how to use romraider on 05-09 lgt

[gtonstilts]

Tuning with Romraider:

 

 

All the below info is assuming you already have your pc set up with ecu flash, romraider ecu editor, romraider logger, latest ecu definitions and proper drivers.

Also it is not recomended to do any tuning without an external wideband o2 sensor installed in the down pipe and the ability to log its data

Also a 3 port electronic boost controller can give much better control

 

 

Also i am not going to get into scaling of maf or injectors because the manufacturers specs are available for most maf tubes and injectors

 

 

 

Step one see what you are working with

take a log with the current tune

the most important parameters to log are

 

 

Wide band o2 AFR

Engine load 2 byte g/rev

Engine Speed RPM

 

Manifold relative pressure corrected

Ignition total Timing

IAT C or F intake air temp

ECT C or F engine coolant temp

Knock sum

FKC feedback knoc correction

FLKC fine learn knock correction

Primary wastegate duty cycle

Throttle opening angle

Volumetric efficiency calculated

 

 

for best results Take a logs of 4th gear from low rpm to redline

3rd gear logs are very usefull too but at the end of the process you will want to redline 4th at least once to tighten things up, it will hit higher numbers in 4th and 5th gear so tuning in 3rd only is not recomended

 

 

find a long, flat, road that is wide open no traffic or speed traps, try to use the same stretch everytime. keep in mind redline in 3rd gear is around 100mph and redline in 4th is closer to 140mph so this is not for the faint of heart.....

 

 

Logs can be taken at full or partial throttle, many tuners only worry about WOT, which = bad drivability

best to log at a few diff throttle positions for example 35% 50% 75% and 100%, this will show you many cells in the map that would never appear in the logs with only WOT, diff grades of hill can also show otherwise hard to hit load cells

 

 

now time to take your logs, make sure all of the above perimeters are being logged start at a very low speed around 20mph or 2k rpm accelerate, the rear defrost button should work to activate record log....

if you are having a troublesome rpm, or load that knocks, goes lean or feels off try to duplicate it and catch it in a log

 

 

Now it is time to review your logs. what to look for:

you will want to see what the AFR's are at diff load's

The AFR's should be 14.7 at idle and off boost cruise

When aproaching boost -1 to 0psi you will want to richen things up to 12.0 to 12.5 this will keep you safe when it spool.

from 1psi-8psi you can get away with 11.5 AFR's

Above +8psi bring the AFR down to 11.0

For max boost on cars running more than stock boost shoot for 10.8

the better the intercooler the leaner you can get away with but for tmic 10.8-11.0 is good target, for quality FMIC 11.5 is ok and can make better power

 

 

now that you know what AFR should be its time to compare the log numbers to your target numbers, if you are good with accel you can make very useful charts for this. i just use the columns of raw data...

 

 

now keep in mind that the G/rev will not always stay the same for same psi, the fuel map will be RPM vs G/rev so you will need to look at g/rev boost psi and rpm the boost will let you know what you want where and the other 2 perameters will give you the location of that cell in fuel map

 

 

the fuel map on this ecu will show the desired afr, just because you enter all 10.8's at max boost does not mean you will run at 10.8, som cells may require 9.46 some may need 12.37 this all comes down to your set up and how well your maf and injectors are scaled.

 

 

for example if you have an AFR reading of 11.34 at 5500rpm with 20psi of boost and TMIC you will want to run a more conservative 10.8 AFR so in the fuel map you will find the closest cell that aligns up to that rpm with the g/rev it produced at that psi, and change it to a lower number, you will want to make small changes at first untill you realy get a handle on how much you changes actually change log numbers for this scenario lets say it was at 10.8 in the map but actually running 11.34 , i would adjust the map number to 10.6 and re test, maybe next time it will run 10.96 , so again compair and adjust until the actuall AFR is as close to your desired AFR, you will do this for every cell you can find a match for in logs, you will find this only shows you a small portion of the map, additional part throttle runs will be necessary to get the entire map perfect.

 

 

AFR's will change with temperature, you can try to skew the IAT scaling but it really dosn't do much, i have taken logs of temp swings and found the diff of 80 degf to 40 degf changed my afr's by .4 for same tune just diff temp, with this said there is no perfect tune for all conditions you may want a winter tune a summer tune and a fall/spring tune depending on your areas temp swings, otherwise you can tune for 10.6 at max boost when the temps are on the cold side of your areas fall weather. this will get you to 10.8-11.0 ranger when temps drop and 10.4ish in the summer which is safe.

