

Looking for opinions.

[CapnJack]

Well, I may have answered my own question. I just tried to hook up with APRace and it appears Jorge is married to my ECU, so it will not allow me to connect. (Jorge at P&L is the one that tuned my car last)

 

Can I get in and log and tweak this map with EcuFlash/Romraider when I make my upgrades?

[NSFW]

I'm guessing you have an APv2? The APv1 is pretty much compatible with EcuFlash as far as I know, but the v2 'locks' the tune you can't read it with EcuFlash.

 

You can datalog with RomRaider but you'll have to talk with Jorge about getting a copy of your tune when you're ready to make changes to your tune.

 

AccessTuner Race and RomRaider give you the ability to tune all of the critical tables but there are a few things that each can do and the other can't. Nothing very important though, as far as I know. You'll just have to mentally translate some of the table and parameter names.

 

What RomRaider calls the "Ignition Advance Multipler," Cobb calls "Dynamic Advance Multiplier," for example.

[CapnJack]

Correct, I have the APv2. Maybe I would be better using ATRace? As you mentioned, it sounds like either will do the same thing.

 

I have a feeling talking to Jorge will be a problem. I don't believe he is with P&L anymore. Looks like I may be starting fresh... I think I can pick apart what he did in my tune using the AP datalog features and backwards engineering it. Guess it's worth a shot anyway...

[NSFW]

Cool. Last I heard, ATRace was free for V2 owners, so there's no real reason to buy a Tactrix cable just for DIY tuning. You might be able to contact Jorge via NASIOC, I think he still posts there. But even if not, reverse-engineering the tune via datalogging will give you a big head start.

[cryo]

I have personally used both romraider/ecuflash and atr race software and find the atr race software to be much quicker when trying to dial in boost and timing, Plus the hotkeys are great. I would rather tune using ATR but thats a personal opinion.

 

Dave

[CapnJack]

Cool. Last I heard, ATRace was free for V2 owners, so there's no real reason to buy a Tactrix cable just for DIY tuning. You might be able to contact Jorge via NASIOC, I think he still posts there. But even if not, reverse-engineering the tune via datalogging will give you a big head start.

 

Yes! ATRace is free. So far I'm liking it A LOT. Although I don't have much to compare it to. I did some 3rd gear pulls tonight and I theoretically should be able to start building throttle tables and setting my boost targets, right? Question though on this. What's the best way to do this? Should I take the values 1:1 from my logs and input them into the proper spots on the tables or is there a quicker way of interpolating the data and putting it in? I'm basically building off of Cobb's Stage 2 OTS map and inputting my protune data from the logs over top of it. (I logged requested torque, boost target, engine speed, etc).

I am by no means going to put this map in my car until I am extremely comfortable with it (several months of learning, datalogging, researching). Just trying to learn and get comfortable at this point.

I guess I should explain what I'm trying to do in the above by tweaking the Cobb map... I'm basically trying to reconstruct the current locked map that I have now to see if I can do it and feel comfortable in the tuning environment. I have a feeling by doing this, I'll have a better understanding of what I'm doing and how things work when I start to add fueling, turbo, etc. down the road. Any and all constructive criticism is welcome with the exception of "you don't know what your doing, get lost". I will be the first to admit that I don't know exaclty what I'm doing, but I want to learn and ask questions in the hopes others can learn too. If I make mistakes, I pay the consequences and hopefully someone can learn from that too. After this car is no longer my daily driver in a couple of months, it will become my hobby. I could go on, but that's my basis.

 

I have personally used both romraider/ecuflash and atr race software and find the atr race software to be much quicker when trying to dial in boost and timing, Plus the hotkeys are great. I would rather tune using ATR but thats a personal opinion.

Dave

 

Good to know, thanks Dave. So far I'm liking the quick keys for datalogging. I've a long way to go, but am excited for the trip!

[NSFW]

Aiming to re-create your current tune, based on an off-the-shelf tune and data logs, seems like a pretty good way to get into tuning.

 

But, don't try to copy numbers from your old data logs into your new tune. Many of the parameters that you can log (probably most) will include compensations in addition to the tables that you're editing. If your log shows 20 degrees of timing advance, that might be 18 degrees from the main timing tables plus 2 degrees from a compensation somewhere. If you put 20 degrees into the main tables you'll end up with 22 degrees total.

 

So instead, just look at whether the values in your new logs are higher or lower than the values in your old logs, and tweak the tables to bring the new values closer to the old values, in 4-5 steps.

 

And always look for knock in your data logs - in every pull. You might start knocking before you reach the same timing or AFR or boost as the current tune, if one of the three overshoots the target, or if there's a compensation in the old tune that's not in the new tune, or if the weather changes, or whatever.

 

I tend to make timing conservative, then spend most of my time adjusting fueling until it's 11.0-11.25, then boost (you can use a manual boost controller to speed that up - it's like cheating), and then add timing until it just starts to knock, then back it down a couple degrees. Then change something under the hood and start over.