Summer Tires 2011

[Monwells]

I was thinking about doing Firehawk Oval Indy 500 tires, cheap with good ratings. Anyone have any thoughts?

[RJS5689]

I was thinking about doing Firehawk Oval Indy 500 tires, cheap with good ratings. Anyone have any thoughts?

I saw them and very quickly ruled them out. I read some reviews about them that I didn't like. I also heard if you value wet traction, these are not the tires for you. They're really cheap though, so that's a plus.

[BigTDogg MA]

My review of the Continental DW on Tirerack.com:

 

I love my car, and I know that my tires are the only thing between me and the road, so I researched tires until I was sleep deprived. I wanted a great tire, but I didn't want to spend $1400+ for them. So I read many articles about these tires, and was eager to try them. Continental has been making tires since the pneumatic tire was invented, so I knew they were a legit company with vast knowledge. At about $980 for a set of 4 (255/35ZR18 F + 285/30ZR18 R), they were in the middle of the pack price wise.

 

Now for the review: These tires stick as well as my Bridgestone S-03s did, and as anyone who has owned S-03s knows, those are some very sticky street tires. If memory serves, the Bridgestone's and crisper turn in, but barely. But the DWs best the S-03s in every other arena. They last longer (per the 340 UTQG vs 180-280 for most other tires in this class) and weigh less (6lbs total over the Michelin PS2, and a whopping 16lbs less than the new Bridgestone RE050A Pole Position!!). Keep in mind that the weight is also unsprung weight, at the furthest radius from the axis of rotation. This helps with the lively handling.

 

Driving in the rain I had total confidence based on my research, and the real-world trials didn't disappoint. I could take on and off-ramps nearly as fast as I could in dry conditions. I tend to avoid deep puddles for fear of hydrolocking, but I did hit a few here and there, and even with the wide sizes I'm running, the car never wavered. They ride very smooth (@34PSI) on the highway and don't tramline at all, another negative the S-03s had with the stiff sidewalls is that they picked up every groove in the road.

 

Around town they're comfortable; as comfortable as 18's can be with pot-hole-infested roads. Once they're warm they're much friendlier, but they tend to be hard for the first few miles. I've found this to be true with all Max Performance Summer tires I've owned. Only 1300 miles in but I love them already.

 

No, they don't corner as well as the S-03s, but they are predictable in turns and once they take their set, they stick well. Granted I was running relatively huge tires, but they have made me happy now for about 2500 miles.

[Legend]

^^ Nice review and thanks for contributing! I'm actually leaning towards the Contis again at this point. I spoke with a guy at tire rack who does performance testing of their tires and has driven the new Pilot Super Sports. He says the new PSS will be better than either the DW or the PS2, but priced around $238. He also said given the choice he thinks the DW's are better than the PS2's. Add in the fact they are lighter, last longer, and cheaper than the PS2's, he said that he cannot advise buying the PS2's... especially at that price and the fact they are being discontinued soon. He did say for track use the PS2's are better than the Conti's, but not by much and the Conti's are better everywhere else. Wish the PSS was available now and less than $200.. I'd be all over those.

 

The Flip HD offer (with Conti's) expires in about 2 weeks, so I'll probably do something soon.

[Marcazi]

I am looking really hard at the Conti's too, I may have to order soon!

[TSiWRX]

The Pilot Super Sports are awesome - I got a chance to experience them in Dubai, and yeah, they are what they are: Michelin's put good money into them, and they've got the TUV data to prove it. But they're pricey, and for anything short of a track-exclusive and occasional weekend-pleasure cruise car, I honestly don't know that you'd want to spend that much - all I can say is that if I had a 458 or a track-day toy M3...or a Gumpert...the PSSs would definitely be on my car.

 

But back to reality:

 

Truthfully, Legend, I don't know why you're putting any emphasis, at all, on the UTQG treadwear. Yes, the fact that the PSSs treadwear ratings are so much better than that of the PS2s is super impressive (particularly in light of the performance of the tires), but this particular "trait" (as it really can't be called much more) is something that is only valid when referenced within that same marque. A UTQG treadwear 200 tire from one manufacturer may well last four times as long as another company's 300 or even 400.

 

In your shoes, I'd go with your other criteria.

[brilliant sleeper]

I run the Hankook Ventus and it is a great street tire in wet and dry. The treadwear is respectable as well.

[krzyss]

One more note about UTQG.

