Lug Nut Dilemma

[TLP_LGT]

Hello all, new to the forums here, (and Subaru's) and I'm having a dilemma.

 

When I turn right slightly, as if I were switch lanes I get a vibration in my steering wheel that feels as though I'm driving on rough pavement. Lets say the wheel pointing straight is 90 degrees, it only happens between 95-100 degrees and then it disappears.

 

I replaced both front axles and the drivers front wheel bearing. The wheel bearing was bad anyhow and the axles showed some play. New pads and rotors all the way around. I'm mechanically inclined.

 

Needless to say the vibration is still there and I noticed my lug nuts don't really fit right. They are 12x1.25 with a 19mm hex. But for some reason the hex fits into the lug hole on the wheel. They are stock Legacy GT wheels.

 

So I went to Advance Auto Parts and got 5 M12x1.25 with 19mm hex lug nuts (Dorman Brand) and still I have the same issue. My question is, wouldn't this cause the vibration? Also, are Subaru OE lug nuts wider then the lug nuts I can acquire locally? Or are my wheels flucked up? Attached are pictures of how the hex seats into hole.

 

http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t115/aznracin/IMG_20130824_203208_661_zpsd12e2695.jpg

 

http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t115/aznracin/IMG_20130824_203201_057_zps03e91126.jpg

[apexi]

Your lugs look like my oem lugs. I think the problem you're noticing is that the wheel might not centered on the hub. If you loosen or remove the lugs, you'll notice you can slightly rotate the wheel clockwise or counterclockwise on the hub. When i put my wheels on, I'll make sure the wheel stud is dead center in the lug hole, hold the wheel in place with my knees, and torque it down. I don't know if this could cause your vibration issue, but that's probably why the lug but looks funny.

 

*I wrote this reply from my phone, and after taking a second look it does appear that your lugs are centered, so you can disregard that

[mwiener2]

Lugnuts don't look right for wheel. Wheel may be damaged from using wrong nuts.

[MoD_Scotty]

How's your alignment? Also, have you tried different tires? Might be something that simple.

[Impulse]

Are you the original owner of the car/wheels?

I don't think it's the alignment. Going with mwiener here with the lugnuts not looking right in those holes. Can you get a picture of just the lug (no nut) going through one of the holes?

 

It may be as simple as someone using the wrong nuts (eg. Nissan) and expanding the hole, because your nuts should NOT sit inside them like that. I think some of the Nissans also use 12x1.25 thread but at 21mm instead of our 19mm.

 

Edit: Looking closer at the lug holes and seeing all that wear and scraping on the walls, it may be very likely someone used a 21mm nut (requiring a larger socket which will scrape the walls). Repeated use of larger nuts will enlarge the soft aluminum holes, especially if the nuts were steel. Notice how apexi's lug holes are not worn around walls like yours.

[Max Capacity]

There is something wrong with the hole in that wheel.

 

Try a different wheel on the right front.

 

You can get a used OEM wheel from the for sale forum if you need..

[apexi]

Here's some more random pictures from my car

[TLP_LGT]

Lugnuts don't look right for wheel. Wheel may be damaged from using wrong nuts.

 

I believe that is what happened. Sigh......

 

How's your alignment? Also, have you tried different tires? Might be something that simple.

 

The alignment is fine and I don't want to change tires yet since they have about 80% tread left.

 

Are you the original owner of the car/wheels?

I don't think it's the alignment. Going with mwiener here with the lugnuts not looking right in those holes. Can you get a picture of just the lug (no nut) going through one of the holes?

 

It may be as simple as someone using the wrong nuts (eg. Nissan) and expanding the hole, because your nuts should NOT sit inside them like that. I think some of the Nissans also use 12x1.25 thread but at 21mm instead of our 19mm.

 

Edit: Looking closer at the lug holes and seeing all that wear and scraping on the walls, it may be very likely someone used a 21mm nut (requiring a larger socket which will scrape the walls). Repeated use of larger nuts will enlarge the soft aluminum holes, especially if the nuts were steel. Notice how apexi's lug holes are not worn around walls like yours.

 

I'm not the original owner of the car/wheels. I don't have a picture but the holes on the wheels do look as though they have been enlarged due to the use of wrong lug nuts of some sort.

 

There is something wrong with the hole in that wheel.

 

Try a different wheel on the right front.

 

You can get a used OEM wheel from the for sale forum if you need..

 

What sucks is they all look like that. I think i might have to get a whole new set of wheels. Which is a bummer because Legacy GT wheels look really nice!

 

Here's some more random pictures from my car

 

Yeah that's how I'd imagine one would look like. Are OEM Subaru lug nuts 19mm or 21mm hex?

 

 

Thanks a lot for all the responses guys. I'm going to see if I can get a 21mm M12x1.25 lug nut and see if it seats better.

[mwiener2]

Second set of pictures aren't as scary as the first set.

[Max Capacity]

OEM lugs need a 19mm socket to remove them.

[JmP6889928]

Are the wheels a matched set? The initial photo show the center cap with "Subaru" on them but the follow up photos show the Subaru logo on the center cap. Are you sure they are all the same wheels?

[apexi]

The other photos are of my car. I just posted them as a reference for him to see if his lug holes looked the same as mine. Also if you try 21mm TLP, I would just ensure they're still acorn style lugs with the 60 degree taper. I wonder if a previous owner tried a ball seat lug which messed the wheels up?

