5EAT "Mad Scientist" Idea & Test Thread

[ClimberDHexMods]

what is a flex plate

 

it's the automatic equivalent of a fly wheel. Sits between the engine and torque converter. Has the teeth the starter bites into. They are not bullet proof on our 5eats. There also isn't an aftermarket replacement, which really sucks.

[utc_pyro]

Anyways, do you know how to find out what values from the ECU influence the TCU?

 

There is some info under the vacation pics about it adjusting the presure based on throttle/torque/something, but it's probably not enough to know for sure.

 

Do you have a spare TCU with your second 5eat? If so, one would need to reverse engineer the TCU like what was done with the ECU. First step would be to crack it upen and post hi-res pics so we can figure out the processor and memory it uses.

 

If that's a no-go, if some one buys a transmission software update from subaru one could try and decompile it. It might take using a data analizer during the flashing process to figure out, but it's doable.

 

A third option woould be to hook a pressure gauge up right after the regulator and see how tuning effects it.

[KyLegacy 2.5GT]

what is a flex plate

 

The flexplate bolts to the crank of am automatic car just like a flywheel bolts to the crank of a manual transmission car. The only purpose a flexplate has is to act as a gear for the starter to turn the engine over (and to mount the torque converter). Other than that, its pretty much a peice of sheetmetal. A flywheel on manual cars also act as a gear for the starter but have a contact surface for the clutch and is a much heavier component. The torque converter is the link for power transfer from the engine to the transmission in an automatic car.

 

Flywheel and clutch....

 

http://www.jegs.com/photos/183flywheel.jpg

http://www.jegs.com/photos/49085300.jpg

 

 

Flexplate and torque converter....

http://www.jegs.com/photos/170200.jpg

http://www.jegs.com/photos/towconvt.jpg

[tailgatewagon]

uh unless the 5eat is differnt then every other subaru auto trans. which im shure it is not, the flex plate has no teeth its just the metal bit, the teeth are on the torque converter....fyi

[Rick]

uh unless the 5eat is differnt then every other subaru auto trans. which im shure it is not, the flex plate has no teeth its just the metal bit, the teeth are on the torque converter....fyi

 

 

Your correct.

[KyLegacy 2.5GT]

Gotcha, yeah I am new to the Subaru world... I am used to the Mitsu's and domestic cars.

[Vitamin_G]

What's the purpose of the plate if it has no teeth? Rotational mass for smooth driveability?

[HtrdlncN281]

I believe it's to provide the connection from the Crankshaft to the Torque Converter

[ClimberDHexMods]

I believe it's to provide the connection from the Crankshaft to the Torque Converter

 

also can be weighted to balance the rotating assembly.

 

Anyways none of this has anything to do with making the 5eat any better. Just adding pages. Google can answer these fundamental questions. No insult intended, just saying.

[06wrxlbart]

I wish my 5eat would shift like a Audi Dual clutch or DSG ugh!

[fishbone]

A traditional tranny with a torque converter sure can be made to act and feel very very close to a DSG. Just drive an Audi TT or Cooper S auto, you'll see what I'm talking about. Torque converter is always locked up, shifts are firm and quick. I am 99% convinced SOA could have configured our JATCO units the same way but we have to remember what kind of car we are driving and the demographic

[utc_pyro]

Any one have a spare TCU I could take off your hands for "reserch"? Subaru TCU's have been hacked and reprogramed in the past, just no one has looked much into it on the 5eat. The TCU controls each solonoid with PWM*, so a little software tweaking could change the 5eat from a CVT simulator to a hard fast shifting beast.

 

*this is based on the service manual stating it's about a 800hz pulse output from the TCU to the throttle body. Also SSM can read the "duty cycle" for each one, indicating PWM.

[ClimberDHexMods]

Any one have a spare TCU I could take off your hands for "reserch"? Subaru TCU's have been hacked and reprogramed in the past, just no one has looked much into it on the 5eat. The TCU controls each solonoid with PWM*, so a little software tweaking could change the 5eat from a CVT simulator to a hard fast shifting beast.

 

*this is based on the service manual stating it's about a 800hz pulse output from the TCU to the throttle body. Testing needed.

 

Now you're talking Anyone can get one, pulled off a junker. I would blindly guess $50 to your door. How capable to do you guestimate you are of hacking it and making it so that an end user can interface without a computer science degree? Cause I, like most people, couldn't write or edit code to save my life.

[utc_pyro]

I'm an EE, not a CS... Hardware is kind of my thing, the software is just there to make the hardware work . I can at least get the code out of the ECU and some good documentation on it. Not sure if I can decompile it on my own though, it would depend on the type of controller used in it. If they have a Motorola 68HCxx like some of the older ones I have it, otherwise I may need help.

 

At the very least I can get the ball rolling and might intrest some of the RomRaider guys. It has the ability to be reflashed like the ECU, so it has the posibility of end users being able to tweak it. Just a lot of hoops to jump through first on the dev side.

 

Edit:

I posted a request for one in the WTB section. If one can be sourced, I may start a donation thread like was done on the front LSD. I'm going to need test equipment and maybe a few trips to the dealer to sniff SSM on the transmission, so if the TCU/valve body cost are offset I can get to work faster.

