TRS Posted May 24, 2007 Share Posted May 24, 2007 I think this gives a pretty straight forward explanation... http://e30m3performance.com/myths/Weight_Transfer/weight_transfer.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KartRacerBoy Posted May 24, 2007 Share Posted May 24, 2007 If the car is already lowered, what does this kit do? Lower the roll center further? That can be good or bad, depending on suspension geometry. Lower isn't always better. I guess you're relying on the manufacturer's reputation (probably not a bad bet with Whiteline). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 24, 2007 Share Posted May 24, 2007 If the car is already lowered, what does this kit do? Lower the roll center further? That can be good or bad, depending on suspension geometry. Lower isn't always better. I guess you're relying on the manufacturer's reputation (probably not a bad bet with Whiteline). No, it changes the angle of control arms with respect to car chassis - supposedly helping with camber control in turns. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KartRacerBoy Posted May 24, 2007 Share Posted May 24, 2007 Hmmmm. Me likeee camber control. Errrrrrr. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRS Posted May 24, 2007 Share Posted May 24, 2007 It also raises the roll center closer to the center of gravity. Since the distance between the RC and CG is decreased, the same amount of centripetal or "cornering" force will result in less body roll as this force is acting on a shorter lever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KartRacerBoy Posted May 24, 2007 Share Posted May 24, 2007 Ok. Now you're just making me horney. Centripital. Mmmmm. Either that or my brain hurts. Difficult to tell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRS Posted May 24, 2007 Share Posted May 24, 2007 These diagrams should make it crystal clear for you. I know they did for me. http://legacygt.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=16518 http://legacygt.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=16519 http://legacygt.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=16520 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KartRacerBoy Posted May 24, 2007 Share Posted May 24, 2007 These diagrams should make it crystal clear for you. I know they did for me. http://legacygt.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=16518 http://legacygt.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=16519 http://legacygt.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=16520 I think I'm turning Japanese, I think I'm turning Japanese. I really think so! I figured it must have something to do with suspension geometry, but I've never thought of these steering linkages affecting camber curves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boostjunkie Posted May 24, 2007 Share Posted May 24, 2007 That was joke If it also fit Tribeca it would be hilarious. Given differences between Legacy and Imprezas I'd expect Legacy specific application. Do not make me lower my wife's Tribeca Given that the front suspension is basically identical to the LGT's, I'd be surprised if the Whiteline kit didn't fit the Tribeca. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jim1969 Posted May 24, 2007 Share Posted May 24, 2007 how involved is this install? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jim1969 Posted May 24, 2007 Share Posted May 24, 2007 I've had 6GunRacing's ball joint relocation & tie rod adapter kit installed for several months now. It has provided a noticeable reduction of roll on my mildly lowered LGT. The Whiteline kit should offer similar results at a much lower cost than what I paid. any tradeoffs? Increased NVH? Stiffer ride? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whitetiger Posted May 24, 2007 Share Posted May 24, 2007 ^no trade offs in the NVH department. its just a slightly different shaped ball joint compared the the parts beng replaced. they dont affect ride quality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jim1969 Posted May 24, 2007 Share Posted May 24, 2007 worthwhile mod for someone on JDM spec b bilsteins with pinks? street driven not tracked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRS Posted May 24, 2007 Share Posted May 24, 2007 A lot of the suspension theory goes over my head but I keep trying to read more to understand it better. When the car is steady state, i.e. standing still or moving in a straight line on a smooth surface with no acceleration or deceleration, then the suspension is static. It's when you start throwing in varying forces, often acting in different directions, that change the suspension geometry, and do so differently between the two sides of the vehicle, is when it gets very complicated. Throw in that changing one thing will effect your geometry in other ways too, and that relationship often is very non-linear. That is, you make a small change in one thing but it results in a much larger change elsewhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RaceComp Engineering Posted May 24, 2007 Share Posted May 24, 2007 If the car is already lowered, what does this kit do? Lower the roll center further? That can be good or bad, depending on suspension geometry. Lower isn't always better. I guess you're relying on the manufacturer's reputation (probably not a bad bet with Whiteline). The kit does not affect ride height exactly. That will stay the same. It drops the ball joints 10mm, and RAISES the roll center. This is a good thing, and will reduce roll up front The car will feel like it isn't trying to bury it's nose as much. Rather then get too into it, here's some explanation from the source: Roll centre's work in conjunction with the centre of gravity to determine the roll couple. This is the virtual distance between the 2 points and affects how the body rolls around the roll centre. To try to understand it better, think of an inverted pendulum from a clock with the pivot being the roll centre, the weight on the end being the centre of gravity and the roll couple being the length of the pendulum. - Andrew Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrownBoy Posted May 24, 2007 Share Posted May 24, 2007 worthwhile mod for someone on JDM spec b bilsteins with pinks? street driven not tracked. How do you drive on the street? If I recall correctly, the pinks are a pretty good drop, and in that case, you should take a look at your front control arms. Are there perpendicular with the ground? If not, the suspension geometry of your current setup is not ideal. That doesn't mean it is detrimental, but it isn't as good as it can be. What you do is take away your effective camber when you take a hard turn. THis roll center kit gives you more available active camber, and it also means running less static camber when doing your alignment, as you will have a more effective suspension setup. I think these would be a good idea for many of the Legacy owners. The corrected geometry of the suspension results in the decreased bodyroll without the harsh side effects seen with swaybars. I honestly believe that this product is the answer for more of the Legacy owners than they think. I personally will get these eventually. I think I've rambled, and I'm tired, so I have no idea if this makes sense to anyone else. And definately take a look at the attachments above, if you are a diagram type of person, my explanation will be plain as day once you look at those. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KartRacerBoy Posted May 24, 2007 Share Posted May 24, 2007 Time to reread Carroll Smith's "Tune to Win"! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whitetiger Posted July 2, 2007 Share Posted July 2, 2007 I just installed this exact kit on my car this weekend. Everything fits perfectly. will post pics soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whitetiger Posted July 2, 2007 Share Posted July 2, 2007 Here are some pics of the stock part next to the whitline part. See the difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
suds2250 Posted July 2, 2007 Share Posted July 2, 2007 Any noticable difference in everyday driving, or is this something you would only notice at 10/10ths driving during autox? 335HP/360Tq VF-22/1820 clone with Meth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whitetiger Posted July 2, 2007 Share Posted July 2, 2007 So far after 1 commute to work, it seems to transtmit less NVH through the steering wheel. the cars feels abit more solid. We'll how it really does in 2 weeks at my next autox. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sutter2k Posted July 23, 2007 Share Posted July 23, 2007 bump for impressions. Anyone else get these yet. figure, it I am doing LCA bushings, it might be a good mod to do at the same time Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whitetiger Posted August 5, 2007 Share Posted August 5, 2007 This kit makes a very nice addition to the suspension. With all the suspension work ive done to my car, each mod made the steeing feel better and and these are no different. I feel less bumbs through the steering wheel and there is alot less bumb steer. Though this shouldnt be the first mod one does, it deffinitly makes a nice edition to an already modded suspension. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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