Just had a thought!

[Jacks GT]

Does anyone else think that maybe that the reason subaru done what the done to the Impreza was because they plan on bringing the Legacy STi to the US? Just a though, and a nice one at that lol. :rolleyes:

[iyalla]

Nobody knows what the hell Subaru is doing except Subaru, and they are probably confused too:lol:

[SLegacy99]

No cause otherwise the B9 Tribeca would have led to a Forester STi.

[Carter]

I think a Legacy STi would sell better than a Forester STi.

[SLegacy99]

I think a Legacy STi would sell better than a Forester STi.

Oh absolutely. It just has to be marketed as in A4 smasher.

 

I know that SOA does studies to analyze their markets, so this is why I dont understand why there isnt a more powerful Legacy. Afterall, how many STi owners have grown up and switched to a different brand because the Spec. B just doesn't cut it. It seems so obvious to me and to the rest of you Im sure, that a 300 hp Legacy, with maybe a few more features would sell and for $35k. When my dad and I saw the debute of the '05 LGT we thought it was going to cost that much anyway.

[psi365]

With as many threads as I've gotten into about LSTi's, I have come to this mindset. If they do plan to bring a LSTi it will possibly be a 09/09.5 model. The reason is to push out a few extra of the old models. Whether or not we get a real LSTi or a tuned by STi LGT or if we get one at all who knows. We thought SEMA was going to be the big announcement for a LSTi only to have "new" car being the Wrx rally car. Honestly I've become more like the older people on this board and don't really believe we in the US are ever going to see one and I will no longer believe the rumors until I physically see it in person or hear of the actual corperate press release.

[BDII]

If we get it, it will be a package deal of add ons that can be put on any model.

[jonnyg113]

If we get it, it will be a package deal of add ons that can be put on any model.

 

Maybe, but I doubt it. I think one of the best allures of purchasing an STi is because they are limited and prestigious to own. Since it is fairly easy to beef up our cars to an STi level, I think the car would sell better if I came tuned by STi from the factory, no simple add on options.

[Jacks GT]

I think that legacy STi would be in direct competition with with the RS4or at least the S4 wouldnt it? I read the new motortrend last night about the german muscle cars and the rs4 came third outa three so i say bring on the legacy!

[jonnyg113]

I think that legacy STi would be in direct competition with with the RS4or at least the S4 wouldnt it? I read the new motortrend last night about the german muscle cars and the rs4 came third outa three so i say bring on the legacy!

 

I agree. I would even go as far as saying the current Legacy is an S4/ A4 competitor. IMO, the legacy surpasses A4 standards but falls short of the S4. And with a few mods, you are right beside the 48,000 car.

[Vimy101]

Afterall, how many STi owners have grown up and switched to a different brand because the Spec. B just doesn't cut it.

 

6?

[IwannaSportSedan]

I agree. I would even go as far as saying the current Legacy is an S4/ A4 competitor. IMO, the legacy surpasses A4 standards but falls short of the S4. And with a few mods, you are right beside the 48,000 car.

 

right beside it in a stoplight race, but not in terms of refinement and interior quality or technical features.

 

The Spec B offers far less than the new G35 in amenities, as well as less stock power, if you don't mind going to RWD for the stick, or Automatic/AWD.

 

Bluetooth, memory seats/mirrors, built in bluetooth, much more adaptable audio system, HIDs, and directional lights.

 

For the money, Subaru is not keeping up in all areas, except perhaps reliability, which it has always excelled.

 

Just as an anecdotal point... there were how many 2007 Spec B's produced??

The Des Moines dealer has one that has been sitting on the front apron for more than a year, and is marked down to about $31k. And still it sits, or at least it did two or three weeks ago. Why should a limited edition car like the Spec B sit like that?

 

Three reasons.

No Marketing.

No Options (like color, or equipment)

Price is too high. (it should be 30-31k MSRP, and GT Limited should be 25-26k$)

 

For the MSRP, the Spec B should be equipped like the WRX STI with leather an optional NAV, which is coming to market at nearly the same price, and a whole lot more press.

 

The best way is to add the features that the competition offers. Short of that, the way to get people to forget about those things, is to make the car fast as hell.