Remember Potenza RE92? They are 140. And they last into 40K.

UTQG number is a number picked by manufacturer for whatever their marketing reason as long as it meets minimum rating obtained by manufacturer testing. A lot of leeway in getting this magic number. Just ignore it.

 

Krzys

[Legend]

Regarding the UTQG number, alright guys you convinced me to pretty much ignore it. I will, but bottom line is want 20-25k miles out of this set of tires.

 

Well the new PSS is supposed to be "lighter" but in the 225/40/18 it weighs in at 24lbs. The PS2 is only 22lbs and the DW is only 21lbs.

 

I've decided on the DW. Most of my spirited driving as well as drag racing is in straight lines. A lightweight tire is very important to get the most out of my setup (again, I'm running 18's so I'm already dragracing with a handicap).

 

I think I'll get the miles that I want and the price is right. When cornering hard and/or if I do a track day I'll probably be wishing I had gone a different direction. But those times will be far outnumbered by dragracing days and daily driving 2nd gear pulls in and around the city. It is still tirerack.com's #1 pick in Max Performance Summer tires (Oct 2010).

 

Runners up in my search: 2nd place - PS2, 3rd place - V12

[TheOneDoubleN]

I've never seen someone take so long to make a decision on tires.....

 

Having used the DW's on my LGT, I'll just say, don't plan on getting 20-25k miles out of them if you're drag racing and doing "spirited driving". Count on more like 5-15k depending on inflation and rotation. I don't drag race, I ran 45/43 f/r psi to get any kind of steering response because of the uber soft sidewalls.

 

The fact that it's rated #1 on tire rack means nothing for two reasons.

 

A) There aren't that many reviews posted yet because it's a new tire

B) Believe it or not, Tire Rack is biased in their tire ratings, testing, and product selection. There's a reason the DW's have had all sorts of incentives for purchasing a set

 

C) There's a reason they have a ridiculous "treadwear warranty" that if you actually read into the terms, is pretty damn useless.

 

I'll put my plug in again for Toyo Proxes 4 as an affordable, proven performance all season tire, but you probably won't consider it, because Tire Rack is one of the only tire companies that doesn't carry Toyo (there's a reason for that too).

 

Tire Rack is not the god of tire reviews, it really isn't. Reviews posted there need to be taken with a very LARGE grain of salt. I'm not saying it's a bad company; I've bought tires there before and have been very happy with their service, but people get this idea in their heads that they are the undeniable experts on tires. No, what they really are is the undeniable expert on tire marketing.

[Legend]

I've never seen someone take so long to make a decision on tires.....

 

:lol: It took me at least twice as long to decide on my Wrangler tires, FWIW. Lots of needs to balance there b/w the 5.5" lift, off-roading, city-driving, towing my boat, wanting to be good on ice.. etc. That took me FOREVER but I made the perfect choice. Goodyear Duratrac in 33x12.5's. Hell, the LGT summer tire decision is easy comparatively.

 

As for tirerack, it is #1 based on tests, not reviews (although maybe it is #1 based on reviews.. not sure). Second, I am not buying thru tirerack but a local small dealer who beat tirerack's and discount's price.

 

What size DW's did you run, BTW? I'll be disappointed if I don't get 20k miles. Wish there were more options 22lbs or less, but there is only a small handful. Don't want a 24-25lb. tire.

[TSiWRX]

:lol: It took me at least twice as long to decide on my Wrangler tires, FWIW. Lots of needs to balance there b/w the 5.5" lift, off-roading, city-driving, towing my boat, wanting to be good on ice.. etc. That took me FOREVER but I made the perfect choice. Goodyear Duratrac in 33x12.5's. Hell, the LGT summer tire decision is easy comparatively.

 

+1.

 

My summer tires decision is much easier, and I spend virtually no time on it because I don't engage in motorsports with this vehicle.

 

But my winter tire decision? I start on that pretty much as the fireworks are going off, on the 4th of July.

[TheOneDoubleN]

What size DW's did you run, BTW? I'll be disappointed if I don't get 20k miles. Wish there were more options 22lbs or less, but there is only a small handful. Don't want a 24-25lb. tire.

 

Stock size on stock rims, 225/45-18 ran at 45/43 f/r, 50% of tread gone after 3,000mi, then I got a puncture and replaced the entire set with the Proxes 4's, which I've had on several cars with great results. I drive normally in LA with 20mi round trip commuting during the week, and relatively regular weekend visits to the malibu canyons where I am pushing quite hard, but not to the point where i'm screeching tires or dive bombing into corners on the brakes and ripping off tread.

