Legacy Wagon Posted January 27, 2010 Share Posted January 27, 2010 I'm semi-knowledgable about how cars work, but hopefully you guys can enlighten me. I heard a slight ticking sound, but I had no idea what it was and it has slowly been getting a bit rougher over the past 2 months. I drive my car nice and easy 98% of the time so I figured it was probably no big deal. I decided to look around the engine when I got some free time. After looking it over top to bottom from what I can see the crankshaft has a bit of play so it is slightly moving up and down and I had a feeling it was due to the bearings being worn out and my father and friend, who both know a good deal about cars, verified that this is the problem...which sucks, considering with these engines I'm going to assume you have to take pretty much the whole thing apart to replace them...so I think I'm going to look for another engine instead. Any suggestions on a more powerful swap? I want to convert it from an auto to a manual. I've heard it's not difficult, but honestly I'm not too keen on how transmissions work or how you would install a clutch. I have friends that can help, but I just need to know what kind of stuff goes along with it. I would need to know what is necessary to do for the engine and basically how much it would cost, but I think I would rather upgrade than sidestep since I have to pull the engine anyway. I really miss having a turbo since I got rid of my WRX so I thought of either the engine from the Legacy SS or a WRX or STi, but I dont know how the latter two would affect the car, or my wallet or if I'd need to change the suspension and stuff. I would really appreciate any help you guys can give. Thanks dudes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Platinum_Racing Posted January 27, 2010 Share Posted January 27, 2010 Any Subaru engine will bolt up. Likewise, any Subaru transmission will bolt to any Subaru engine. I would sugesst getting an EJ22T engine and either having it rebuilt, or just buy a rebuilt one in the first place. You can get an engine for $500, then either spend $1500-2,000 and have it bored, honed, and rebuilt with new internals, (Pistons, rings, bearings, ect). They will also polish the crank and do a 3 angle valve job. The car will run like new, with the only weak spot being the turbo. Even if you just buy the engine and swap it without rebuilding it you should be fine for a while. You will need to get an EJ22T ECU for a manual transmission. If you're lucky enough you might be able to score a deal on an engine, transmission, and harness all in one piece on eBay. Things to watch for in used engines... Mileage. Head Gaskets. Timing Belt. Oil Leaks. Blown Turbo. Manual Flywheel or Automatic Flexplate. If you buy an engine with a flexplate you can switch it for a flywheel later, but that's more things you have to buy separately. Or anything else that doesn't seem Kosher. Things to replace if you plan to drop a used engine in the car... Hosesand Vacuum Lines. Spark Plug Wires. Spark Plugs. Oil and Filter (There might not even be any in the engine when you get it, make sure before you crank the engine over). Depending On Mileage, Timing Belt, Water Pump, and Thermostat. Clutch (If it comes with one). Bolting the engine to the car is extremely simple. Same with the transmission. The hardest part of this swap is going to be the wiring. You will also need to get the shift linkage and interior parts to swap the automatic to a manual transmission, along with the pedal assembly. You will also need a clutch master cylinder and some steel line to plumb the hydraulic line for the clutch pedal. All together... About $1,000-1,500 depending on the used engine and transmission you buy. This should include the parts from the local junkyard car. This also assumes free installation from a buddy. To have the engine rebuilt including a new turbo... $2,500-3,000. I would stick with an EJ22 engine. The wiring would be simple. The EJ22T is also OBDI. It's always easier to put an OBDI compliant engine into an OBDI car. Once you try to drop an OBDII engine into an OBDI car you run into all kinds of wiring issues. All EJ22T engines used OBDI computers, while not all regular EJ22 engines use OBDI. Some later EJ22 engines used in Imprezzas were OBDII. The EJ25's and all WRX engines are OBDII. Not only that, but they are EXTREMELY expensive in comparison to an EJ22T. We're talking a difference of thousands and thousands of dollars here, something you probably don't want to pay. Good luck! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legacy Wagon Posted January 28, 2010 Author Share Posted January 28, 2010 Any Subaru engine will bolt up. Likewise, any Subaru transmission will bolt to any Subaru engine. I would sugesst getting an EJ22T engine and either having it rebuilt, or just buy a rebuilt one in the first place. You can get an engine for $500, then either spend $1500-2,000 and have it bored, honed, and rebuilt with new internals, (Pistons, rings, bearings, ect). They will also polish the crank and do a 3 angle valve job. The car will run like new, with the only weak spot being the turbo. Even if you just buy the engine and swap it without rebuilding it you should be fine for a while. You will need to get an EJ22T ECU for a manual transmission. If you're lucky enough you might be able to score a deal on an engine, transmission, and harness all in one piece on eBay. Things to watch for