nick916 Posted March 2, 2014 Share Posted March 2, 2014 Was running stage 2 91ACN SF tune and was shooting big flames mostly 2nd to 3rd upshifts...switched to stage 2 91 acn and same thing. I am running an SPT intake and stock BPV. This normal? Thanks, Nick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nubie Posted March 2, 2014 Share Posted March 2, 2014 Because race car. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick916 Posted March 2, 2014 Author Share Posted March 2, 2014 ^exactly what I was thinking... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhiteMonster06 Posted March 2, 2014 Share Posted March 2, 2014 Hmmmm I had this issue when I had an atmosphere venting BOV so I went back to recirc. You have the ap map from Cobb for their sf intake? If not, it's free to download from their site. I never had a lean/rich issue with this map and an intake. Monitor your AF ratio. Use the gauges in the Ap. make sure it's close to 14.7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LJH Posted March 3, 2014 Share Posted March 3, 2014 Are you catless? Cheers, Jim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick916 Posted March 3, 2014 Author Share Posted March 3, 2014 spt intake, AP stage 2 91 acn, gutted oem uppipe, megan 3" catless DP & 3" catback...all 02 sensors are plugged in, no CELs (atm) Are you catless? Cheers, Jim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rob-2 Posted March 3, 2014 Share Posted March 3, 2014 Do you get a backfire when this happens? I'm leaning towards either bad timing or a valve issues. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick916 Posted March 3, 2014 Author Share Posted March 3, 2014 Flame = backfire? Wouldn't I get a CEL for timing issues? I have had occasional CELs for knock sensor and cylinder 2 misfire but they usually occur after a hard launch which doesn't happen often and don't come back after I clear them. I have a brand new knock sensor, wiring harness, and intercooler hose. I'm almost certain that the misfire CELs are from my toasted flywheel and throwout bearing which will be replaced tomorrow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rob-2 Posted March 3, 2014 Share Posted March 3, 2014 Flame means, typically, a valve is open during the burn OR there is so much unburnt fuel in the exhaust it burns. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LJH Posted March 4, 2014 Share Posted March 4, 2014 Most tuned cars, especially forced induction cars will spit flames with no cats...the cats act as a "flame" arrestor. I have been driving turboed Audi's for 2+ decades and in my earlier years, before the tree huggers made it difficult to run no cats, I ran a number of cars with out cats. I have a '84 Turbo Quattro Coupe with a K27 turbo and big injectors on a MC motor that was tuned in the mid '90's, it also has a 3" turbo back exhaust, no cats, and the amount of fire coming out the back is quite shocking. I will spit flames on every up shift as well as on the over-run....at night it is pretty cool seeing the surrounding area light up because of the flames but I do have to wonder what other people think when they see this. Cheers, Jim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuck686 Posted March 4, 2014 Share Posted March 4, 2014 go back to stock intake Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Berzerklo Posted March 4, 2014 Share Posted March 4, 2014 Flame = backfire? Close. The flame you are seeing is probably an afterfire (different from a backfire) which is unburnt fuel in your exhaust combusting in your exhuast. I don't think it is a timing issue because I agree that you would be getting CEL codes. The Cobb Stage II map is pretty conservative so I bet you will be running pretty rich. The extra fuel of being rich + no cat is a recipe for afterfires - especially at some load conditions that will almost certainly result in a rich condition (like when you just let off the gas after full boost). I had a stage 3 WRX with no cats and a custom tune and I would get occasional afterfires once the exhaust got hot. So if it is bugging you, the first step would be to get a custom tune which will help you run less rich (either at a Subaru shop or an e-tune from one of the vendors). This will not solve the problem completely though. If you don't want to ever have afterfires you would need to get a DP with a cat. Just remember to make any changes to your set up (DP or ditching the intake) BEFORE you get a tune. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PtPixel Posted March 5, 2014 Share Posted March 5, 2014 ^yup It's normal with no cat. Even on a good tune you'll get flames sometimes. If you're constantly getting large flames then you're running too rich (which having an aftermarket intake doesn't help with). Either custom tune or go back to stock intake. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick916 Posted March 5, 2014 Author Share Posted March 5, 2014 ^ thanks for the info! I guess I don't mind it if it's not doing damage. I had heard that you can melt/warp valves when running too rich... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PtPixel Posted March 5, 2014 Share Posted March 5, 2014 Wouldn't be a bad idea too have a look at your AFR learnings via your AP and be sure that you're not too rich Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rob-2 Posted March 6, 2014 Share Posted March 6, 2014 ^ thanks for the info! I guess I don't mind it if it's not doing damage. I had heard that you can melt/warp valves when running too rich... Typically adding extra fuel cools things down. Lean = heat. Running so much fuel that you 'wash' the walls can ruin rings. I'm running catless at 16.5 psi, more then your cobb tune and I don't get flames. I suspect something is off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PtPixel Posted March 6, 2014 Share Posted March 6, 2014 ^aftermarket intake Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rob-2 Posted March 6, 2014 Share Posted March 6, 2014 ^aftermarket intake yeah maybe. But if not the cobb intake he should be running lean, unless something else. I agree with you checking his AFRs is the place to start. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick916 Posted March 6, 2014 Author Share Posted March 6, 2014 this is probably stupid question but... Am I looking at A/F correction 1? 2? learning?...theres a few of them. Then it says "actual" below some of them but that changes depending on rpm. Am I checking on under full load, 3rd gear WOT? yeah maybe. But if not the cobb intake he should be running lean, unless something else. I agree with you checking his AFRs is the place to start. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PtPixel Posted March 6, 2014 Share Posted March 6, 2014 Just learning. You only need to log at idle - they don't change with rpm or anything, it's just the ECU learning to adjust the fuel trims at certain loads. log A, B, C and D (each letter represents a range of engine loads). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tuning Alliance Posted March 7, 2014 Share Posted March 7, 2014 Will need a wideband to see actual afrs in boost. Do a boost leak test, a small leak could cause it. Sent from my QMV7A using Tapatalk Contact us for all your tuning and performance parts needs! Etuning the legacy community since 2008! Follow us on FACEBOOK | INSTAGRAM [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick916 Posted March 7, 2014 Author Share Posted March 7, 2014 Will need a wideband to see actual afrs in boost. Do a boost leak test, a small leak could cause it. Sent from my QMV7A using Tapatalk boost leak test using AP? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tuning Alliance Posted March 7, 2014 Share Posted March 7, 2014 boost leak test using AP? Here is some info on how to boost leak test and other info. http://legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php/checking-general-health-your-engine-and-tune-210369.html Contact us for all your tuning and performance parts needs! Etuning the legacy community since 2008! Follow us on FACEBOOK | INSTAGRAM [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick916 Posted May 6, 2014 Author Share Posted May 6, 2014 is 11.6 rich enough for flames? Didn't shoot any flames on the dyno and tuner said AFR was "fine" http://i929.photobucket.com/albums/ad140/nickat916/Mobile%20Uploads/D3743105-9E24-4E45-B9D9-75A62A69A1CC_zpsx5svqxpo.png Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PtPixel Posted May 6, 2014 Share Posted May 6, 2014 Not a matter of being rich enough. As you let off the throttle there will always be some small amount of fuel that passing through the engine unburnt. After-fire is probably less likely to happen with direct injection engines as the lag time would be much smaller between injection and ignition - less chance for unburnt fuel to pass through. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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