[TheOneDoubleN]

I really don't think you should make your decision based on a difference in 2lbs of tire weight. Compared to your reaction time, the speed and quality of your launch at the strip and your 60ft time, 2lbs on each wheel isn't going to mean much when you're talking about a 40-60lb rim/tire combo on the car. If you were looking for that extra half a tenth a second after you've upgraded everything else on the car and reduced all the weight you can, then yes, I would consider the 2lb difference. But from what it sounds like you're describing, the weight difference is negligible and something you probably really won't notice. If a tire is 2lbs lighter than another tire, but it has less grip, is the weight savings worth it? Not necessarily, the weight of a tire doesn't mean squat if you can't get traction with it. A stickier heavier tire would make more sense in that scenario. I can also attest to the fact that the proxes 4 have far more grip than the continentals, having compared them directly back to back on the same car now.

[Instanced]

Marangoni Mythos - $72/EA + $20ish for shipping. I've read good things about them from older BMW threads... I'm a sucker for no name brand tires that cost dirt.

UTQG: 280-AA-A

Speed Index: Y

found on Tire-Easy.com

[dingbang]

I love my Hankook Ventus--wet/dry as long as it's not freezing and no snow/ice on the ground. ;D Mine were expensive though b/c I'm running 245/35/18

[spartan]

Marangoni Mythos - $72/EA + $20ish for shipping. I've read good things about them from older BMW threads... I'm a sucker for no name brand tires that cost dirt.

UTQG: 280-AA-A

Speed Index: Y

found on Tire-Easy.com

 

 

I actually might look into those as well. There a lot of good reviews about grip/ noise level for those tires. Plus my total would come to $387!

[Legend]

Bought the Conti DW's today and they are on. Didn't really plan on doing it today as I just had the wife's car in for an oil change, four-wheel alignment, and tire rotation at Firestone (total bill was $13 thanks to a $20 coupon and my complimentary gold rewards membership).

 

Asked the guy if he could get the Conti's. He said he could have them in an hour and his out-the-door price bested the others at $862 (includes 9% tax, $68 in road hazard, disposal fee, mount/balance, etc.) Firestone has a promotion also right now that if you apply and are instantly approved for their no fee 0% interest for 6 months credit card they'll give you 10% off. So I got $82 off the bill paid $774. I'll get a Flip Ultra HD from Continental (deal expires 3/12) which sell for $169-$189. Yay. Even if I don't want it I can get $150 for it on eBay... so my effective price for the tires with all bells and whistles and all was $624. Pretty awesome deal.

 

As for the tires.. pebbles stick to them like crazy just like my old Kumho's.. did two 2nd gear pulls on the way home.. butt dyno says I lost torque vs. my winter 17's and Blizzaks but these are much quieter that the Blizzaks at WOT.... except all the pebbles I'm spraying all over the wheelwells. Changing to any summer 18 would have the same results. Will review them in the next month or so.

[TheOneDoubleN]

Hope you enjoy your "sport tuned" touring tires!

[Marcazi]

any updates Legend?

[tito_b0y]

Bump for update!

[Legend]

Ok fine I'll update. I'm not a tires aficionado though so my update won't be all that helpful to some guys.

 

I've had the Conti DW's for 6 weeks and maybe put on 800-1000 miles. 95% of my driving is in-town under 55mph in city streets. I still haven't done any hard cornering with the tires, so I really can't comment. Sorry, I know that is probably what most people would be curious to know, but I guess it kinda reinforces why the absolute best cornering tire was not a big priority for me.

 

But remember what a big priority was? DRAG RACING, that's right. So I took my brand new 18's to the drag strip already once this season. My concern in a new summer tire was picking up something that would not hurt me on the dragstrip. That is, I did not want a heavy tire, as many of the posters recommended. A major factor in my choice of the Conti's was weight. I have an aftermarket turbo that is slower to spool than stock and I live at 5400' altitude and do mostly city driving. I did not want the additional penalty of heavy tires taking away my fun of flooring it in 1st and 2nd gear. Yes, rotating mass makes a big difference.

