2015 3.6r CVT Fluid

[Too40gawlf]

The fluid capacity is 12ish quarts but if you do a drain and fill you will have stuck in the transmission assembly itself (torque converter, valve body, etc) and you’ll only get about half out. That’s why I am interested if that is a drain or flush. Otherwise you still have half old fluid.

 

Law of diminishing returns... 1/2, then 1/4, then 1/8, 1/16, etc.

 

True. And thus, the very high cost of the CVT fluid prevents me from doing a proper 'flush'. If the fluid were cheaper, I would do a drain and fill 3 times until I started seeing brilliantly clear fluid. But with $15 a qt fluid, thats not going to happen until later in the service life of the transmission.

[ammcinnis]

... the burning question is what have you done with your Subaru? Do you/did you change the CVTF or just let it ride?

 

I plan to drain/refill the CVT fluid in both our Legacy and Outback at somewhere around 100,000 miles, unless specific conditions arise that might indicate an earlier change. This is a personal judgment, based on both research and prior experience. YMMV.

 

FWIW, the highest CVT fluid temperature I've ever observed was ~215 degrees F, cruising across southwest Texas on I-10 in our Legacy at 75-80 mph on a 104 degree day. 190s are more typical.

 

Any chance you could do a quick sweep of the STIS for a TSB or training information ...

Sorry, I don't currently have subscription access. I only subscribe for 3 days every 12 to 18 months or so. With a little advance planning, you can download a huge amount of useful information in 36 hours.

[Pilot1226]

Thanks. Did you download the FSM with a macro or script or just click the links yourself? Anything you focus on downloading, like TSBs etc?

[Gravy]

Thanks All, learning a lot from this thread.

 

Are special tools required to flush the cvt so that all of the fluid is replaced and the correct temp is maintained? Wondering if dealers are better setup for this procedure than an indy shop.

[Grnlantern1]

Thanks All, learning a lot from this thread.

 

Are special tools required to flush the cvt so that all of the fluid is replaced and the correct temp is maintained? Wondering if dealers are better setup for this procedure than an indy shop.

I have 77k on my 15' 3.6r and had it I for Diff Fluid changes last week and techs told me d ont worry about the CVT Fluid.. Your Diffs take more abuse than the Tranny..

 

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk

[Brisvegas]

I plan to drain/refill the CVT fluid in both our Legacy and Outback at somewhere around 100,000 miles, unless specific conditions arise that might indicate an earlier change. .

 

I think this is a sensible plan.

 

FWIW here is a clip that might be of interest. Although it's not specific to CVT's, I think the general thoughts expressed are quite relevant.

 

[ammcinnis]

Did you download the FSM with a macro or script or just click the links yourself?

 

I used a shell script to automate the FSM download (>1200 PDF files), which took a little more than 24 hours. I then used the remaining time to manuallly download everything else of interest I had previously selected: the Body Repair Manual, relevant TSBs and recalls, dealer/technician training materials, back issues of TechTips magazine, etc.

 

The last time I checked, STIS still limits you to 50 downloads an hour. The download script for the FSM handles that automatically, but you do need to take that into consideration when planning your manual downloads.

[Pilot1226]

I think this is a sensible plan.

 

FWIW here is a clip that might be of interest. Although it's not specific to CVT's, I think the general thoughts expressed are quite relevant.

 

 

Thanks for the movie. Interesting school of thought. But with a drain-and-fill you're only getting half out. Does that mean you should do it more than the 60k interval he's suggesting?

 

I used a shell script to automate the FSM download (>1200 PDF files), which took a little more than 24 hours. I then used the remaining time to manuallly download everything else of interest I had previously selected: the Body Repair Manual, relevant TSBs and recalls, dealer/technician training materials, back issues of TechTips magazine, etc.

 

The last time I checked, STIS still limits you to 50 downloads an hour. The download script for the FSM handles that automatically, but you do need to take that into consideration when planning your manual downloads.

 

Thanks. I will have to bribe you with some paypal cash for that script when the time comes. I have no idea about scripting.

 

Honestly, we can probably talk about this all day. Someone mentioned a bulletin about Subaru quietly changing the interval. Here's some food for thought: Subaru Canada requires a much more often interval for replacement whether you're towing or not. Just something to think about.

 

Seems like on all the boards and forums, there's a few schools of thought:

 

1. Don't change it, period, because it says you don't have to.

2. Change it often, like every 30k, because of the law of diminishing returns. Meaning, if you drain the fluid at 100k, and refill, you still have half the fluid with 100k miles on it. If you waited again until 200k, you now have 33% of the fluid with 200k, 33% with 100k, and 33% with "0" miles.

