nicd Posted June 5, 2004 Share Posted June 5, 2004 Well not exactly. Subaru was running the consumer test drives here in Montreal. Essentially -a Short sprint with a braking zone followed by a short S section. Thou I had registered I never got the call :roll: . Not an issue will have a car to fully test in a couple of weeks. I did go to the site and had some interesting observations! 1. During the short sprint, the cars accelerated well and in a very linear fashion, the manual does seem to take of faster than the EAT however once underway they seem very very close, with the big shift differance being the driver in the stick messing up the shift the 5EAT in sports mode seemed flawless! 2. The sprint section also had a dip in the pavement before the braking zone, well those of us that have a WRX know what effect that has on the Subaru ABS system. In the case of the new Leagacy not a single issue very close to looking like thershold braking. 3. I did not notice any nose diving either except on the Outback! 4. During the tisted sections the car stayed very flat(again talking about the GTs) no noticable body role, some of the more hamfisted drivers got the car to understeer but most of the others sailed throu. I have to say that the Atalntic blue is actually nicer in person than on catalog. The RB blue(which I am getting) is dark however when it is hit by the sun it is very rich. The black is is nice and is not flat with some nice reflections to it-but it is still black. The silver is in my opinion (I have had 3 silver Subaru's) just the usual Subaru Silver. The red I was dissapointed with as I felt it looked flatter than what a bright red car should be. Didi not see any whites. There you are some observations, oh yes as the Subaru guys round the course were telling the drivers(many of the guys there acting as monitors race for Subarus-mostly rally) the only thing I heard is------you should try and stay within the grip level of the tires-Translation: The V rated RE92s are still on the cars for the fuel economy numbers-please buy a good set of tires to fully realise the cars potential. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drift Monkey Posted June 5, 2004 Share Posted June 5, 2004 That is bad news nicd. I wanted to get red, but if it's that dark red similar the '02-'03 WRX (Sedona Red) then I might be (even more) skeptical. I wanted what was on that picture of the JDM GT, something closer to the '04 WRX's San Remo Red. I may just settle for white. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
racerdave Posted June 5, 2004 Share Posted June 5, 2004 How would you say lag was? Pronounced? Minimal? Non-existant? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drift Monkey Posted June 5, 2004 Share Posted June 5, 2004 I would say, infering from SUBE55's posts that it's minimal, if even existant. He said, and I quote, "I had to fight to keep the thing OUT of boost!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
racerdave Posted June 5, 2004 Share Posted June 5, 2004 I think that was the STI he was driving, not the Legacy, right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nicd Posted June 5, 2004 Author Share Posted June 5, 2004 I talked to some of my fellow Subaru enthusiast that were at the test and tried the cars-mostly WRX owners. They were surprised by the actual presence of lag nearly as much as the WRX, having said that they also said that the track setup was not ideally suited to exploite the power band of the car, as soon as the turbo started to boost they had to break. So that aspect is to be taken with resevations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
axis008 Posted June 5, 2004 Share Posted June 5, 2004 That is correct, SUBE was driving the STi. I wonder why everyone is saying different things about the turbo lag... -ben Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brady_bunch Posted June 5, 2004 Share Posted June 5, 2004 [quote name='axis008']I wonder why everyone is saying different things about the turbo lag...[/quote] Different experiences and different expectations, I imagine. [quote name='Drift Monkey']I wanted to get red, but if it's that dark red similar the '02-'03 WRX (Sedona Red) then I might be (even more) skeptical.[/quote] Check these out. I just posted some (OK... a BUNCH) of photos of a red GT: [url]http://www.legacysti.com/viewtopic.php?t=938[/url] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NicoGamine Posted June 6, 2004 Share Posted June 6, 2004 Like nicd I am in Montreal but I actually participated in today's test. As to the lag, never having driven a WRX I can't compare but it was noticable and brutal when it came: Flooring it from standstill the car would start moving at the pace I expect from my non-turbo 2.5 but around 3000RPM (1-2 seconds) the turbo would kick in and objects would start to blur along the side of the track... I'm exaggerating, but it was very, very strong... All cars there were automatics. Nicolas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SUBE555 Posted June 6, 2004 Share Posted June 6, 2004 I was indeed in an STi, but with the Legacy likely having a slightly smaller turbocharger, it SHOULD spool a little sooner and by tuning, it should be a little smoother as that's what they're shooting for. I was just so impressed with the power delivery of the STi (which I didn't come close to it's potential for power), I'm sure it will take me a bit getting used to the full power potential (in just 2 gears as I'd run out of legal space by the end of 2nd gear probably.) I can't hold it back anymore, I AM SO EXCITED!!! Everyone keeps reminding me and I just get more giddy by the day! