The Grouch Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 Okay! So! The other day I created a thread about my alignment being off. I ended up adjusting the height on my coilovers anyways so decided to bring it in for an alignment. Now, first of all, I'm skeptical, period, to bring it into any Wheel Works but there was one by my work so I said what the hell, drop it off before work, pick it up afterwards. I get the car back....the dude said he had to mess with the camber/toe, which I thought was odd because past alignments left it alone. First weird thing is, the car now pulls slightly to the left, instead of the right when I first brought car in. It wasn't until I took the offramp to get off the freeway, I heard my tires start squealing. I drive rather aggressive but I almost never hear my tires squeal unless I'm cornering WAY WAY HARD. I investigate this issue and see that they have messed with the driver side camber on the coilovers, consistent with how much farther out to the fender the driver side front tire is compared to passenger side. What the F#$%? 1) I'm surprised they even messed with the camber/toe... 2) how does it even make any common sense to have the right side camber different than the left side??? My car handles all weird now. First thing in the morning I plan to bring the car back and have them fix it, but I'm afraid to even ask them to do it proper. I am no alignment expert at all, is there something more specific I could say rather than "get it to factory settings" or ""fix it you noob." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Grouch Posted July 7, 2011 Author Share Posted July 7, 2011 Actually the "fix it you noob" ain't looking like a bad idea lol, but what should I say after?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lookatmyrust Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 ask him why the opne side is set up different then the other. this aint a track car. even then most people keep it balanced. except nascar! left turn. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I Donated broknindarkagain Posted July 7, 2011 I Donated Share Posted July 7, 2011 I'll start off by saying I've been doing alignments for a long time. I've always aligned my Legacy and I sit on coilovers. Camber per side should match. Any difference will cause a pull (usually you have a .5 allowance between the two sides, but its better to have them perfectly matching). The difference between the two sides is called "camber split". Tell them you want a camber split of no more then .1 or .2 Your toe is ALWAYS adjusted when you get an alignment. Here are some good alignment settings you can ask the tech to use Front Toe - 0 Front Camber - negative 2 Rear Toe - 0 Rear Camber - negative 1.5 If your fenders are rolled, you can afford to use a little bit more negative camber all the way around. I run negative 3 camber on all 4 wheels on my Legacy. I would run as much negative camber you can afford to run at least in the front. It will help you grip better in the corners and give you a more spirited drive. Subaru factory alignment settings suck. Run more negative camber then stock. Any time you adjust your ride height, you will need an alignment. Your ride height changes also change your camber angles....so unless you're ready to pay for an alignment, dont adjust your ride height. -broknindarkagain My Current Project - Click Here COME AND TAKE IT "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Grouch Posted July 8, 2011 Author Share Posted July 8, 2011 Ok brokindarkagain, good advice, thanks. I'm running coilover set up also and I left it the way it was on the camber plate, car handled great. I dropped car off today to call the guy a noob and in the afternoon I get it back, I can see with the naked eye the camber difference is still not corrected. Yesterday afternoon they adjusted one of my camber plates, today they adjusted both of them when I specifically asked them to return it to the way it was, and now my car handles like shit when I corner to the right. I pulled the guy out and actually showed him my wheels, how one is tilted inward, the other is straight up and down, comparing space of tire to fender. They don't seem to get it. I paid for it and it's under warranty for them to fix their mistake but I am hesitant to bring it back to them, period. There's a good chance things might get worse before they get better. So brokindarkagain, if I present the front and rear toe and camber numbers you just told me, that's pretty specific and they wouldn't have much room to eff it up again right? Along with the camber split difference, toe and camber numbers you just presented, is there any other info I would need? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I Donated broknindarkagain Posted July 8, 2011 I Donated Share Posted July 8, 2011 To clarify, the numbers I gave you above are not a split. Its negative 2 camber on each front wheel, negative 1.5 on each rear wheel. You will always get the best results and the most specific alignment if you hand them specific numbers. OEM specs for alignment are very wide...not only on Subarus but every other car on the road. I can align a car to be "in spec" but it will still drive like shit....simply because you can be all the way negative on one wheel, while being all the way positive of the specs on the other wheel...causing a split of .8 or more. The alignment specs I gave you are not factory specs. Toe should always be 0 (or as close as you can get it) on all 4 wheels. Like I said above, the negative camber will help your car in the corners a little bit. When I run more negative camber then my car calls for, I can weave in and out of the corners MUCH faster with MUCH more grip. With -2 camber, you won't even notice any abnormal tire wear either. I have 10k+ miles on my tires using -3 camber and show no abnormal wear. Take the car back to them. Stand there and watch the guy align it. Make sure he follows these important steps 1 - rolling compensation The tech will roll the car backwards, then forwards again back into position 2 - caster sweep this is VERY important. basically after rolling comp, he should turn the wheels to both the left and right to measure caster and SAI 3 - lock the steering wheel If the tech is using a Hunter machine and wants to use "Wintoe", ask him to lock the steering wheel instead. The Wintoe program is garbage and always give poor (at best) results Tell them you don't want your car to be pulled off the rack until they are able to produce the specifications that you gave them. If they can't align your car to the way you want it, then you need to get your money back. Are you a big person? I mean no offense by this at all.....but I've had cars I aligned that never drove straight until I aligned them with the owner sitting in the drivers seat. Bigger people weigh down the car more....and that changes the Camber angles. If you're a big person, I would ask to sit in the drivers seat while they align it. -broknindarkagain My Current Project - Click Here COME AND TAKE IT "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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