16psibrick Posted October 27, 2006 Share Posted October 27, 2006 alright, just got this car done, a new 06 is350. this is my first attempt at this car so it took a little longer but it turned out pretty good i might say and yes it does sound ALOT better than the ML system whcih is not bad for stock of course, but not a lot of beef if you know what i mean, you dont really feel any of the music... goals: 1. great sound quality with the stock nav headunit retained (found that the stock system does NOT do much eqing) 2. completely stealth with some show factor so lets get started. First the headunit and amp of the stock system is plugged into the inputs of an audiocontrol LC8, the signals are summed and provide the RCA signals for the amps. Front stage: a set of DLS ultimate UR36i 3 way component set is used. the 6.5" midbass is sealed in the stock lower door location, and tiny kick panels are fabricated housing the midrange and tweet, it clears the foot brake with ease and provide a very nice and high stage with very very solid center image: http://simplicity.elitecaraudio.org/ronis1.jpg http://simplicity.elitecaraudio.org/ronis2.jpg the rear stock components are left stock so lets move ont o the trunk like i said, stealth is the key, here is what hte trunk looks like when opened, the KINK in the carpet is NOT from the system, its from being folded int he backseat for four days normally the carpet would lay completley flat... http://simplicity.elitecaraudio.org/ronis3.jpg http://simplicity.elitecaraudio.org/ronis4.jpg pull off the carpet you see a vinyl fake floor, with vinyl cover in the back and a grill mesh on the front hmm why the strange looking grille? http://simplicity.elitecaraudio.org/ronis5.jpg http://simplicity.elitecaraudio.org/ronis6.jpg http://simplicity.elitecaraudio.org/ronis7.jpg with all the covers off, the system is revealed. in the back, two alpine amps supplied by the car customer flank a set of DLS ultimate crossovers. and upfront, a quartet of EU700s reside in a fiberglass spare tire well enclosure, both are trimmed in sude http://simplicity.elitecaraudio.org/ronis8.jpg http://simplicity.elitecaraudio.org/ronis9.jpg http://simplicity.elitecaraudio.org/ronis10.jpg the reason why the elemental designs EU 700 6.5" subwoofers are chosen is becuase the well of the IS is pretty shallow and features a big center crossob brace this foursome certainly puts out enough bass to shake the rear view mirror with authority! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
16psibrick Posted October 27, 2006 Author Share Posted October 27, 2006 now some behind the scene photos: fake floor off showing everyhting, notice how tight everyhting is, the LC8 is secured against the back trunk wall int he well lol http://simplicity.elitecaraudio.org/ronis11.jpg stock 8" was removed from the rear deck to get more bass into the cabin: http://simplicity.elitecaraudio.org/ronis12.jpg here are the front stage midbass install, first a cup was made, then put into the door, new speaker wires are run into the door, and then the entire door was sealed and dampened http://simplicity.elitecaraudio.org/ronis13.jpg http://simplicity.elitecaraudio.org/ronis14.jpg http://simplicity.elitecaraudio.org/ronis15.jpg here the spare tire well box in construction, you will see what i mean by irregularly shapped and not very deep: http://simplicity.elitecaraudio.org/ronis16.jpg http://simplicity.elitecaraudio.org/ronis17.jpg http://simplicity.elitecaraudio.org/ronis18.jpg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JBLU24 Posted October 27, 2006 Share Posted October 27, 2006 dude seriously, just stop posting unless of course you've reconsidered coming back to nyc to do some installs!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
firedawgs Posted October 27, 2006 Share Posted October 27, 2006 Tight. Nice install. I had a semilar fiberglassed spare tire hole for 3-12W3 JL Audio in my Ford Thunderbird back in the days of my stereo compitetions. Updated my vBGarage: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LittleBlueGT Posted October 27, 2006 Share Posted October 27, 2006 Nice amps, oh yea same as mine! Full tune of 68HTA, KSTech 73 MAF, Racer X FMIC and ID1000s................by the DataLog Mafia!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PGT Posted October 27, 2006 Share Posted October 27, 2006 what alpine amps?? nice as always!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
16psibrick Posted October 27, 2006 Author Share Posted October 27, 2006 alpine amps are supplied by the csutomer but in this case they work great becuase of the top mounted controls Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hanger Posted October 27, 2006 Share Posted October 27, 2006 you've got skills.... :drool: <~~ everytime you post ○ ○ ○ Instagram: itshangertime :spin: ○ ○ ○ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boulderguy Posted October 27, 2006 Share Posted October 27, 2006 Love it - again you do magic with the kicks, totally subtle. Hmm, two pairs subs, 1 pair mains...Got a little bass punch? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ron_c1 Posted October 27, 2006 Share Posted October 27, 2006 Ok, just went and picked up my car....and LOVE IT!! I will post more once I'm done working. But as far as the 4 subs, they put out about same level as the stealthbox (maybe more) that was in my wagon, but the DLS comps can keep up better than the Diamond Audio M3's that were in the wagon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boulderguy Posted October 29, 2006 Share Posted October 29, 2006 Sounds like you could handle a bit more power to those subs. Not to knock the Alpine amps but there's better stuff out there that's more on par with the speakers & subs you've had installed, and with a system that good you'd really hear the difference between different amps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
biz77 Posted October 29, 2006 Share Posted October 29, 2006 Sounds like you could handle a bit more power to those subs. Not to knock the Alpine amps but there's better stuff out there that's more on par with the speakers & subs you've had installed, and with a system that good you'd really hear the difference between different amps. Sounds like you should take the $10,000 amplifier challenge: http://www.davidnavone.com/a2000/Amp%20challenge%202001%20Revision.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boulderguy Posted October 29, 2006 Share Posted October 29, 2006 Great idea - has anyone attempted it? Results? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