 

So I'm at the dragstrip and the first run of the day the track guys must not of thought any AWD guys were there because they sprayed the ENTIRE staging area with water, not just the burnout box. So I had to go through water and launch. I did the smokiest AWD burnout I've ever done... and obviously not that great of a run.

 

I've probably done 50 runs at the dragstrip over the years. AND GUESS WHAT? The very next launch I get my best 60' time ever on brand new 18's of all things. (42psi rear, 38psi front) I had loss of power issues in 4th gear (another story altogether) that probably cost me 0.1-0.2s and 1-2mph, but nonetheless I beat my previous best e.t. barely (was 12.49). And I got my best all-time 1/8 mile trap speed and e.t., which tells you that I got up and moved out - the new tires did not hold me back. Awesome.

 

Other than the dragstrip, the tires have been quiet. Looks-wise they are unique... and kind of blah. Overall I'm happy.

 

Timeslip (this is at Bandimere Speedway, elevation 5800' altitude):

 

http://beeez.com/lgt/1243at111.jpg

[TheOneDoubleN]

Ok fine I'll update. I'm not a tires aficionado though so my update won't be all that helpful to some guys.

 

I've had the Conti DW's for 6 weeks and maybe put on 800-1000 miles. 95% of my driving is in-town under 55mph in city streets. I still haven't done any hard cornering with the tires, so I really can't comment. Sorry, I know that is probably what most people would be curious to know, but I guess it kinda reinforces why the absolute best cornering tire was not a big priority for me.

 

But remember what a big priority was? DRAG RACING, that's right. So I took my brand new 18's to the drag strip already once this season. My concern in a new summer tire was picking up something that would not hurt me on the dragstrip. That is, I did not want a heavy tire, as many of the posters recommended. A major factor in my choice of the Conti's was weight. I have an aftermarket turbo that is slower to spool than stock and I live at 5400' altitude and do mostly city driving. I did not want the additional penalty of heavy tires taking away my fun of flooring it in 1st and 2nd gear. Yes, rotating mass makes a big difference.

 

So I'm at the dragstrip and the first run of the day the track guys must not of thought any AWD guys were there because they sprayed the ENTIRE staging area with water, not just the burnout box. So I had to go through water and launch. I did the smokiest AWD burnout I've ever done... and obviously not that great of a run.

 

I've probably done 50 runs at the dragstrip over the years. AND GUESS WHAT? The very next launch I get my best 60' time ever on brand new 18's of all things. (42psi rear, 38psi front) I had loss of power issues in 4th gear (another story altogether) that probably cost me 0.1-0.2s and 1-2mph, but nonetheless I beat my previous best e.t. barely (was 12.49). And I got my best all-time 1/8 mile trap speed and e.t., which tells you that I got up and moved out - the new tires did not hold me back. Awesome.

 

Other than the dragstrip, the tires have been quiet. Looks-wise they are unique... and kind of blah. Overall I'm happy.

 

Timeslip (this is at Bandimere Speedway, elevation 5800' altitude):

 

Congrats on the new et! Having had these tires for a few thousand miles before getting a flat and replacing the set, I find it interesting they perform so well at the strip.

 

When I had the DW's, I ran 44f/42r because the sidewalls were so soft, just in my day to day driving, and also in the malibu canyons, trying to get speeding tickets. I probably locked up and slid a few too many times and wore the tires to about 40% in about 3,000 miles. I did find them to be pretty grippy, just not performing in the handling department, a bit too squishy for my taste. I did just swap my proxes 4 with pirelli pzero nero's, only have 400 miles on them (took a 250mi drive today with lots of twisties) and so far I'm definitely satisfied.

 

I'm interested to see the wear on your tires through your ownership. What do they look like after their first trip to the strip? Can you post some pics if you get a chance?

[TheOneDoubleN]

[Deadleave]

Hey looking for advice....

 

I love and hate my direzza starspecs

 

Good traction but no thread life, and picks up every little nail, screw, small children on the road. Stuck with 3 good tires and 1 with unpatchable slow leak.

 

Instead of getting another set, looking for alternatives.

 

 

Im currently looking at something less now, price and performance.

 

225 45r 17's

 

Continental Ext DW as above (seems like high rated tread life)

 

Kumho Ecsta SPT

 

Firestone indy 500 ? rated high, but too small a sample for data to be valid

 

Hancook V12 cheap with $60 MIR

 

NON-Auto sports use, just looking for good dry and wet traction and ability to hold high speed turns.