3. Change it somewhere between "never" and "30k"

4. Go get a stick shift. Which I would absolutely do if I could get a manual in a Legacy. Maybe they'll bring the GT back in a couple years. Then again, sticks have wear parts too. Instead of paying for fluid changes or possible transmission repairs, you're paying for clutch linings, detente springs, and synchros.

 

Thanks All, learning a lot from this thread.

 

Are special tools required to flush the cvt so that all of the fluid is replaced and the correct temp is maintained? Wondering if dealers are better setup for this procedure than an indy shop.

 

Well, you really just need the procedure that you can get from the factory service manual but you do need the Subaru Select Tool to check the temperature of the fluid since it's a pretty tight window for that. Some people have used meat thermometers and tried the cold out cold in fluid trick, but I dunno.

 

The temperature is important because if it's too hot you'll drain too much out of the transmission. If it's too cold you'll add too much because of the thermal contraction/expansion.

[Too40gawlf]

Your Diffs take more abuse than the Tranny..

 

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk

 

Whats the logic behind that? The tranny is mated directly to an engine and is absorbing the rotational power of 250 ft/lbs of torque.

[Pilot1226]

For reference, I found this on the Subaru Canada maintenance site.

 

https://www.subaru.ca/WebPage.aspx?WebPageID=18541

 

Your next service will include:

Scheduled maintenance for 100,000 km / 60 Months

Replace engine oil and filter

Replace camshaft drive belts (STI only)

Rotate tires

Inspect tire condition and adjust all tire pressures including spare tire

Remove, inspect and service front and rear brakes

Inspect and adjust all fluid levels

Inspect operation of all lights, wipers and washers

Inspect and adjust drive belt tension if necessary

Service battery

Inspect axle boot condition

Lubricate all latches, hinges and locks (hood, doors, fuel door and trunk lid)

Inspect all steering and suspension components

Inspect under body for damage

Test coolant, inspect hoses and clamps

Inspect engine & air cabin filters - replace if necessary

Replace spark plugs

Replace transmission and differential fluids

Road test vehicle

 

 

So, that's 5 years, or a little over 60,000 miles. Interesting. I'm curious as to whether this is an accidental "leftover" from the 4/5EAT-era of ATF changes or if this is tailored. I believe it's up to date because the timing belt service specifically lists the STI only for it, as that's the last model at present that uses one.

 

I suppose I could stomach it every 60k miles when I do a plug change at the dealer anyway. (I'm not going to try to tackle the 3.6 plug job, I've heard it's a beast)

 

@Ammcinnis

 

How did/do you monitor the temperature of the Legacy when you were on your drive? Is this something accessible through the menus on the touchscreen, or did you use some type of OBD reader?

[ammcinnis]

How did/do you monitor the temperature of the Legacy when you were on your drive?

 

I normally use a quality OBD-to-Bluetooth adapter (Obdlink LX) and a free app (ActiveOBD or Torque) on my Android phone. The Obdlink LX adapter has a dark current draw of only 2 mA, so I just leave it plugged into the OBD-II port most of the time.

 

I have a plug-in OBD-II scan tool, too, but I seldom use it any more.

[Pilot1226]

I see. I suppose I would have to find something that works with iOS. I’d be curious to how hot it gets when I start paddle shifting.

 

I’d be curious to see how hot it needs to get before the AT OIL light comes on.

[ArmyVetMP]

I have always wondered about this. I currently have 183,xxx miles on my 2010 Legacy 2.5i and have never had a CVT Fluid Flush, nor the Differentials. I have received a "AT OIL TEMP" warning 2 or 3 times while driving, usually in stop and go traffic, over the 4 years that I have owned the vehicle. I bought the car in December 2013 with 28k miles on it, and now just over 4 years of ownership I am at 183,xxx. I was always told that the CVT is a "Maintenance Free" transmission.

[Gravy]

For reference, I found this on the Subaru Canada maintenance site.

 

https://www.subaru.ca/WebPage.aspx?WebPageID=18541

 

 

 

So, that's 5 years, or a little over 60,000 miles. Interesting. I'm curious as to whether this is an accidental "leftover" from the 4/5EAT-era of ATF changes or if this is tailored. I believe it's up to date because the timing belt service specifically lists the STI only for it, as that's the last model at present that uses one.

 

I suppose I could stomach it every 60k miles when I do a plug change at the dealer anyway. (I'm not going to try to tackle the 3.6 plug job, I've heard it's a beast)

 

Interesting, I am getting all of the above done at 65k, including the CVT service. The US 60k service includes all of the above, except for CVT service.

[securityguy]

I have always wondered about this. I currently have 183,xxx miles on my 2010 Legacy 2.5i and have never had a CVT Fluid Flush, nor the Differentials.