 

 

If you are running more that oem boost levels you will need to re scale your fuel and ignition maps to go to higher g rev numbers the oem maps only go as high as 2.5 g/rev, this means that when higher numbers are seen the map will peg at last available cell, this is not good because the map needs to taper and run less timing and more fuel as these oem limitations of flow are surpassed, the trick is to find rows with similar numbers and combine them giving you a free space which you can shuffle to the right. it is ok if you are logging numbers a little higher than last map cell but keep it tight otherwise in winter you will hit even higher numbers and it cant compensate, try to leave 1 cell that almost gets reached, for example if you see max g/rev of 3.5 in logs scale maps to atleast 3.6

 

 

Next i wil cover AVCS a lot of power and drivability is to be had here, however on LGT/2.5xt aplications we can only controll the intak can so it is great for low and mid range but does nothing for top end

 

 

first things first there is a nasty hole in the oem map between 2k and 3600 they pull all the advance for emissions, this area is all zero's w 5's tapering into 10's. at the very least make this area all 10's it will cruise much nicer and is always ready and happy,

 

 

 

without a dyno the best way to tune the avcs is to Tune for Highest Volumetric Efficiency, try adding 5 deg to everything and comparing the numbers, continue to add 5 deg until it stops increasing efficiency, at which point try coming down in 1-2 def increments settle on highest ve numbers with lowest advance, there is no reason to run more advance if it has no increase in power. changes of avcs may require ignition timing to be less agresive, for the purpose of testing run conservative timing and keep it the same for each avcs VE test. worry about optimizing ignition timing after you have your VE max via valve tuning.

 

 

 

the oem avcs settings go as high as 20 deg very low in rpm, i have found the engine responds much better to 25 in this area and as high as 31 deg even higher after 4k the avcs needs to roll of and after 4400rpm it needs to roll almost completely off

to optimize these settings map should be re scaled to higher rpm and higher g/rev

 

 

Next figure out how much boost you want to run and adjust boost map as well as WGDC maps to acieve this boost. you need to realistically figure out what boost you can run and until what rpm

 

for vf40 you can run 18 psi to around 5-5.5k then taper boost off. do not try to get more out of it because you will just get hot air, more timing and less boost will make more power after the turbo starts to runs out of steam

 

 

the boost map should be re scaled so that there are more break points in the spool rmp's 2800-4000 is where the most control is needed, getting the fastest spool out of your turbo is kind of like trying to pull your parachute at the last poss sec and not break both your legs lol, the higher the WGDC the more boost you will make 90% is the highest you can run 0 is the lowest you will want to run 90% until one cell before your spool cell, lets say you hit max boost at 3300 rpm, run 90% up till 3150 then it will need to come down to 75ish then at spool you will need 40-60 % turbo will stay in this range for a while and as it runs out of steam higher wgdc 60-70% may be needed to maintain the same boost, these numbers are just estimates, close to what i have on my 16g ej257

 

 

 

for you boost map up till full boost rpm try to target just above what it makes in logs this leaves room for more and keeps it realistic, you will want to taper the boost target down with less than wot and a lot of drivability and throttle response can be had here.

 

 

for WGDC ther is an initial map as well as a max map, the goal here is to have the initial low enough to that it does not over boost and the max low enough to keep it from over boosting, i know this sound confusing but think of it this way, if i want 90% up till 3150 rpm i can set initial and max to 90% and its locked in. now if i want 75% at 3300 rpm i might run 65-70 initial and 80% for max this will give you that much wiggle room, this is needed due to the fact that every gear will spool differently so if you tune for fastest spool in 3rd gear and then throw it in 5th and floor it its not going to be right it will over boost, you need to find the highest numbers that work in 5th gear for max and the highest initial for 3rd gear, this will give you a good low gear spool and keep it safe on the highway, aditionaly there is an target boost compensatin table that can help or hurt you cause depending on how its used, its purpose is to limit boost to a certain psi befor a certain vehicle speed, this can be use full if you overboost in first gear, however it will effect any gear if under that rpm so it can also make the wgdc go nuts, i have mine set to a ridiculous number that i will not surpass 15psi and 2mph

 

 

 

Finaly we get to ignition timing, there is the base map which gives you your starting point, from there timing can be added and subtracted by other parameters for example the knock correction advance max table and iat compensation. the main maps to adjust are base and knock correction advance max, you can start by adding a deg or 2 to the advance table and se how it responds, the main thing you are looking for is Knock sum, if you deveolp any knocking from adding timing, stop adding timing to that area. you can run more timing in off boost areas as well as more timing at higher rpm, however as boost increases so does rpm so you may find it flat lining on total timing, this is what you are looking for you want lots of timing till boost then pull timing per more g/rev/boost vs adding timing per rpm increase, i run around 38-40 deg cruising and 14-16 deg wot at max boost, make sure the IAM ignition advance multiplier stays at 1.0 at all times if it goes lower you have too much timing somewhere ! at this point you should start adding timing to the base map in small increments and closely watch fbck and knock sum, continue to make small changes and reviewing logs until desired power is reached or until knock is present, turn down knock area at which point you can either call it a day or continue to add timing in other parts of map, not all knocks are to be worried about there is the occasional fluke and a half dozen knocks on an hr drive is no big deal, however a few knocks per pull or even 1 consistently is not acceptable, knocks can be remedy by either pulling timing, pulling boost or adding fuel, also higher intake air temps can cause knock due to the intercooler being less efficient and raising the actual intake temps.