 

The G35 makes ~300hp. The TL-S is north of 250, IIRC. Spec B could be EASILY tuned the same as the STI, with or without the red aluminum intake. change the turbo and TMIC, and the tuning... and you have it. Add lower springs to the Bilsteins, and the STI's 5x114 hubs/brembos/forged BBS wheels, and the DCCD system to the 6MT (which is the same transmission anyway...) and you have a road burner of a sport sedan which people, like me, can forgive for not having every little toy.

 

Paint it with the same colors that the STI gets, including WR Blue, and sell it as a proper special edition, at the 34-35k price point. Make it more limited in numbers produced than the WRX STI. But a sport compact hatch, and a proper sport sedan on two different name plates are going to attract a few different customers... customers that Subaru needs.

 

Then relegate the Spec B to the package content that it is supposed to be, and in-fact is, in other markets, and make the GT Limited into the bargain that the GT non-limited used to be.

 

And for pete's sake stock them, and market them. People can't buy cars that they don't know about, or can't find.

 

"Stupid.... You So STUPID!!!" - Kuni, UHF. Dedicated to SOA's planning department.

[Vimy101]

Performancewise the Spec.B and G35 are very similar in acceleration with an edge to the Subie up to the 1/4.

 

Frankly, I don't want a slammed Spec. I want an all weather killer. The suspension on the Spec. is as good as anything you'll find anywhere.

 

HIDs? Meh. My wife's car has them but the Subie halogens are excellent unless, of course, you're a poser.

[Spoonwacker]

Performancewise the Spec.B and G35 are very similar in acceleration with an edge to the Subie up to the 1/4.

 

Frankly, I don't want a slammed Spec. I want an all weather killer. The suspension on the Spec. is as good as anything you'll find anywhere.

 

HIDs? Meh. My wife's car has them but the Subie halogens are excellent unless, of course, you're a poser.

 

HIDs may not be a necessity for driving, but once you're in the $35k+ market, image becomes a lot more important, and if you don't offer HIDs, you're nobody. When people see HIDs coming towards them, they're conditioned to think "ooh, that must be a nice car." With prices on HIDs dropping, they're not necessarily correct, but it still holds true. Heck, even today, you can tell you're in a high-income part of town because 50% of the cars have HIDs...

[Vimy101]

^ There is a movement afoot claiming that HIDs are inferior to good halogens because the extreme whiteness of the HIDs reduce night vision acuity. The halogen projectors on the Subie are excellent.

 

BTW, I'm not a poser. I'm a driver who favours functionality over fashion.

[psi365]

Several problems with what you said IwannaSportSedan

 

First off the base on a Legacy costs more then a Impreza so their respective STi versions shouldn't be about the same price. I started a thread awhile ago asking people that if Subie brought out a LSTi exactly the way you are describing for under $40k would they buy them. The overwhelming answer was for the price they'd just get a 335i. Then the rest would go way off on a tangent talking about a twin turbo H6 and 400hp then maybe for that price. Very few said that if you basically took the powertrain out of the WrxSTi, lowered it, brembos, dccd, HIDs, and made nav optionial said they'd buy it.

[Spoonwacker]

Vimy - I've heard of this movement, and I liked my OEM halogens, but I wanted to see what HIDs were all about, and so far I like them. I guess that makes me the poser here...

 

psi/IWSS - an LSTi like you're describing would be fine if it were priced in the mid to high $30k range. It would be a great sports sedan, and a lot of fun, but I'm not sure how successful it would be at luring potential S4/M3 buyers. Let's face it, a 2.5 liter 4 cylinder, especially with the VF39, isn't as much fun below 3000 rpms as a big V8, and this translates into less tractability around town, which is where a large percentage of the buyers of these cars will drive them. Honestly, half the people I've seen driving S4s and M3s in the past month have been middle-aged women (literally) picking up groceries. Offer them a turbocharged six, though, perhaps with some double-clutch electronic manual, and they might buy a Subie priced around $40-45k.

 

So, I propose we make the Legacy lineup even more confusing for buyers :

Entry-level 2.5i priced at whatever it is - around $20-25k?