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akm3 Posted June 6, 2004 Share Posted June 6, 2004 My theory on turbo lag differences in noticing: People who have driven laggy turbo cars (like the WRX) will say there is no lag. People who haven't driven turbo cars will say there is bad lag. I haven't driven one yet so I don't know. -Allen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gtguy Posted June 6, 2004 Share Posted June 6, 2004 The other thing to note about turbocharged Subarus, is if you floor the throttle from launch, it will seem particularly laggy. For whatever reason the ECU, like the transmission syncros, doesn't like to be rushed. Smooth throttle inputs lead to a much more linear, less laggy acceleration curve. Automatics will always seem laggier than manuals, because not only does the turbo have to do its thing, but the autobox has to do its thing. Kevin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apexjapan2 Posted June 6, 2004 Share Posted June 6, 2004 There is back pressure in the system, so a tip-in throttle opening (vs just stamping on it like a switch) often produces better results. Also, these new engines take about 10k kms to loosen up IMHO. They just keep getting better too :) Have fun guys, your car is ready:D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NicoGamine Posted June 6, 2004 Share Posted June 6, 2004 akm3 and gt guy probably have it: I've driven turbos before but mostly diesels and we were told to just floor it, so we did... FWIW, thinking baout it I remembered test driving a Passat 1.8T (bought the Legacy instead... :D ) and the lag is more pronounced and the boost more brutal when it comes. The Passat 1.8T is not a GT but it is a point of comparison. As a note, most folks in North America trying out the GTs will not have driven a turbo before and might try to just floor it to see what it's got. :( All in all a beautiful car, now I just wish for another road test... :D Nicolas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
outahere Posted June 6, 2004 Share Posted June 6, 2004 [quote name='gtguy']The other thing to note about turbocharged Subarus, is if you floor the throttle from launch, it will seem particularly laggy. For whatever reason the ECU, like the transmission syncros, doesn't like to be rushed. Smooth throttle inputs lead to a much more linear, less laggy acceleration curve.[/quote] Some of the initial lag in the new GT may be due to the drive-by-wire programming. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apexjapan Posted June 6, 2004 Share Posted June 6, 2004 It has been around for quite a while - as you get used to owning a turbo leggy, it becomes instinctive to roll into the throttle instead of flooring it. AVO says it's because of backpressure in the system, and are going to clear up that area as well. On the boost gauge and dyno it is a bit more clear - boost response is much quicker with a partial throttle roll-in than a foot mash. When I roll into it the response is much more satisfying than when flooring it, and watching the boost gauge I can tell why. When I flatten it, boost comes on much slower than when I roll into it. Once you get out of test driver mode, the car starts to feel much more satisfying because the response at partial throttle (which is what you use much more often) is so good. And when driving in the mountains, it turns out to be much quicker that way, plus a joy to modulate mid-corner. The problem is that testers don't get that much time with cars initially, so they may not discover that the fastest way around is with a lighter foot... Cheers, Paul Hansen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SUBE555 Posted June 6, 2004 Share Posted June 6, 2004 Thats exactly how I was driving the turbo cars, one because initially I wasn't sure what to expect, and two most of them were either in break-in or uBer powerful like the STi. Partial throttle really is the way to go, but it's not to say all journalists are enthusiasts either and know what works best. I know one person that can get in damn near any car and really drive very well with zero time in that type. He's also one that can snap off reaction times of less than .100 at the strip. It's fun just watching and seeing what he can do with a car. A lot of it is indeed in the driver and their understanding of the car. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drift Monkey Posted June 7, 2004 Share Posted June 7, 2004 [quote name='"brady_bunch"'][quote name='axis008']I wonder why everyone is saying different things about the turbo lag...[/quote] If you read Sube's post, I gathered that, since he was "fighting to keep off of boost" on an STi, that the Legacy's lag could be even more non-existant (as also mentioned the Legacy has a smaller turbo, which I assume equates to less lag). The discrepancies between how much lag the motor really has is all percieived as mentioned many times before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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