 

Also, I may need a BIU for testing. If it can be flashed as well, we can reduce the lag from pushing the shift buttons.

[ClimberDHexMods]

I'm an EE, not a CS... Hardware is kind of my thing, the software is just there to make the hardware work . I can at least get the code out of the ECU and some good documentation on it. Not sure if I can decompile it on my own though, it would depend on the type of controller used in it. If they have a Motorola 68HCxx like some of the older ones I have it, otherwise I may need help.

 

At the very least I can get the ball rolling and might intrest some of the RomRaider guys. It has the ability to be reflashed like the ECU, so it has the posibility of end users being able to tweak it. Just a lot of hoops to jump through first on the dev side.

 

Edit:

I posted a request for one in the WTB section. If one can be sourced, I may start a donation thread like was done on the front LSD. I'm going to need test equipment and maybe a few trips to the dealer to sniff SSM on the transmission, so if the TCU/valve body cost are offset I can get to work faster.

 

Also, I may need a BIU for testing. If it can be flashed as well, we can reduce the lag from pushing the shift buttons.

 

All great things. I suggest starting an new thread both on here and RomRaider with your specific plan and process (so people can add to it), and I think people will support you and anyone else who can/does step up to the plate. I will support you best I can Wish I knew what the words are you used to describe the process

[RIPjeep2002]

I'm an EE, not a CS... Hardware is kind of my thing, the software is just there to make the hardware work . I can at least get the code out of the ECU and some good documentation on it. Not sure if I can decompile it on my own though, it would depend on the type of controller used in it. If they have a Motorola 68HCxx like some of the older ones I have it, otherwise I may need help.

 

At the very least I can get the ball rolling and might intrest some of the RomRaider guys. It has the ability to be reflashed like the ECU, so it has the posibility of end users being able to tweak it. Just a lot of hoops to jump through first on the dev side.

 

Edit:

I posted a request for one in the WTB section. If one can be sourced, I may start a donation thread like was done on the front LSD. I'm going to need test equipment and maybe a few trips to the dealer to sniff SSM on the transmission, so if the TCU/valve body cost are offset I can get to work faster.

 

Also, I may need a BIU for testing. If it can be flashed as well, we can reduce the lag from pushing the shift buttons.

 

If this can be done, and a simple, non tech person can do this, I'll throw you a nice donation.

[utc_pyro]

I'll do my best.... First I need to find a TCU/TCM so I can get started. I may need to borrow a 2005 auto legacy as well, the 2006 (what I have) does not have any TCU updates avalivble, thus making "sniffing" the flash process difficult. It's probably the same method we use to flash the TCU, but it would give the correct address of the TCU unit to start with.

 

But, again, finding a TCU/TCM is the first step. If any one can locate one and forward who to buy it from would be a huge jump start. I don't really want to open the one up I rely on to get to work...

[KyLegacy 2.5GT]

Is this the correct location to look in the car? I will do a check in the local junk yards for any LGT's.

[ClimberDHexMods]

Is this the correct location to look in the car? I will do a check in the local junk yards for any LGT's.

 

Yes. Specifically it's the little silver box to the immediate left of the brake pedal. While there, the BIU is the black plastic box bolted to the steering column. Harnesses may also be useful.

[utc_pyro]

It'll take both if some one can find it... Also agreed on the harness, as much of that as posible could speed the reserch, particularly the plugs. It'll save time wireing the thing up and figuring out the pinouts.

 

If you don't see any LGT's, also look for Outback XT's (2nd choice) and H6 outbacks (3rd choice). It should be close enough to get started. If the portion of the code for flashing it via SSM is pulled out, we should be able to non-destructivly pull the ROM from our own ECU's for further development.

[NSFW]

It would be pretty awesome to have 5EAT tuning.

 

And that's coming from a guy with a 5MT. Because it would still be awesome.

[utc_pyro]

Found one!

 

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Transmission-BCM-ECU-LEGACY-2005-05_W0QQitemZ250599326147QQcmdZViewItemQQptZMotors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories?hash=item3a58e241c3

 

Cost more then I was wanting to put into this though.... This is what the thing looks like if any one looks at a junk yard.

[RIPjeep2002]

^^I'm sure if you ask, people will donate to help defray the cost of buying it. I know I would.

[ClimberDHexMods]

Found one!

 

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Transmission-BCM-ECU-LEGACY-2005-05_W0QQitemZ250599326147QQcmdZViewItemQQptZMotors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories?hash=item3a58e241c3

 

Cost more then I was wanting to put into this though.... This is what the thing looks like if any one looks at a junk yard.

 

Make lower offers. I had great success setting up a donation thread for the front LSD fitment test fun. Raised $31 pretty fast.

[utc_pyro]

Yeah, but I'm not sure if enough people will hop on to get the price down to what I want to spend. I was hoping to keep it in the $50 from my pocket range for just the TCU seeing as I'll need test equipment and mn working on other projects (Line out converter, EGT translator, ect).

 

How many people would be willing to chip in on that one?