Dujo Posted February 5, 2015 Share Posted February 5, 2015 Note that Subarus do have a slightly higher incidence of blown head gaskets due to the flat 4 design since the head is totally on it's side. Head gasket failures almost always happen on the bottom side of the gasket (ie closer to the street side, not the closer to the hood side) because of gravity. And turbo cars are harder on gaskets than n/a. Therefore, turbo Subarus are harder on head gaskets in particular, so in this one particular area, Subarus are slightly more flawed than other makes. But I promise that the other makes have similar common design flaws as well. Nobody's perfect. The low center of gravity on the boxer more than makes up for the head gasket failures for me. And if you use a high quality gasket, the problem is mostly solved. Unfortunately, Subaru used a lot of cheaper head gaskets in manufacturing and they do tend to fail more often than other makes. And head gaskets is not a cheap fix (in terms of labor anyway). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrTris Posted February 5, 2015 Share Posted February 5, 2015 Note that Subarus do have a slightly higher incidence of blown head gaskets due to the flat 4 design since the head is totally on it's side. Head gasket failures almost always happen on the bottom side of the gasket (ie closer to the street side, not the closer to the hood side) because of gravity. And turbo cars are harder on gaskets than n/a. Therefore, turbo Subarus are harder on head gaskets in particular, so in this one particular area, Subarus are slightly more flawed than other makes. But I promise that the other makes have similar common design flaws as well. Nobody's perfect. The low center of gravity on the boxer more than makes up for the head gasket failures for me. And if you use a high quality gasket, the problem is mostly solved. Unfortunately, Subaru used a lot of cheaper head gaskets in manufacturing and they do tend to fail more often than other makes. And head gaskets is not a cheap fix. The gasket plays a big role in the equation, but, just as much, upgrading to head studs seems to solve the issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ivonr Posted February 5, 2015 Share Posted February 5, 2015 The gasket plays a big role in the equation, but, just as much, upgrading to head studs seems to solve the issue. any threads on this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrTris Posted February 5, 2015 Share Posted February 5, 2015 any threads on this? http://www.thomasnet.com/articles/hardware/head-stud-bolts : By contrast, a head stud can be tightened into place without any direct clamping force applied through the tightening. A stud can be threaded into a slot up to “finger tightness,” or the degree to which it would be tightened by hand. Afterward, the cylinder head is installed and a nut is torqued into place against the stud. The nut torque provides the clamping force, rather than the torque of the fastener itself, and the rotational force is avoided entirely. Because the stud is torqued from a relaxed state, the pressure from the nut will make it stretch only along the vertical axis without a concurrent twisting load. The result is a more evenly distributed and accurate torque load compared to that of the head bolt. This ultimately translates into higher reliability and a lower chance of head gasket failure. . . . In other words, head studs are better suited for high-performance vehicles with greater power requirements, while head bolts are more practical for personal, everyday automobiles. Therefore, it would be inaccurate to conclude that one type of fastener is categorically superior to the other. Rather, the preference depends on the automobile in question and the ways in which it will be put to use. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuck686 Posted February 5, 2015 Share Posted February 5, 2015 whatever year, a smart owner and consistent oil change records at 3-4k is what you want!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ivonr Posted February 5, 2015 Share Posted February 5, 2015 07+ are nice with the SI drive, but, unfortunately they've got the Disappointment heads (D-series heads with the air pumps mentioned). As with any car that's 7-10 years old now, you're gonna run into a lot of things that will need replacing, up to, and including the shortblock. can you elaborate a bit on this D series air pump issue please? first i hear of it...is there a thread? cant find anything Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrTris Posted February 5, 2015 Share Posted February 5, 2015 There's not a whole lot of threads on it, but, PIA isn't fans of those heads. See, when the 05-06s had cats in the UP, the heads were B25 and they were great. That's why most service advisors will gasp when they hear you've blown the HG on an LGT; it was, and, for the most part, still is uncommon. However, for the 07-09s, where the UP cat was eliminated, instead, they added an air pump to the heads. They had to change the head design, as well as the gasket. This change caused them to blow the gaskets more than their B-series counterparts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ivonr Posted February 5, 2015 Share Posted February 5, 2015 There's not a whole lot of threads on it, but, PIA isn't fans of those heads. See, when the 05-06s had cats in the UP, the heads were B25 and they were great. That's why most service advisors will gasp when they hear you've blown the HG on an LGT; it was, and, for the most part, still is uncommon. However, for the 07-09s, where the UP cat was eliminated, instead, they added an air pump to the heads. They had to change the head design, as well as the gasket. This change caused them to blow the gaskets more than their B-series counterparts. so is there a fix? air pump delete? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrTris Posted February 5, 2015 Share Posted February 5, 2015 Air pump delete is basically just a couple of block-off plates installed to plug the holes after you remove the air pump assembly; to fix it entirely, you'll want to get B25 heads and the gasket to go with. And also some ARP 260-4701 head studs while you're there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ivonr Posted February 5, 2015 Share Posted February 5, 2015 Air pump delete is basically just a couple of block-off plates installed to plug the holes after you remove the air pump assembly; to fix it entirely, you'll want to get B25 heads and the gasket to go with. And also some ARP 260-4701 head studs while you're there. is this a common mod people do for the 08-09? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrTris Posted February 5, 2015 Share Posted February 5, 2015 is this a common mod people do for the 08-09? Not at all. Have yet to see one done that way. I only know one who's putting D-series heads on his 05. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kred Posted February 5, 2015 Share Posted February 5, 2015 D-series heads are better in the sense that they outflow B25 heads. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GEE-OTTO Posted February 6, 2015 Share Posted February 6, 2015 is this a common mod people do for the 08-09? See my thread P24XX Codes and You There are two stages of failure: Failed and stuck open or Failing but operational This is all the result of moisture getting in the system at one of the poorly positioned spring clamped hose junctions (air pump to driver side hoses and the passenger connector hose). The only way you will ever know this is happening is when it throws a P24** or P1410 code or you perfrom a Air Pump Assist checkup as part of a scheduled service. The moisture rusts the solenoids and they stick open, the problem is they will allow exhaust gases to seep in and things will start to smoke up possibly melt, most importantly your Atmoshperic sensor, as it is part of the passenger side solenoid assembly. In cases like this you will need to block off the opening, pull the fuses for the pump and two solenoids then alter your map to disable the stuck open/closed and system low pressure codes. If you are smart you will prevent this from ever happening by pulling the pump and solenoid fuses and disabling the same codes The atmospheric pressure sensor will continue to operate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Created Posted February 7, 2015 Author Share Posted February 7, 2015 As far as LGT reliability goes I'm a little bit taken back by all the talk of high maintainence. It doesn't scare me away becuase I'm very particular and mechanicly inclined. I like tondo all my own work becuase i like to know exactly what and how things are done. That said I'm still surprised a bit. But turbo AWD power is just so awesome and these LGT's a bigger than WRX's EVO's Eclipse Golfs etc... I've had my share of Mitsubishi cars ( I know there's a bit of a rivalry between the two brands, so I'm not trying to start anything, but). I find Mitsu's to be very reliable, and very responsive to mods. For me to switch over to Subaru it's all due to the bigger car platform. I love AWD turbo cars. And that why I'm willing to put up with it. Can't wait till I start! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ttnio Posted February 8, 2015 Share Posted February 8, 2015 Lots of previously owned LGT's out there. Buyers market. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snm95ls Posted February 8, 2015 Share Posted February 8, 2015 Maybe I am still in the honeymoon stage, but my 06 terd has honestly been pretty damn reliable so far. I haven't "had" to do anything yet. It does drink more oil than I feel comfortable with so I probably #NANSB. There are things that I have upgraded because I wanted to improve upon things such as fresh struts and springs as well as fresh brakes all around. The only failure I have had to deal with is the wastegate flapper arm bushing backing out to the turbine housing which led to the WG sticking open. Again, I didn't "have" to fix it, but it sure as hell made the car more enjoyable to drive again. A good portion of the maintenance items were taken care of by the previous owner though, which was a huge plus and part of why I didn't feel the need to haggle over the asking price. If you are mechanically inclined, and have a decent amount of money to keep up on maintenance and repairs, then I wouldn't be too scared to pick a 4th gen LGT. They really are quite enjoyable and capable vehicles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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