the oem IAT sensor by the way is located before the turbo and intercooler so it really just measures under hood temps, i find its generally 10 deg higher than ambient temp and temp rises a deg every few sec when sitting idle

you deff don't want a knock limited tune, meaning that any more timing and it will knock, so make sure there is a deg or 2 left. this way you will not knock on hot days or winter gas.

 

 

Also the Fan temps can be changed and this makes a big difference in coolant temps. my car use to run high 190's and sometimes 206 f now it runs between 179 and 189 never gets higher, i have not changed the speed settings due to lack of info on this however you can do a lot with just the ect portion

 

 

whenever possible try to tune for 1 new part at a time, so if your going to do bigger turbo and injectors, install the injectors and dial those in first, then install the larger turbo and tune for that

 

 

the last map i will get into is DBW the requested TQ number should be increased i have mine at 400 WOT and scaled down to 0 in the 0% i have seen the wot as high as 420 before not sure how high it can go but 400 feels nice !

this will make a huge diff in the performance of 5eat automatic

 

 

ok guys remember small changes and re test, also get it to run right before you turn up the power. may the force be with you !

[cryo]

I would be very careful giving out advice like that as a general. There are some good pieces in there but not all can be summed up that easy.

 

Perfect example is 07+ ecu's use DBW requested torque in the boost tables and wastegate duty tables instead of load like your 05 ecu. You must be very careful adjusting the DBW tables in these ecu's as it can lead to all sorts of confusion and throttle closures as well as inconsistent boost for what's being requested.

 

Also doing logs in 4th gear are not a great idea and even on a dyno this is not normally performed from a low rpm. That induces a ton of extra heat in the system as well as builds up coolant temps to very hot levels before the car even gets into the powerband. Testing control in 4th is ok but I never suggest doing a full 2k-redline log in a 5 speed car in 4th gear for a few different reasons. The changes you make should use the closest gear to 1:1 ratio possible and adjustments to higher and lower gear control should be based around that. Also going 140 for logging purposes is just not safe on any road,street etc as animals,rocks, and things like blowing a tire can lead to injury or death.

 

My advice is always read,read,read, think about a change your not sure of, research the effects,read,read,read.....test your results and then compare. Then read some more

 

Happy tuning....

 

Dave

[gtonstilts]

i was unaware that the 07+ had diff ecu logic, so that is deff something for non 05-06 guys to keep in mind...

 

however i am confused about your take on 4th gear logging you said

 

"I never suggest doing a full 2k-redline log in a 5 speed car in 4th gear for a few different reasons. The changes you make should use the closest gear to 1:1 ratio possible and adjustments to higher and lower gear control should be based around that. Also going 140 for logging purposes is just not safe on any road,street"

 

this makes no sense to me because 4th gear is the 1:1 ratio gear in every 5 speed trans ive ever seen auto or stick, so it seems you recommend tuning in 4th gear (because its 1:1)but also recommend not tuning in 4th gear (because the 1:1 gear is better) lol

 

as far as coolant temp getting to hot when going 2k-redline in 4th, this is not a problem for me my engine never gets hotter than 192f ever and when i run it hard it generally stays bellow 189f no matter waht gear im in

 

i understand 140 on public roads is very dangerous but with the gearing my 05 obxt has that's redline in 4th aka the 1:1 gear, i would however deff recommend using a dragstrip or similar non passenger roads

[m sprank]

Dave is being nice about it, so I will let him take the lead on this one. Just wow.

[Max Capacity]

Dave is being nice about it, so I will let him take the lead on this one. Just wow.

 

Hence why a lot of us leave it to the experts.

[cryo]

I will just say use all the information in this thread at your own risk.

 

Dave

[MC_CHASE]

Any recommendations for a wide band O2 sensor? I'm about to start tuning for the first time.

[m sprank]

Dont waste your time with the 2.5i.

[MC_CHASE]

Do you say that because it is NA or is there some other reason?

[m sprank]

Because it is an NA and the gains are minimal. You can make more power running the stock tune and raising the compression to 11.5:1 and doing a mild port/polish on the heads (91 oct fuel min) than you can with a tune on a stock motor.

[gtonstilts]

for logging wide band i suggest the L1 works well at decent price