HansGT Posted July 31, 2006 Share Posted July 31, 2006 I know some of you have had experience with this...like to see some tuners chime in. Anyway, thinking of going cheap on stage 2...gutting. What would you say the power difference is between gutting the stock up and "shorty" section of the down pipe (I'm keeping the 3rd cat) vs. aftermarket parts? Are we talking 90-95% the performance of aftermarket or less? Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BoxerGT2.5 Posted July 31, 2006 Share Posted July 31, 2006 Take the cats out and a pipe is a pipe. Diameters may be different and some will say the blank plate is a big prob in DP, but otherwise it really depends on what HP number your aiming for. OBAMA......One Big Ass Mistake America! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HansGT Posted July 31, 2006 Author Share Posted July 31, 2006 not as worried about the actual number, stage 2 power range seems impressive enough for me...for now anyways. but if gutting is going to net me 10-20% less power or slower spool then going aftermarket I'd go aftermarket. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rc0032 Posted July 31, 2006 Share Posted July 31, 2006 My problem with gutting is when you want to sell the car you are F’ed. I remember seeing a thread (or someone posting in a thread) where he went from gutted to Cobb and noticed a difference. With the cheap cost of shorty DP’s I would just buy one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HansGT Posted July 31, 2006 Author Share Posted July 31, 2006 My problem with gutting is when you want to sell the car you are F’ed. I remember seeing a thread (or someone posting in a thread) where he went from gutted to Cobb and noticed a difference. With the cheap cost of shorty DP’s I would just buy one. yeah that is an issue. I'd most likely buy a used set an keep my stockers on the side. yep, me too...think it was wukindada that swaped out. I'd want the crucial shorty...about $320....I could get stock up/dp for "around" $150. Damn...is wish aftermarket was cheaper cause I want so much of it....damn damn damn. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BoxerGT2.5 Posted July 31, 2006 Share Posted July 31, 2006 Just take time and save. The only issue I could see that may or may not decrease your power with stock is the DP (blank plate). Could I put a % on it....no. But talk to any manufacturer and they are all gonna spew how twin dump is better than bell mouth or split bellmouth...ect ect ect. But definetly phuckin up your stock stuff is a big issue to consider. OBAMA......One Big Ass Mistake America! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hogmeat Posted July 31, 2006 Share Posted July 31, 2006 Well, get an STI UP (gutting the stock up is outrageously hard!!) for $200 - looks stock, because it is. Then buy my shorty section of downpipe that I can pre-gut for you for $75, and have what you want for $275, PLUS your stock pipes leftover. I have all 3 cats gutted (STI UP) and run TDC Stage 1. Best comprimise between cost, reliability, stock function. It's more like Stage 1.5 - cause there are gains from being catless, untuned! I'm pleasantly surprised... It was most certainly worth the couple bucks and 10 mins of my time. CLICK HERE FOR THE HOGZAUST Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HansGT Posted August 1, 2006 Author Share Posted August 1, 2006 Well, get an STI UP (gutting the stock up is outrageously hard!!) for $200 - looks stock, because it is. Then buy my shorty section of downpipe that I can pre-gut for you for $75, and have what you want for $275, PLUS your stock pipes leftover. I have all 3 cats gutted (STI UP) and run TDC Stage 1. Best comprimise between cost, reliability, stock function. It's more like Stage 1.5 - cause there are gains from being catless, untuned! Thanks Hogmeat...I'll think on it. My concern with the STI pipe is the future rattling of the heat sheilds and with the DP the possible power loss vs. aftermarket. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeeeeeYa Posted August 1, 2006 Share Posted August 1, 2006 At first I wanted to find out the limits of cheap, i.e., gutting stock parts and running the Stage 2 maps, even a TDC tune. The performance was great. I have even modified my stock mufflers internally to further increase already adequate flow. And I was, almost, happy. Then I drove 1000 miles up to TDC and had the car dyno tuned. Once I had the hard evidence in hand for this level I was less happy. When I returned from that trip I ordered a Cobb DP w/HFC, being told by TDC the cat's influence would be negligable (after all, the Cobb's neck down to stock donuts anyway). At this point I knew headers were a part of my next 'level,' and an integrated header/up combo seemed to also make sense. I chose APS, although I'd caution anyone making the same choice to research it thoroughly. Ask me through PM if you are. Once I got these parts installed and a new TDC header map to integrate everything, my car was transformed. LOTS more expensive than my first approach, but also MUCH more rewarding. Meaner, faster, different, better. Worth every drop of the blood, sweat, and dollars. But I was happy for more than a year and a half the other way. It gave me time to save my pennies for this install, and allowed me to sneak up on it, enjoying each time I gutted something or added another map. If you want to jump ahead and have everything right now, yes, there is NOTICEABLE power to be had with my present setup over stock/gutted components. Just don't try to cheap out and not finish the total package, you'll be disappointed. My advice is to go ahead and go the gutted up/dp/mid (smells!) with an AP and TDC maps. You will have more than enough power at a price/performance ratio that is better than any other approach. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HansGT Posted August 2, 2006 Author Share Posted August 2, 2006 bump...anyone else? (currently I'm thinking of gutting the stock up pipe and using a crucial shorty) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mungo Posted August 2, 2006 Share Posted August 2, 2006 Gutting the stock UP is a pain. You could probaby pick up a used gutted one for around $50 though (picked up). That would be a marginal cost saving over an aftermarket one -- plus it would look "stock". If you want to save a significant amount of money, then the stock DP is the one gutt. Or may pickup a used aftermarket shorty. They come up for sale once in a while. I'm perfectly happy with my ghetto gutted shorty and UP + TDC stage II maps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeeeeeYa Posted August 2, 2006 Share Posted August 2, 2006 For sure, gutting the UP is a pain, literally and figuratively. I have scars. Further, unless you go to the extreme lengths gutting the UP requires you can destroy your turbo. Factor that in. On the other hand, I did it, and so have many others successfully. Performance wise there is little difference between an autonomous aftermarket UP and a gutted stocker. Get an aftermarket DP with a bell mouth. Seriously. Save yourself the future regrets, and the subsequent effort and money. Between this and a catless UP you will have more power right off the bat, better spool up, and be ready for aftermarket tuning should you wish. Time is wasting Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chenc544 Posted August 2, 2006 Share Posted August 2, 2006 Thanks Hogmeat...I'll think on it. My concern with the STI pipe is the future rattling of the heat sheilds and with the DP the possible power loss vs. aftermarket. You can take the STI uppipe and get some spot welds put on to reduce the problem of rattling. The STI uppipe is the way to go IMHO. JSC has the Bosal STI uppipe which they claim is the OEM STI uppipe for $179. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HansGT Posted August 2, 2006 Author Share Posted August 2, 2006 You can take the STI uppipe and get some spot welds put on to reduce the problem of rattling. The STI uppipe is the way to go IMHO. JSC has the Bosal STI uppipe which they claim is the OEM STI uppipe for $179. yep, bosal makes the OEM STU up pipe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HansGT Posted August 2, 2006 Author Share Posted August 2, 2006 gutting the stock dp is a big cost savings, but i have heard from a few people that when from a gutted stock dp to an aftermarket noticed a difference. So I will most likely stick with the crucial shorty dp. as for the up. i am a little concerned about getting everything out and having it be smooth. i may end up picking ups something used. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BMXBYKR Posted April 8, 2007 Share Posted April 8, 2007 Do you have to get tuned after gutting the oem pipes and/or aftermarket pipes, and if not, what might the consequences be of not tuning your car? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lawl Posted April 8, 2007 Share Posted April 8, 2007 You can take the STI uppipe and get some spot welds put on to reduce the problem of rattling. The STI uppipe is the way to go IMHO. JSC has the Bosal STI uppipe which they claim is the OEM STI uppipe for $179. if i went to a muffler shop and asked them to spot weld for rattle prevention and showed them my sti UP would they know what to do? or should i go somewhere else car for sale. PM me! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hogmeat Posted April 8, 2007 Share Posted April 8, 2007 no "tune" needed, but you'll eventually throw a CEL from no cats - but it'll drive just fine. I went 2+ weeks without a cel.... I'm pleasantly surprised... It was most certainly worth the couple bucks and 10 mins of my time. CLICK HERE FOR THE HOGZAUST Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Infamous1 Posted April 8, 2007 Share Posted April 8, 2007 if i went to a muffler shop and asked them to spot weld for rattle prevention and showed them my sti UP would they know what to do? or should i go somewhere else They will no exactly what to do, they are just welding the heat sheilds together. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Infamous1 Posted April 8, 2007 Share Posted April 8, 2007 Do you have to get tuned after gutting the oem pipes and/or aftermarket pipes, and if not, what might the consequences be of not tuning your car? No real problems, except like Hogmeat said you will throw the rear O2 sensor CEL also the heater probe in the UP CEL if you don't do the resistor mod. And of course you will be leaving lots of power to be had without the tune. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gianspi Posted April 8, 2007 Share Posted April 8, 2007 Gutted oem pipes look oem, thus saving my warranty. And i've got 73,000 miles left for that warranty I'll give up the small increase of performance for a $0 deductible warranty on anything. enough zip ties and duct tape will fix anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wukindada Posted April 8, 2007 Share Posted April 8, 2007 Guess it all depends on your dealer........ Mine sells & if you want installs aftermarket DP's:):) No warranty issues @ all Toyota 6EATS .........SUCK!!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hogmeat Posted April 9, 2007 Share Posted April 9, 2007 untill you come in with a blown clutch....then come and tell me that. are you that easy of a sell? I figured you'd have been a little more savvy than to believe anything a dealer promises... I'm pleasantly surprised... It was most certainly worth the couple bucks and 10 mins of my time. CLICK HERE FOR THE HOGZAUST Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spec B Posted April 9, 2007 Share Posted April 9, 2007 After reading this thread, I decided to go the gutted route. http://www.legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php?t=47020&highlight=gutted+dyno I think if you are going to keep your stock turbo, the stock gutted pipes are good enough. Sure, you leave a little HP on the table when you gut, and sure the car will sound and look better with aftermarket pipes...no doubt. Other than a few HP that you lose and the slight chance of some erratic over boosting because of the blank plate on the stock DP (which has not occurred on my TDC stage 2 tune), I don't see an additional benefit from going to aftermarket pipes on a stock turbo. I went with gutted stock pipes for one reason, I did not want to raise any flags at the dealer. Yes, there is a cost benefit to gutting and that is nice too but my main concern was keeping my car (which I drive only 5,000 miles per year) under warranty for as long as possible. Ohh yeah, and at the end of the day I only spent about $200 on stock gutted parts...thats nice too! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wukindada Posted April 9, 2007 Share Posted April 9, 2007 untill you come in with a blown clutch....then come and tell me that. are you that easy of a sell? I figured you'd have been a little more savvy than to believe anything a dealer promises... Had several warranty related services done even after the car no longer was running the VF40...... I suppose it all depends on the dealer;) It's simply a choice, same thing applies to owners that go out & purchase knock off DP & UP's. Sure it will work but how well?? I ran a gutted UP & DP until the aftermarket released them & I can tell you there is def. a difference Toyota 6EATS .........SUCK!!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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