[JmP6889928]

The other photos are of my car. I just posted them as a reference for him to see if his lug holes looked the same as mine. Also if you try 21mm TLP, I would just ensure they're still acorn style lugs with the 60 degree taper. I wonder if a previous owner tried a ball seat lug which messed the wheels up?

 

Ahhhh....I see said the blind man to his deaf wife.....

[TLP_LGT]

Are the wheels a matched set? The initial photo show the center cap with "Subaru" on them but the follow up photos show the Subaru logo on the center cap. Are you sure they are all the same wheels?

 

they are all matching wheels

 

The other photos are of my car. I just posted them as a reference for him to see if his lug holes looked the same as mine. Also if you try 21mm TLP, I would just ensure they're still acorn style lugs with the 60 degree taper. I wonder if a previous owner tried a ball seat lug which messed the wheels up?

 

yeah i ordered a set of gorilla M12x1.25 acorn with 60 degree taper. I've also concluded that he prob used a ball seat and screwed wheels up. hopefully i don't need new wheels

[Max Capacity]

I'm sure a wheel shop could repair those wheels if you need. I happen to have a shop close to work so it would be easy for me.

 

Look on line for "wheel repair shops" in your area.

 

http://www.google.com/#fp=66efd7cba8f7ac8d&q=wheel+repair+shops+in+NC

[TLP_LGT]

I'm sure a wheel shop could repair those wheels if you need. I happen to have a shop close to work so it would be easy for me.

 

Look on line for "wheel repair shops" in your area.

 

http://www.google.com/#fp=66efd7cba8f7ac8d&q=wheel+repair+shops+in+NC

 

good idea. if the lug nuts dont fix the problem ill send the wheels off for repair if the cost less than buying a new set ha.

[Max Capacity]

If there's no wheel shop close, any decent machine shop should be able to fix them too.

[TLP_LGT]

Well the lug nuts are on. Fixed some straight line vibration but the turning vibration is still there. Looks like its back to square one

[JmP6889928]

I would bet that it will cost you less to find another set of wheels (whether it be OE LGT wheels or aftermarket) rather than fixing what you have. There are tons of wheels for sale at a decent price and a lot of OE wheels for the various years on the private sale threads.

 

Good luck with it.

[apexi]

I've done a little bit of research on this, and I really don't think it's the wheels or lug nuts. From what I've read, it sound like your tie rods could be to blame. I know nothing about tie rods, but I would look into yours before you try to buy new wheels or fix your current wheels.

[Impulse]

I've done a little bit of research on this, and I really don't think it's the wheels or lug nuts. From what I've read, it sound like your tie rods could be to blame. I know nothing about tie rods, but I would look into yours before you try to buy new wheels or fix your current wheels.

 

Well, now that we've replaced the cheapest part, the lug nuts (and you did star-pattern tighten it, right?), it would seem like the tie rod, ball joint, axle CV should be the next to look at.

 

Next time you have your car/wheel up in the air grab the wheel at 9 and 3 and give it a firm wiggle. Do the same grabbing the wheel at 12 and 6. If there's too much play at 9 and 3, it's probably tie rods. If too much play at 12 and 6, it could be wheel bearings or your ball joints.

 

Also take a look at the tie rod and ball joint boots, try shifting/twisting the tie rod around with your hands to make sure it's firm.

[sodium303]

How are your hubs? Are the tires choppy?

[TLP_LGT]

Well, now that we've replaced the cheapest part, the lug nuts (and you did star-pattern tighten it, right?), it would seem like the tie rod, ball joint, axle CV should be the next to look at.

 

Next time you have your car/wheel up in the air grab the wheel at 9 and 3 and give it a firm wiggle. Do the same grabbing the wheel at 12 and 6. If there's too much play at 9 and 3, it's probably tie rods. If too much play at 12 and 6, it could be wheel bearings or your ball joints.

 

Also take a look at the tie rod and ball joint boots, try shifting/twisting the tie rod around with your hands to make sure it's firm.

 

Tightened star pattern and torqued down with my Snap-On electronic torque wrench. I am mechanically inclined.

 

I've replaced both front axles, drivers wheel bearing/hub was bad so I replaced with a Timken one.

 

I have a lift in my garage and have gone through all steering components and bushings. I will do it again to see if I missed something. I'm thinking tie rod or control arm bushings.

 

How are your hubs? Are the tires choppy?

 

Replaced hubs. I'm going to rotate tires and see.

[VermontGT]

How's your alignment? Also, have you tried different tires? Might be something that simple.

 

^^ what he said.

 

Have you actually had the car up on an alignment rack to verify that nothing needs to be adjusted?

 

If it were something with the tire or rim, it seems like it would present consistently and not only when you turn the wheel slightly.

[TLP_LGT]

^^ what he said.

 

Have you actually had the car up on an alignment rack to verify that nothing needs to be adjusted?

 

If it were something with the tire or rim, it seems like it would present consistently and not only when you turn the wheel slightly.

 

Exactly where I am going. At 100k the shocks are blown since the guy lowered the suspension on Cobb Tuning Springs (which will be for sale soon). I have a set of KYB GR-2 that I will mate back to stock springs and followed by an alignment. While at it, I will go through suspension components again (eg. tie rods, ball joints, etc.).