in used engines... Mileage. Head Gaskets. Timing Belt. Oil Leaks. Blown Turbo. Manual Flywheel or Automatic Flexplate. If you buy an engine with a flexplate you can switch it for a flywheel later, but that's more things you have to buy separately. Or anything else that doesn't seem Kosher. Things to replace if you plan to drop a used engine in the car... Hosesand Vacuum Lines. Spark Plug Wires. Spark Plugs. Oil and Filter (There might not even be any in the engine when you get it, make sure before you crank the engine over). Depending On Mileage, Timing Belt, Water Pump, and Thermostat. Clutch (If it comes with one). Bolting the engine to the car is extremely simple. Same with the transmission. The hardest part of this swap is going to be the wiring. You will also need to get the shift linkage and interior parts to swap the automatic to a manual transmission, along with the pedal assembly. You will also need a clutch master cylinder and some steel line to plumb the hydraulic line for the clutch pedal. All together... About $1,000-1,500 depending on the used engine and transmission you buy. This should include the parts from the local junkyard car. This also assumes free installation from a buddy. To have the engine rebuilt including a new turbo... $2,500-3,000. I would stick with an EJ22 engine. The wiring would be simple. The EJ22T is also OBDI. It's always easier to put an OBDI compliant engine into an OBDI car. Once you try to drop an OBDII engine into an OBDI car you run into all kinds of wiring issues. All EJ22T engines used OBDI computers, while not all regular EJ22 engines use OBDI. Some later EJ22 engines used in Imprezzas were OBDII. The EJ25's and all WRX engines are OBDII. Not only that, but they are EXTREMELY expensive in comparison to an EJ22T. We're talking a difference of thousands and thousands of dollars here, something you probably don't want to pay. Good luck! I think for money's sake and the possibility of damaging internals on this engine I'm going to try and tear it down within the next 2 weeks in my friend's garage when we get it cleared out. I'm thinking I'll clean and rebuild this one and replace the bearings for now and try and find a manual transmission from an SS to swap out since I've heard they're stronger then look for the EJ22T, which I'll break down, clean, replace any bad seals or belts...stuff like that. That'll be at least a 30 hp gain and it would give me a turbo again I was looking up prices for a WRX or an STi engine, knowing that I would probably have to change out some other components like the rear diff, possibly suspension stuff and considering the wiring and probably the crossmember from another Subaru...just seemed like a lot parts and extras. And yes...a ridiculous amount more money. I see. We dont have an excess of Subaru's in junk yards down here in FL unfortunately so what interior parts would be necessary besides the shifter and boot? Does the center console change? I forgot they made some Impreza's 2.2. I'll be looking around for an engine and it would be awesome to find an engine, transmission, ECU combo, but I wont get my hopes up haha I appreciate all of your help, dude! Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Platinum_Racing Posted January 28, 2010 Share Posted January 28, 2010 If you could get your hands on an EJ22T manual transmission you could hook it up to the WRX motor no problems. Just use an EJ22 clutch and flywheel, but beware, none of the drivetrain components including the clutch and transmission were designed for that many horses. Regardless that would be the best way to go, since you wouldn't have to try and fit a WRX rear diff under the car to match the transmissions front differential drive ratio. You would need to buy a pedal assembly for the car if you swap to a manual, as well as a clutch master cylinder and some brake line to plumb the hydraulic lines for the clutch. There are many problems with using an STI or WRX motor. 1) You need a bigger radiator2) Wiring nightmare3) you need to make brackets for the intercooler4) You need to either use an older transmission from an EJ22T or use the stock WRX/STI transmission and find a way to use a WRX/STI rear differential I'd say rebuild your stock engine and either stick with the auto transmission or swap the manual transmission in. I'm not sure if the differential ratios are the same in the manual transmission and the automatic transmission, so you would need to look into that. If they are different you will need to swap the rear differential. The CV Shafts are the same for both transmissions, I know that much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legacy Wagon Posted January 29, 2010 Author Share Posted January 29, 2010 but beware, none of the drivetrain components including the clutch and transmission were designed for that many horses - This is what I was afraid of so I figured I'd try and get it all at once, but man...it's a lot of money to spend on an old car. I could pretty much pick up a 2000 2.5rs for that. I've been in love with the Impreza since I was 13 and McRae took the WRC 95 You would need to buy a pedal assembly for the car if you swap to a manual, as well as a clutch master cylinder and some brake line to plumb the hydraulic lines for the clutch. - Yep. I plan on fixing this engine first, hopefully by next weekend and then spending time each day looking for a manual transmission from the SS and the proper parts that go along with switching it out. I think a stick would make this car a lot more fun and useful. I'm not sure if the differential ratios are the same in the manual transmission and the automatic transmission, so you would need to look into that. If they are different you will need to swap the rear differential. - As for this...it wouldn't be a huge issue buying a new diff considering they get a bit of wear and tear over time and I dont know if they've ever changed the diff oil in this car since I bought it with 86k on it. It looks clear still, but thats the best I can do. I'll be looking into this stuff more when I rebuild that engine. I figure that's my main concern right now and that the transmission stuff can wait. I really appreciate all of the help man! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sqc151 Posted January 29, 2010 Share Posted January 29, 2010 gear ratios are the same for manuals and auto. depends on what country and what model the car it came from. and for the love of god please stop quoting. you 2 type to much to be qouting unless its several posts away. ok my brain is spinning... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legacy Wagon Posted February 1, 2010 Author Share Posted February 1, 2010 Aight... Anyway, I was looking up prices for this crap and even to do the work yourself it'sinsane. It quickly rises to the amount I paid for the car so I'll either be looking for an engine swap with my car out of commission for a while or I'll be looking for another car :/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sqc151 Posted February 1, 2010 Share Posted February 1, 2010 just for giggles what octane fuel do u use? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Platinum_Racing Posted February 2, 2010 Share Posted February 2, 2010 ??? Random question for the win! 87 all day man..... Any more than that and you're burning money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legacy Wagon Posted February 2, 2010 Author Share Posted February 2, 2010 I use 87 from BP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sqc151 Posted February 2, 2010 Share Posted February 2, 2010 just for kicks, use 93 for 2 tanks and see if the tick goes away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Platinum_Racing Posted February 3, 2010 Share Posted February 3, 2010 Actually now that I think about it that question isn't so random anymore. It makes sense actually. My apologies good sir.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legacy Wagon Posted February 3, 2010 Author Share Posted February 3, 2010 Alright, sure. I'll give it a shot. I put Zmax in the carwhen I bought it and Lucas in it every once in a whilewhen I filled up my gas so I figured the injectors wouldbe clean, but is that the purpose for trying higher octane? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Platinum_Racing Posted February 3, 2010 Share Posted February 3, 2010 The purpose of using higher octane is to see if the car is "Knocking". Knocking (AKA Detonation) occurs when a hot spot in the combustion chamber ignites the fuel/air mixture before the spark plug gets a chance to do so. Generally engines with high compression ratios or forced incuction (Turbo's/Superchargers) require higher octane fuel than naturally aspirated cars, or cars with low compression ratios. Higher compression ratios and any amount of boost is going to increase the amount of heat inside the cylinder during the compression stroke. This heat can cause knocking. Knocking is bad because if the fuel is ignited before the spark plug fires the expanding gas will try to push the piston back down before it's reached TDC, pretty much trying to run the engine (Or that particular cylinder) backwards. Over time, this can have severe consequences on an engine. Higher octane fuel is harder to ignite, thus it is more likely to resist knocking until the spark plug fires. Putting high octane fuel in your average car (Or pretty much any car with less than a 10:1 compression ratio) will not hurt the car, nor will it greatly improve performance. It also will not harm performance. All it does is lighten your wallet a little faster. If you suspect your car is knocking, adding high octane fuel can help confirm that the noise is actually detonation. Modern car manufacturers have built their engines to avoid knocking. Back in the day lead was used to prevent knocking, but since lead has been outlawed for decades the task was placed on the shoulders of auto manufacturers to build cars that don't knock. Modern combustion chambers are built very carefully so as to not create hot spots. Even though a car might not knock when brand new, deposits on the valves, cylinder heads, and pistons can build up and cause hot spots over time. It's worth a tank or two of 93 octane fuel just to rule out if your car is knocking or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legacy Wagon Posted February 4, 2010 Author Share Posted February 4, 2010 Yeah, I know about the higher compression ratio's of different octane grades, I was just wondering why it would be beneficial to try it instead. I always heard there's no real difference between putting premium in your tank if it only requires regular...didnt even think about the compression to be honest Makes sense now. I'll give it a shot. Thanks guys Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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