djkxgo0k Posted March 4, 2009 Author Share Posted March 4, 2009 i appreciate all the info. i've definitely learned my lesson here. after speaking with the owner, he did mention that he was sorry for not double checking if the price was alright. he said he couldn't give me any money back, but agreed to do three fully synthetic oil changes for free. although that's only like $120 to me bc i do my own oil changes, i guess it could've been worse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JAvery529 Posted March 4, 2009 Share Posted March 4, 2009 i appreciate all the info. i've definitely learned my lesson here. after speaking with the owner, he did mention that he was sorry for not double checking if the price was alright. he said he couldn't give me any money back, but agreed to do three fully synthetic oil changes for free. although that's only like $120 to me bc i do my own oil changes, i guess it could've been worse. I would not accept that at all. I'm assuming you paid with credit/debit, dispute the charge. If he admitted to over charging you, get it in writing and then dispute the charge he made. It's an easy way to get some of the money back. Hell, even without getting it in writing you can still dispute it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted March 4, 2009 Share Posted March 4, 2009 And don't ever go back there and make sure to tell about your experience to others. Post the shop name here, print out the thread and take it to the shop. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slomoe2008 Posted March 4, 2009 Share Posted March 4, 2009 Sorry to disapoint, I have access to a database for published times. Each strut on all 4 corners pays 2.0/hr ea.. Alignments are usually 1/hr. So I think 9.0 hrs is spot on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted March 4, 2009 Share Posted March 4, 2009 That means the "book" times are totally off wrt to this car. Still one ass shop that charged him at least twice what would be reasonable for the time it took. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MiniStiGuy Posted March 4, 2009 Share Posted March 4, 2009 Damn if thats the book times for Michigan you all work SLOW as hell. OEM HID's Rx330 Retro Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikeislord Posted March 4, 2009 Share Posted March 4, 2009 i appreciate all the info. i've definitely learned my lesson here. after speaking with the owner, he did mention that he was sorry for not double checking if the price was alright. he said he couldn't give me any money back, but agreed to do three fully synthetic oil changes for free. although that's only like $120 to me bc i do my own oil changes, i guess it could've been worse. You should ask the owner point blank if he thinks overcharging you for this one service is more valuable to him than having him keep your business and your family's business for the next 10 years. If he says he still can't do anything, thank him for his time and let him know that you will be letting your friends know to never do business with him and will be posting your experience on several forums. /End Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AKLGT Posted March 4, 2009 Share Posted March 4, 2009 I would not accept that at all. I'm assuming you paid with credit/debit, dispute the charge. If he admitted to over charging you, get it in writing and then dispute the charge he made. It's an easy way to get some of the money back. Hell, even without getting it in writing you can still dispute it. though this may cause issues and hold up his funds, the merchant will win and he is still out his money. He signed off on the receipt saying he agreed to pay the above. anything other than that would be a civil court issue, not a visa/mastercard issue. He authorized the transaction, end of story. If I get work done at ANY shop, I always ask for the quote and cost. It's no different from a body shop, I would think they have to be within the 10% of the original quote. $600 is ridiculous, but as others said, if they are doing it by the book hours like most shops do, that's what you expect. We're doing a spring install at our house next Saturday evening on an 08 WRX in exchange for beer and pizza. Spring installs are super easy, even I can do them myself. Next time, do some research, there are several how to and DIY. see if anyone in the local area wants to do an install meet to help out. Wiggle wiggle wiggle wiggle wiggle yeah!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MiniStiGuy Posted March 4, 2009 Share Posted March 4, 2009 oh shut up AK... How come I never get invited over???? :lol: OEM HID's Rx330 Retro Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bolksey85 Posted March 5, 2009 Share Posted March 5, 2009 Just as an FYI, Fred Beans quotes right around $475 for a spring install but that also includes alignment. That's what? 4 hours or so? Maybe 3 1/2. 2 1/2 for install than 1-1/2 for full 4 wheel alignment. It does take a decent amount of time to set toe, camber, caster, and road test. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paisan Posted March 5, 2009 Share Posted March 5, 2009 Sorry to disapoint, I have access to a database for published times. Each strut on all 4 corners pays 2.0/hr ea.. Alignments are usually 1/hr. So I think 9.0 hrs is spot on. That's what the book shows at a friend's shop here in NJ as well. Not that he charges that but that is what the book says and shops are well within their quote-un-quote rights to charge whatever the books says, especially if you didn't get a written or even oral estimate I would think. Not trying to defend a bad shop, but demanding $ back isn't going to work, the best way to "hurt" them is not to go back and let others know not to go there. -mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scruit Posted March 19, 2009 Share Posted March 19, 2009 Charging by book time can be a major ripoff. My old Nissan Maxima had a book time for replacing the Knock Sensor of around 9-10 hours, because the approved method is to remove the intake manifold and injectors to get to the valley bewteen the heads of the V6. However, if you don't mind getting a little cut up then you can use the "Bloody Stump Method" that takes about 10 minutes which involved reaching in between the manifold and valley. If you have big burly man hands then you can get bloodied knuckles, but if you have small hands then you can do it fine. I was quoted several hundred dollars for the work from a Nissan dealer, but was able to do the work myself in about 15 minutes. I wonder how many shops charge the 10 hours, but actually do the work in 10 minutes? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paisan Posted March 20, 2009 Share Posted March 20, 2009 Charging by book time can be a major ripoff. My old Nissan Maxima had a book time for replacing the Knock Sensor of around 9-10 hours, because the approved method is to remove the intake manifold and injectors to get to the valley bewteen the heads of the V6. However, if you don't mind getting a little cut up then you can use the "Bloody Stump Method" that takes about 10 minutes which involved reaching in between the manifold and valley. If you have big burly man hands then you can get bloodied knuckles, but if you have small hands then you can do it fine. I was quoted several hundred dollars for the work from a Nissan dealer, but was able to do the work myself in about 15 minutes. I wonder how many shops charge the 10 hours, but actually do the work in 10 minutes? The problem is that the car that takes say 2 days to do due to some unforseen issues, the shop would then get screwed on that job. So the book basically averages it out over all of the similar jobs to take into account for the times it takes longer and the other times it is shorter. I think from my understanding that is the point of "book rates". -mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BAC5.2 Posted March 20, 2009 Share Posted March 20, 2009 It's not a rip-off, it's a rape. Takes 2-2:30 hours when you take your sweet time. Skilled mechanic can do it in 1-1:30 h. And you need to pay for their skill. Mechanics don't work for free. They charge by the book, and the reason they can afford to live is that they can do work faster than the book says. If a job normally charges, according to the manufacturer, 4 hours and a tech can do it in 1, then that means they can put dinner on the table that week. That doesn't mean you get charged for 1. You pay for the job, no matter how long it takes the tech. It doesn't matter if your cousin can do springs in an hour. A tech is paid what the book says to pay. That means the shop needs to get paid to cover the tech's money. They won't charge you for 2 hours of labor when they have to pay the tech 4 hours of labor. For the old cars, each corner paid 1 hour and an alignment was ~1 hour. At normal shop rates in MD ($90/hr for a professional race shop), that's $450. And you had other work done. Rotors don't turn themselves (though, honestly, the cost to turn a stock rotor vs. buying a new rotor is marginal. And the life decrease after turning makes the cost benefit even less). So you easily had $540 of work done (at $90/hr). I'd call 6 hours a reasonable amount of time to pay a reputable shop to do the things you are asking them to do. If the hourly rate is $75, then $450 is a reasonable amount to expect to pay a shop to do the work. If you feel like you were overcharged, I suggest you do it yourself. I'm also confused why you didn't just have them call you with an estimate. But whatever. [URL="http://legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php/proper-flip-key-interesti-159894.html"]Flip Key Development Thread[/URL] "Genius may have its limitations, but stupidity is not thus handicapped." - E. Hubbard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BAC5.2 Posted March 20, 2009 Share Posted March 20, 2009 The problem is that the car that takes say 2 days to do due to some unforseen issues, the shop would then get screwed on that job. So the book basically averages it out over all of the similar jobs to take into account for the times it takes longer and the other times it is shorter. I think from my understanding that is the point of "book rates". -mike Exactly. Book hours reward good technicians and punish bad ones. They are in place so that going to a dealership in one town would cost the same amount as going to any other dealership (assuming the same hourly rate). If you have a problem with the book rates? Call Subaru. The manufacturer is the one who lists the paid hourly rates to do work. btw, is this the Paisan/Mike with AZPInstalls? [URL="http://legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php/proper-flip-key-interesti-159894.html"]Flip Key Development Thread[/URL] "Genius may have its limitations, but stupidity is not thus handicapped." - E. Hubbard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2006Specb122 Posted April 7, 2009 Share Posted April 7, 2009 THREAD JACK... I am sitting in my dealer waiting room getting an alignment done... I had asked several months ago about an alignment. I have the notebook paper where they wrote down the price for me... (not official quote with subaru letterhead) they gave me a price of $59.95 which I thought was reasonable. Today I drop off the car and they hand me a paper and tell me the cost is $89.95. What is wrong with this world. What have you guys seen for cost of alignment at the dealers? $89.95 seems HIGH especially when my car seems OK... Just have a 1,000 mile trip next week and wanted everything tip top! This is NUTS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whitetiger Posted April 7, 2009 Share Posted April 7, 2009 89.95 is fine for an alignment. its 1hr of book time which is legit. the 59.95 may have been just for a front end alignment where the 89.95 would be for a 4wheel alignment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MiniStiGuy Posted April 7, 2009 Share Posted April 7, 2009 my alignments cost me $60 and that is roughly what it cost anywhere I would take my car to. OEM HID's Rx330 Retro Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lawl Posted April 7, 2009 Share Posted April 7, 2009 lifetime alignment = 1 time payment of 160. i havent paid since. car for sale. PM me! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MiniStiGuy Posted April 7, 2009 Share Posted April 7, 2009 my alignment at Firestone only cost me $60 and Firestone has Lifetime alignment OEM HID's Rx330 Retro Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pawlwawl06 Posted April 7, 2009 Share Posted April 7, 2009 thread jack x2, I got a quote: 4 Swift springs, two koni inserts(fronts) and two koni struts(rears) for $495. Good deal/bad deal? This should be the official Did I Just Get Stiffed? Thread lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MiniStiGuy Posted April 7, 2009 Share Posted April 7, 2009 good deal. OEM HID's Rx330 Retro Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paisan Posted April 7, 2009 Share Posted April 7, 2009 thread jack x2, I got a quote: 4 Swift springs, two koni inserts(fronts) and two koni struts(rears) for $495. Good deal/bad deal? This should be the official Did I Just Get Stiffed? Thread lol That's a good price, the Konis are a PITA to install with the cutting etc. Get the Group N front strut tops while you are at it. -mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paisan Posted April 7, 2009 Share Posted April 7, 2009 89.95 is fine for an alignment. its 1hr of book time which is legit. the 59.95 may have been just for a front end alignment where the 89.95 would be for a 4wheel alignment. Agreed, here in NY/NJ $89 is the std price, $100 on the high side, anything less than $80 I'd worry what kind of alignment I was getting. -mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TPLGT Posted April 7, 2009 Share Posted April 7, 2009 Unfortuantly I have had my car aligned 3x in the past 15 mos....$89.95 for a 4 wheel...thats from the dealer... Rehab is for quitters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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