Growing tired of the Spec. B.... Crazy to trade for a WRX?

[Tronic]

10 years is a long time for car technology.

 

10 years is a long time but never fall into the trap that "Newer is better" its a common misconception.

 

The fundamentals have not changed but the number of gimmicks and electronics you don't really need has. There have been some great cars made along the way. If the new stuff was so great, I wouldn't have any problems replacing my current Subaru but for me they are going backwards not forwards.

 

Really hoping for something amazing from Subaru in 2020 but I'm not holding my breath.

[whitexc]

"10 years is a long time but never fall into the trap that "Newer is better" its a common misconception."

 

I agree with this. While it is nice to have some creature comforts we have all become accustomed to, don't stray from the basic platform of a great vehicle.

 

I love my 2002 24V Cummins DODGE just for this reason....simple and it works.

[JmP6889928]

I can see everyone's point here and find them all to be interesting. One thing to remember, and this is very important for you moving forward-you KNOW your LGT and you know how to work on it, and you know what can and can't go wrong, if for no other reason, you're a member on this forum.

 

If you do go to a newer WRX (I have a friend that sold his 06 and purchased a 14 WRX because he thought it would be much better-he sold it 9 months later at a pretty substantial loss), you'll not know how to really work on it, and that can rapidly become extremely cost prohibitive if taking to the stealership AND, most of the time, they have no idea what's going on either, as is evidenced by statements all over this forum, me included.

 

I can certainly understand your frustration. I have had many Chrysler/Dodge minivans that I use for rock climbing and bicycling. I currently have a 2002 AWD T&C that now has almost 250K on it. I just purchased an 11 Dodge Grand Caravan (sad to say, only FWD because they stopped making the AWD in 2004) but I bought it because I wanted to go with newer technology. I bought this van about 4 weeks ago, and it's in my buddy's shop because it keeps popping a P0480 code for the radiator fan and then the fan comes on and stays running-won't shut off as normal. I did everything I know about all of the other vans I have had and no luck, so it's going to cost me to fix it, and I'm frustrated as hell about it (I don't have the time right now to work on it either, so that also plays into the equation).

 

LGT is a love/hate relationship right off the bat. You love the car because it's so damn good as a stock vehicle compared to most anything else. They are quick, handle good, are pretty comfortable, and the styling is pretty timeless. You hate the car because of many of the points you have made-put on all the go fast goodies and it rides rough, the clutch sucks, the power isn't linear (most likely tune based issue but could be something else too), AND, it's an older car, so things are prone to fail, so there you are again this weekend, changing out LCA bushings, or figuring out why you have a misfire code, or replacing the radiator because the original failed, or......you get the drill.

 

Not a single person on here would blame you if you were so unhappy you changed, but make sure you know the world you would transition into before making that transition because as I mentioned about my vans, it can be more of a pain in the ass than you anticipate.

 

Good luck Pal. I hope you are able to resolve your own issues and if trading is the way to go for you, then I wish you the best of luck and hope you get the 1 car in the 5000 built that month that is the absolutely outstanding example.

[JmP6889928]

One point I forgot to make-you have a SpecB. Remember this is a pretty rare example of an LGT and if you do trade/sell, the chances of finding another grow slimmer every day as they are rapidly disappearing. If your car is paid for, and you can afford it, and you really want to do the transition, purchase the car you want, A/B them for a little while, and then decide what to do with the SpecB. You'll most certainly be able to sell it to another enthusiast, and at least that way, you'll have a solid handle on whether or not you made the right decision.

 

Good luck again.

[JmP6889928]

Oh....And I'm sorry I keep thinking about this.....Byron...shut up about my minivans....I love them because they are so versatile for what I do....LOL

 

:lol::lol:

[whitexc]

Someone may have mentioned the spec B being worth less next year compared to current. I don't think that value loss would be as bad as buying something and not being happy, selling it and taking a bath. Just my $.02.