2.5GT for $25-28k

Spec B w/customer's choice of 3.0R motor or STi powerplant for $30-35k (the STi being the top part of that range)

Uber-STi w/3.0T (or TT) and all the bells & whistles for $40-45k

 

Oh, I wish...

[IwannaSportSedan]

I won't disagree with your wish for a turbo flat 6 in the legacy. I hadn't really included the 3.0R, or potential of 3.0R Spec B, or a naturally aspirated 3.6 in the Legacy. I consider the 3.0R the near-luxury trim, not the sporting trim levels of the Legacy... A turbo H6 would be on the sport side.

 

But Subaru could put the STI-tuned turbo 4 in the Legacy tomorrow. It is just a decision to make. They should make that decision. The turbo 6, however is not on the market, and probably not emissions certified if it is even under development... That would take some planning, and time.

 

Here's a novel approach: All STIs. all the same price. $34,995, you choose the body style, and STI color palette. Black, silver, white, bright red, or WR-Blue. STI could be a more definitive and purposeful sub-model than Mazdaspeed.

WRX STI rally car homologation (full production for demand, lightest weight)

Legacy STI sport sedan (limited production)

Outback XT STI performance-utility-wagon (limited production)

Forester STI compact SUV. (limited production)

 

The Spec B should not cost as much as it does. I cited an example of one that hasn't moved in more than a year, and it is one of the only Legacy Turbos on the whole Subaru lot. It should be priced where the GT Limited currently is. With more power and more performance, and color choice, perhaps it would not languish.

 

The differences between the Spec B and STI are small, and could be converted easily, for meager amounts of money, in terms of manufacturing.

VF39 in place of the current turbo. Slightly re-arranged intercooler. Done and Done.

Slightly thicker roll bars and lower springs with the Spec B bilsteins and aluminum arms. Done.

Hub flanges made for 5x114 lug spacing, STI/Brembo discs and calipers. Wheel differences are easy.

And DCCD electronic controls for the center differential, with a switch on the center console. Done.

 

The new Impreza is based on the Legacy chassis, with a modified tribeca rear suspension. How is it so much cheaper than the Legacy, except for perhaps the dashboard covering material?

The engines are the same, the driveline is the same, the dimensions of the chassis are about the same, and the interior volume is the same, so the amount of material to create the car is probably about the same, and the volume of the Legacy combined with the Outback amortizes that chassis faster.

 

They are priced the same, the WRX somewhat close to the GT, and the STI nearly to the dollar the same as the Spec B, the big difference being that the Spec B has "$2k worth of navigation" standard, and the STI gets that added on top. Make the Legacy STI the same. Give it Brembo brakes and DCCD, and an EASY 50hp bump, and then make the NAV optional on top of that.

 

And also, a Legacy STI would not be for S4 and M3 buyers. They aren't the same cars, and they are far from the same price and prestige. The Legacy STI is for the Subaru buyer who doesn't want a boy racer WRX STI, but a proper-looking sport sedan with STI cojones. It should take on the G35 Sport 6MT (which doesn't have AWD, but is pushing 300hp), and beat the living TAR out of the TL-type S, and the A4 turbo quattro Sport Line, and be more reliable while doing it.

 

And as for Vimy's HID opinion... That is fine. Stick with halogens. they aren't going anywhere, and IF SOA were to reverse their course and add them to the Legacy, there will always be lower-trim Legacys with cheaper Halogen housings, that can be re-fit to an upper-trim car with HIDS. There are people who still think that scratchy analog records sound better than high bit-rate uncompressed digital audio. It is more of a personal and emotional reaction than one based in facts and measures. That is fine, but the facts remain.

 

It is a lot harder to properly fit HIDS to a car that doesn't have the option. And it isn't a poser feature. More lumens is more lumens. HIDS have a demonstrable advantage over halogens of similar configuration, or any configuration. HIDS ARE BRIGHTER, and it is obvious to anyone who can count lumen ratings. And if the lights are certified for the road, then they are efficient enough to put the lumens where they are supposed to be, which does not produce glare or undue problems to anyone else.