 

You have never changed the fluid in your diff??? I'd hate to see what that looks like if you ever pull the plug:eek:

[ArmyVetMP]

You have never changed the fluid in your diff??? I'd hate to see what that looks like if you ever pull the plug:eek:

 

Dealer has never even recommended it either.

[Pilot1226]

Dealer has never even recommended it either.

 

You may want to do that. It’s a pretty easy DIY but you need the right tools.

 

Anyway as for the AT OIL light. Subaru extended warranties for all 2010-15 CVT models. It lasts for 1 year after receipt of letter with unlimited miles, or up to 10 years/100k miles after that... I think that 1 year/unlimited ends around June 2018. You should bring it to them. They should fix it for free or at least check the fluid. They should be able to verify your coverage via the VIN. You can also call the corporate number and have them check the VIN for you to avoid any service department games.

[surmiser]

I see. I suppose I would have to find something that works with iOS. I’d be curious to how hot it gets when I start paddle shifting.

 

I’d be curious to see how hot it needs to get before the AT OIL light comes on.

 

 

Although the OBDLink LX that @Ammcinnis uses is Android-only, the same company makes the OBDLink MX, which comes in a WiFi version that works with iOS. I'm using it with my iPhone.

 

Transmission temperature monitoring with the bundled OBDLink (vendor-specific version of OBD2 Fusion) iOS app requires some fiddling to set up a custom PID though. FYI.

[Pilot1226]

Although the OBDLink LX that @Ammcinnis uses is Android-only, the same company makes the OBDLink MX, which comes in a WiFi version that works with iOS. I'm using it with my iPhone.

 

Transmission temperature monitoring with the bundled OBDLink (vendor-specific version of OBD2 Fusion) iOS app requires some fiddling to set up a custom PID though. FYI.

 

Thanks, I'll check them out. What's a custom PID? You've lost me.

 

Seems like Amazon is all sold out of them. Are there any other options to use? I found one that's $130 from ScanTool but I'm wondering if a wired route would be a better option? I can use a laptop or something to connect via USB, obviously I'd lose the real-time data though.

 

What are your thoughts on the OBDLink SX USB? Would it work with my 2011? Does it "save" the torque/hp charts until I import them into my laptop, or does it require my laptop to be inside my car and connected? Would the SX show me my CVT temperature?

 

Think I found the PID you are talking about.

 

Information*

Name = Transmission Temp

Description = Transmission Temp

Category = Transmission

Manufacturer = Subaru

 

Units

Metric Units = C

English Unit = F

Min Value = -40

Max Value = 150

Metric to English Scale Factor = 1.8

Metric to English Offset = 32

 

OBD Information

Module/Header = 7E1

OBD Mode = 22

PID Number = 1017

Priority = Medium

 

Equation = A-50

[ArmyVetMP]

You may want to do that. It’s a pretty easy DIY but you need the right tools.

 

Anyway as for the AT OIL light. Subaru extended warranties for all 2010-15 CVT models. It lasts for 1 year after receipt of letter with unlimited miles, or up to 10 years/100k miles after that... I think that 1 year/unlimited ends around June 2018. You should bring it to them. They should fix it for free or at least check the fluid. They should be able to verify your coverage via the VIN. You can also call the corporate number and have them check the VIN for you to avoid any service department games.

 

I have had the Torque Converter Replaced under the extended warranty, did it a couple months ago as my car started stalling when coming to a stop, akin to not engaging the clutch on a manual. (I would imagine the did a flush of the fluid at the same time, so I could be wrong on having never done the Tranny fluid.)

[Pilot1226]

Not sure if they did a flush. Probably not. However to get into the torque converter they had to drain and fill SOME fluid.

[upstater]

I was always told that the CVT is a "Maintenance Free" transmission.

 

 

I have no plans to change the CVT fluid in mine, but I will turn it in at the end of the lease with probably about 32k miles on it.

 

But if you plan to keep the car...

 

 

[ArmyVetMP]

I have no plans to change the CVT fluid in mine, but I will turn it in at the end of the lease with probably about 32k miles on it.

 

But if you plan to keep the car...

 

 

 

I plan to keep the car till it dies lol. Im currently at 184,xxx miles on it. Car is paid off. I myself could never lease a vehicle, the Mileage overage fees would murder me. I drive on average, 40,000 miles a year.

[ehsnils]

I plan to keep the car till it dies lol. Im currently at 184,xxx miles on it. Car is paid off. I myself could never lease a vehicle, the Mileage overage fees would murder me. I drive on average, 40,000 miles a year.

Taxi Driver?

[chowser51]

Wow! I thought I was bad at 20k+ a year.

 

I could never lease.