 

I can very much appreciate wanting something newer and not "working" on it all the time. I have that love hate with my truck but I know it very well, every quirk it has. Sometimes the devil you know is better than the devil you don't know.

 

Maybe keep the B and get a beater if the option is there. I personally have 3 vehicles. Necessary? Not at all but I like options. Trucks are waaay too expensive and mine does what it needs to do just fine.

 

Do what you feel is right. Best of luck with your decision.

[boxkita]

We bought a 2018 wrx 6mt. Bright red with black wheels.and a set of 2011 sti wheels with blizzaks for winter. It's my wife's car, so I only drive it when she rides along. Never been to the track or autox. Mostly highway miles and some city driving. In 16 months, it has 18k miles. We bought it brand new...2 miles on the clock when we went out for the test drive.

 

She short shifts the 6mt because it bucks too much otherwise. I find it somewhat clunky as well. When it's warm, its not bad.

 

The creaking from the plastic in the seat area is obnoxious. We did 4000 mile road trip which was pretty comfortable as long as we stayed on the highway. Getting on the backroads got pretty noisy after a bit. Gas mileage has settled around 24mpg.

 

As a grand touring car, it's ok. We've both agreed the wagon rode better. However, the wagon was setup for going fast and was terrible in the city. On the highway it was a dream ride. Michelin SuperSport in the summer, blizzaks in the winter. Full whiteline with bc racing c/o. I had as much money in suspension tuning as the dyno tuning.

 

My interior is all original. I have the upgrades to enable Bluetooth sitting in a box.

 

In your case, I'd take whitetiger's suggestions and try out your car afterwards. I'd look into another tuner as well, as the stumble has a known solution and relatively easy fix. With the stumble gone, the car should be alot more fun. If you tune for a broad torque plateau rather than max hp on the dyno, it'll be more fun to drive. For the interior bits, figure out whats important and ignore the rest.

 

I wish we had bought the nice specb that came up for sale not long after we bought the WRX. We'd be money ahead and have a nicer car. If I was you, I'd revert some of the bolt ons, get a new tuner and tell them how you want the car to be (not just numbers on a dyno), replace the springs, upgrade the ICE to meet your needs. That's all less than a 6 year old WRX.

 

Ymmv

[BoozeRS05]

I'm likely to go with a 3.6R Legacy when/if the time comes to move on from 4th gens entirely. The 6th gen styling has caught up to my style/size tastes. If they were offered in a 5mt or 6mt I'd have made the switch already.

[Tronic]

If they were offered in a 5mt or 6mt I'd have made the switch already.

 

And there is the problem. They all used to have 4 wheels......well AWD 4 wheels and were simply offered in Auto or Manual but they have stuffed that up and thats before you even get to the styling that you may or may not like.

[covertrussian]

I'm likely to go with a 3.6R Legacy when/if the time comes to move on from 4th gens entirely. The 6th gen styling has caught up to my style/size tastes. If they were offered in a 5mt or 6mt I'd have made the switch already.

 

I actually really like the last of the 6th gen, more specifically the 2019 Legacy sport in charcoal gray:

 

But 3.6 isn't enough to convince me, if it was turbo I would be all over it.

[whitetiger]

if it was turbo I would be all over it.

 

wouldn't we all...

[covertrussian]

wouldn't we all...

 

To my surprise there are a bunch of people on here and in meat space that prefer the h6/v6's instead.

 

Show me a 400bhp V6 that gets 30mpg, maybe then I'll change my mind.

[whitetiger]

well, by "we" i meant enthusiasts. FWIW, the 3.6R, if subaru wanted, could be mated to aMT, and tuned for 93octane, and would be a decent performance legacy with around 280+ Crank HP.

[boxkita]

That 2019 looks alit like a WRX.

 

I was in Ireland last month and saw both a European spec 4th gen wagon and a levorg. Even with all of mine DOA, the 4th gen loojs good. Now if I could keep them running. :-)

[covertrussian]

Agreed! A more tame, grown up WRX, a lot less attention grabbing, cheaper insurance, and yet still looks papa-WRX.