 

Complainers just need something to complain about, or else there is a legitimate optometric problem that should be addressed before that person drives at night in the first place. I have seen oncoming HIDS, and I have paced cars with HIDs on the highway. My Legacy's good halogens are not even a close match for superior light output of HIDs, and there was no problem with clarity, everything was just brighter.

 

I have heard that argument about bluer light producing less color clarity. But then no one should drive during the day. A sunny day produces a bright white-point at about 6500 kelvins, most OEM HID setups are somewhere between 5000k and 6500k. Only aftermarket fashion statement lights get bluer than that, but that is a different argument than OEM HIDs.

 

Besides that, LOW beams are used for HIDS, since HIGH beams are used infrequently and intermittently, which arc-lamps aren't good for. Low beams are sharply cut off, and have limited forward range. anything close enough for a low beam only to illuminate, is close enough to identify by shape, size and color in 6500k light, especially as much of it as HIDS put out.

 

Beyond that range, high beams have a lower 4500-5500k color temperature that might slightly help with color clarity at more than 125 yards, or so. Incandescent halogen high beams are better for intermittent use, but aren't as robust, and use far more energy to throw that more yellow light that far.

 

Personally, I think HIR is the the way to go, there, which recycles some of the infrared heat energy to more visible light energy, without an increased current draw. Extra lumens for the cost of manufacturing the IR-reflective bulb coating. Recycling is good, is it not? HIDS still put out more lumens than even HIR, though.

 

And if you really really need color clarity closer than high-beam range, then get some selective-yellow (~3000k) foglights, and use them.

 

Me, personally, I think I'll take the increased lumen output across the low-beam pattern that HID provides. Plus the lower amperage draw, and robust nature of a bulb without a filament to break, are both gravy.

 

And BTW, when I say that the spec B needs lower springs, it is because it is taller than a stock GT... It should be the same, if not 10mm or so lower than the stock GT. If you want to bust snow-drifts, buy an outback XT. That is what they are for, comparatively. A Legacy is not a snow plow.

[Vimy101]

The Spec B should not cost as much as it does. I cited an example of one that hasn't moved in more than a year, and it is one of the only Legacy Turbos on the whole Subaru lot. It should be priced where the GT Limited currently is. With more power and more performance, and color choice, perhaps it would not languish.

 

The Spec.B is priced to compete with the competition not LGTs.

 

The differences between the Spec B and STI are small, and could be converted easily, for meager amounts of money, in terms of manufacturing.

 

Except that they're different ideas.

 

One's a GT and the other is a rally car.

 

And as for Vimy's HID opinion... That is fine. Stick with halogens. they aren't going anywhere, and IF SOA were to reverse their course and add them to the Legacy, there will always be lower-trim Legacys with cheaper Halogen housings, that can be re-fit to an upper-trim car with HIDS.

 

Cheaper and arguably work better.

 

There are people who still think that scratchy analog records sound better than high bit-rate uncompressed digital audio. It is more of a personal and emotional reaction than one based in facts and measures. That is fine, but the facts remain.

 

Your ears are analogue and there are those that think high bit-rate uncompressed (which next to nobody has even heard) is better than hearing a symphony concert in person.

 

And BTW, when I say that the spec B needs lower springs, it is because it is taller than a stock GT... It should be the same, if not 10mm or so lower than the stock GT. If you want to bust snow-drifts, buy an outback XT. That is what they

are for, comparatively. A Legacy is not a snow plow.

 

The Spec.B doesn't need lower springs.

 

It's a GT not some poser toy.

[Vimy101]

Vimy - I've heard of this movement, and I liked my OEM halogens, but I wanted to see what HIDs were all about, and so far I like them. I guess that makes me the poser here...

 

The Subie halogen projector system is the equal of my wife's Infinti's. They're not as bright but they offer surprizingly good long range definition. Better than the Infinitis, IMHO.

 

My wife does a curious thing with her I35. She has the dashboard lights set to day time level at night. She never used to do that before. She says she can't see the displays clearly even when set at the brightest night setting.

 

Her headlights do cast a very bright light but they don't seem to increase visiblility distance appreciably at least to my eye.

[IwannaSportSedan]

The Spec.B is priced to compete with the competition not LGTs.

 

But if the 07 Spec B I saw is the only turbo Legacy on the subaru lot, and won't sell for over a year, EVEN with the price reduced to very near fully loaded GT Limited price... that says something.