biz77 Posted October 29, 2006 Share Posted October 29, 2006 Thousands of people have tried. No one has ever taken any money away from it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boulderguy Posted October 29, 2006 Share Posted October 29, 2006 No kidding. Interesting. Anyway, again I wasn't knocking the Alpine amps - the point is there may be something better suited to that application. If the system were made of Pyramid components & installed by Circuit City it wouldn't be worth it, but here maybe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ron_c1 Posted October 30, 2006 Share Posted October 30, 2006 No kidding. Interesting. Anyway, again I wasn't knocking the Alpine amps - the point is there may be something better suited to that application. If the system were made of Pyramid components & installed by Circuit City it wouldn't be worth it, but here maybe. Well, new amps weren't a consideration, as the Alpines are less than a year old and seem adequate. All of my expectations were met, given my budget and equipment both planned to purchase and already owned, and everything sounds good to me. There is a noticeable and audible difference comparing this system to the one that I had in my wagon, which I will partly attribute to the huge difference in the quality of the installation and tuning., partly to differences in levels of interior noise and partly to differences in components. I agree there are amps that are better, but for little to no audible difference don't see upgrading as worthwhile at this point (at least for amps I'd consider in my price range). So, when one or both of these go out, or when my ears can tell a difference then I'll upgrade! Hopefully to something that will fit in the same place as the Alpines, as space is pretty limited. As for the system.... I've had a few days to listen to it now, and everything sounds great! Bing is going to tune a bit more after I've had a little more time listening. In CD's that I've listened to 100's of times, I can pick out things clearly that were burried in the background before. Speakers and subs seem very well matched....bass is tight and never overpowering, which was one of the worries with going to 4 subs...mids and highs are very smooth, and the imaging is great. Comparing to Bing's system, would say it is close but not quite there - again though, not quite apples to apples and very likely a lot to do with obvious differences to do with the 2 cars and components. I'm extremely pleased with the quality of the installation - no rattles, visible wiring or signs of any wire being run unless you pop the hood and I think the pictures speak for themselves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gfxdave99 Posted October 30, 2006 Share Posted October 30, 2006 < just soiled myself If everything seems under control, you're just not going fast enough. - Mario Andretti Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
16psibrick Posted October 30, 2006 Author Share Posted October 30, 2006 yup, no one has ever wont the chanllenge i havespoke to a guy who tried, and hes a recording engineer with an amazing ear, he passed their initial screen test with flying colors, but he said as soon as he sat down for hte real test, he knew he didnt have a chance an amp is an amp IMO, and as long as it produce decent power reliablity with with decent THD, to 99 percent of the population its going to sound the same. and alpine amps are FAR from being in adaquate for this purpose.. if you want to point something out, maybe its the fact that the subs cost 50 bucks each and the alpine is putting about the right amount of power to them, since the EUs want optimally about 100 watts to each b Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boulderguy Posted October 30, 2006 Share Posted October 30, 2006 I just realized those are 6.5" subs - was under the impression they were 10's for some reason. And if (4) 10's = (1) stealthbox then something's seriously awry Anyway, great looking system & install, if it sounds right that's all that matters. Enjoy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ron_c1 Posted October 30, 2006 Share Posted October 30, 2006 ....and if 4 10's fit in the sparetire well that would be one big F'n trunk! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PGT Posted October 30, 2006 Share Posted October 30, 2006 I can honestly say that I've heard a difference with amps. YMMV. I used to be a believer in 'power is power' theory, but had been proven wrong multiple times. I think the culprit is the speaker, or rather the load it presents to the amp over the full frequency range. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
biz77 Posted October 30, 2006 Share Posted October 30, 2006 I can honestly say that I've heard a difference with amps. YMMV. I used to be a believer in 'power is power' theory, but had been proven wrong multiple times. I think the culprit is the speaker, or rather the load it presents to the amp over the full frequency range. If they are of the same topology, level matched (in overall output and frequency response) and kept from clipping thier outputs, you will not be able to detect a difference between two amplifiers. That is why NO ONE has ever taken $10,000 away from Mr. Clark. Thousands have tried and all have failed. I can hear differences between amplifiers as well, but they are not level and frequency response matched. Differences are even more noticeable when you get close to the maximum output (clipping) from an expensive amp and an inexpensive one. Notice that all of these variables are removed in this challenge. This test proves that amplifiers have no specific sonic signatures, given the same topology when driven within thier unclipped output and frequency anomlies are accounted for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boulderguy Posted October 30, 2006 Share Posted October 30, 2006 Thing is, quality & quantity of output & frequency anomolies are that amp's sonic signature, to borrow that term from Carver appropriately. I've heard huge differences in amps but never attributed it soley to those factors alone. This Clark/Navonne challenge really blew my mind to hear about, I never realized that those factors could be equalized so readily. Wow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boulderguy Posted October 30, 2006 Share Posted October 30, 2006 And I've gotta say Biz77 that part of me is glad you turned me on to that & part of me is really sad - I was happy in my ignorance!! :icon_bigg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
biz77 Posted October 30, 2006 Share Posted October 30, 2006 Basically Mr. Clark states he can make a $100 amplifier and a $10,000 amplifier sound the same only by altering those parameters which are measurable and able to be manipulated. Basically keeping the amplifiers within thier specified operating range and using a splash of EQ to iron out any frequency anomolies. I believe this to be true as no one has taken his money. On a side note I must be a fool for spending thousands on amplification, cables, power conditioners etc. for my home stereo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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