[BoozeRS05]

Exactly my thoughts. The +15 6th gen basically look like a WRX now, but there's not all the crap that comes along with driving a WRX.

 

And agreed the H6 can be modded to be a quick enough DD for me, it just lacks a MT setup and I'm not interested in an AT at this point in my life.

[Tronic]

Do you get the 3.6RS over in the USA ? Its a Subaru factory tuned 3.6 with 10% more power.

 

I'm not surprised that the latest generation went down well in the USA, the second it came out I said it looked like it was designed for the USA, it looked like an American car. Unfortunately I really don't like the general look of American cars.

 

No idea why they didn't go for a global platform years ago, making what is quite a different car for each market must be a nightmare and added cost.

 

My current Legacy is so different from the one sold in this country new, it may as well be a different car.

[boxkita]

Agreed! A more tame, grown up WRX, a lot less attention grabbing, cheaper insurance, and yet still looks papa-WRX.

 

Seems like a Toyota. I like the GT nature of the 4th gen. Toyota doesn't really have that. However I'm not the target market for the 6th gen legacy. Now the 2020 Jeep Gladiator with diesel upgrade... I am that market. :-)

[Dishwasher]

I'd probably look at a Golf R or GTI before anything in Subaru's lineup these days.

[Darryn]

Mulling around ideas in my head lately about trading off my Spec. B for a near-new WRX. The more I drive it, the more I don't enjoy it. The car as a whole is great, gobs of power, wicked clean... there are a few things that bother me about it tho.

 

I have owned a WRX, and STi in the past and currently own a Legacy Spec B. I have gone for long test drives in both the 2015 STi and 2016 WRX as well, so I will comment on what you mention from my point of view

1) "I hate how the 6-speed operates."

All of the STi based 6-speeds drive in a way the isn't the easiest to drive smooth, but it is very rewarding with practice. Having driven older and newer WRX, STi and Legacies, I have also noticed that a lot of the difficulty getting a smooth start and 1 to 2 shift comes down to the AWD system as well as waiting for a split second when shifting so that you don't get ahead of the relatively heavy flywheels in these cars. In short, all Subaru vehicles other than the BRZ have similar driving characteristics in that way. The VA WRX also has a really light clutch and rev-hang, so you might find it worse in some ways vs the legacy spec B. Some things that help a lot with getting the car to drive smoother are equal length headers with a tune (much smoother in the low RPMs) or bushings (the pitch stop mount helped a lot in my case at a cost of under 100 dollars). However, Subaru AWD cars will never shift as smooth as a FWD or RWD car no matter how many mods.

2) "For some reason it feels like there's play in the clutch, and the firewall cracks each time I hit the brake or clutch."

This could be related to the car being older, the throwout bearing in the STi does sometimes become worn enough to make noise but not yet need replacement which sometimes also causes that.

3) "I can't seem to warm up to the Bilsteins, either. They're new all around, and I put Tein H-Tech's on them (and maybe that was an issue) but they ride terrible. There's also a clunk in the front strut I can't rid. I put Cusco sways and the handling improved mildly. "

So... I used to have S-Techs on my spec B (very briefly) which ride even worse and have the same issues you mention when put on the Bilstein Struts. It is likely that your strut is bottoming out and that the swaybars helped to hide that somewhat by reducing the suspension independance (I found the same thing when I added sways shortly before I removed the S-Techs). I have since replaced the entire Spec B spring and strut with KW Variant 2 coilovers. They handle and ride way nicer despite the much higher spring rates, and this is largely due to the damping. The KW's ride better than anything I have experienced in a stock Subaru Legacy Spec B, STi, or WRX by a fair bit.

4) "I'm itching for creature comforts... It's a pain in the ass to put an aftermarket radio in my for bluetooth, due to the factory NAV"

You are very correct on this. There are various ways to fix this, from adapters, to aftermarket head unit above the stock nav, to a JDM 2 din setup. The cost is expensive and you really need to love the car and be willing to put up with 10 yr. old car problems for this to be worth it.

5) "I'm in a position financially to get into a near-new WRX without a payment - that's why I'm considering it."

As pointed out by a few others in earlier posts, some of the problems are due to your car being 10 years old. The new VA chassis STi is very similar to our cars but with great power and handling out of the box instead of after mods. The VA chassis WRX is a different, yet more efficient, engine and a (in my opinion) inferior 6 speed gear box and AWD system vs. the Spec B, I don't even think it includes a rear LSD in the lastest version.

 

I bought my Spec B back in 2013 and I love it, despite having things like the radiator and clutch slave cylinder fail on me in the past. If I knew that the 2015 STi would be so similar to what I wanted after modding the car, I would have just bought that and added and EL header+tune. However, since I already had the Spec B at a much lower cost and I am willing to put up with repair and other older car issues, it didn't make sense to switch.

 

What you really need to ask yourself it what are the things you really love about your Subaru, and does the Spec B or even a newer Subaru deliver that? What about other brands - in your case I would highly consider looking at the alternatives out there. However, in my case, I love the STi 6 speed, I love the way the AWD system handles with VDC disabled, and I feel I have sufficient power to satisfy me at stage 2+ power levels so I won't be switching soon.

[Tronic]

However, since I already had the Spec B at a much lower cost and I am willing to put up with repair and other older car issues, it didn't make sense to switch.

 

What you really need to ask yourself it what are the things you really love about your Subaru, and does the Spec B or even a newer Subaru deliver that?

 

Yes thats the same problem I have. I looked at the WRX and the STi but its basically what I already have in the current wagon. 6MT is the same, suspension is similar and even the pedals are the same. Simply cannot justify buying a new car at over 4 times the price, the current models have just gone nowhere to justify it as an "Upgrade". The H6 engine also allows you to stay with something without a turbo. Don't get me wrong I love Turbos but for long term reliability, the turbo will shit itself before the engine. The other problem is that I'm never going to buy an STi while it remains a sedan, the wagon is just to versatile.

[BoozeRS05]

My insurance policy for my wagon is excellent and super cheap, don't know what two +10 year old Legacys will be like just yet, but I'm nearly certain driving a WRX would at least double my annual insurance cost.

 

Been mentioned, but worth another mention when considering the upgrayedd.

[AdirondackLGT]

I also have an '11 WRX, I don't love it tho. Maybe I'm just ready to move into something else, I do get 'bored' with what I'm driving after a while. Every time I pass a car w/ the Legacy I remember why I like it... But, still considering a Tacoma. Little bit of sticker shock tho.

[JmP6889928]

Yes thats the same problem I have. I looked at the WRX and the STi but its basically what I already have in the current wagon. 6MT is the same, suspension is similar and even the pedals are the same. Simply cannot justify buying a new car at over 4 times the price, the current models have just gone nowhere to justify it as an "Upgrade". The H6 engine also allows you to stay with something without a turbo. Don't get me wrong I love Turbos but for long term reliability, the turbo will shit itself before the engine. The other problem is that I'm never going to buy an STi while it remains a sedan, the wagon is just to versatile.

 

Turbos, while being exceptional for free horsepower, are now being put on just about every new car being built. They put in a smaller engine and put a turbo on it so it will behave like a larger engine, but still get decent mileage.

 

There are going to be a lot of "Booms" from VW, Toyota, Nissan, Kia, Hyundai, and others when the manufacturers start having to replace these things under warranty. My prediction is that most of them will give up on the turbos by 2022 and will be back with more efficient larger engines to get rid of the warranty costs associated with the smaller engine/turbo combinations.

[Guest]

The decent mileage is all scam, unless you drive like a total grandma.