 

Except that they're different ideas. One's a GT and the other is a rally car.

 

And that is why I don't suggest axing one to offer the other. BOTH have a place, but SOA won't ante-up on the Legacy, and the competition keeps getting better. The STI's hardware, specifically more power, better brakes, and a driver-controlled differential to allow selectable rear-drive bias, would make the Legacy an even better sport sedan than it already is, and compete better with other cars on the market at the $35k price point, when the Legacy line (3.0R and Spec B) is low on amenities compared to other $35k cars.

 

Halogens:

Cheaper and arguably work better.

 

Didn't I say that people *can* keep their halogens, and that I would just like the OPTION for factory HIDS? However, Do you see WRX STI owners binning their HIDs to put WRX halogens on? not so much, because they work better, especially the 06+ projectors. Name any car, like the G35 Coupe, or BMWs, or Porsches, which offers Halogens and HIDS in the same bodywork, and almost all of the headlight and housing swaps go from Halogen -> HID, not the other way around. People are buying them on the option list, and others are adding them after the original sale to cars that don't have it.

 

Your ears are analogue and there are those that think high bit-rate uncompressed (which next to nobody has even heard) is better than hearing a symphony concert in person.

 

Analogue??? How about analog. And if you are listening to the music, the music is being produced in analog. That is what SPEAKERS DO!!! The source recording can be digital or analog, and you still hear them as reproduced sound waves, not analog electric current variation, or digital bit streams.

 

Digital signals are easier to reproduce cleanly, time after time, than any vinyl analog, or magnetic tape. It is also more compact to store much broader information digitally, and even compress it efficiently. iPods (or your MP3 player of choice) can't play records for a reason. Records are very big, and not very data dense. Yet MP3 players smaller than a deck of cards can hold thousands of times the amount of information, and reproduce it repeatedly for the life of the device, with consideration for power. The quality is only dependent on the quality of the digital signal source, and it's compression algorithm, or lack of compression.

 

And depending on your seats at a live concert, any good recording, analog or digital, might be better than bad seats... But Live performance is more than just listening to the music.

 

The Spec.B doesn't need lower springs. It's a GT not some poser toy.

 

Tell that to the people who have lower springs, and it has helped their legacy. Like ME. Mine is lower than most, and maybe even a bit too low for some. I bought it that way, and I might have gone a little differently had I chosen the aftermarket parts. As the car racks up mileage, I am seriously considering Bilsteins and Ion progressive rate springs... which is lower than stock, but not as low as GT struts and the whiteline springs I currently have. The car still handles better than stock with the whitelines.

 

Stock ride height on the GT is plenty tall, and the Spec B is even taller. Most OE sport packages (which is what the Spec B is, considering the equipment differences, not marketing speak) on other cars LOWER their respective chassis, not raise it. The Legacy GT is just as much a Grand Touring car as a Spec B.

 

Like I said, not crazy low, but why on earth does a GT car need to be so high that you can see daylight from the other side, under the car, and see the suspension struts in the wheel wells above the tops of the front tires? Most GTs are pretty low to the ground, compared to other less sporty cars. Look at just about any BMW sport package, AMG, Infiniti, Audi, Acura, etc... and if the ride height is at all different than the non-sport package, it is lower, not higher. The spec B is slightly higher than the Legacy GT, stock for stock.

 

Do you like increased aerodynamic drag, and big wheel well gaps for some reason? Are you sure you wouldn't have liked an Outback better?

 

I certainly hope you aren't calling lowered Legacy GTs, or my lowered Legacy GT specifically, a poser toy. It is better looking than a stock spec B, It'll hand that stock Spec B it's hat.

[Vimy101]

But if the 07 Spec B I saw is the only turbo Legacy on the subaru lot, and won't sell for over a year, EVEN with the price reduced to very near fully loaded GT Limited price... that says something.

 

Lets face it, LGTs aren't exactly flying off the lots either. The dealer I from whom I bought my Spec. said an interesting thing. "A lot of people take it for a test drive but they can't afford it." To me that means that folks are coming into a dealership looking in many cases to upgrade to an LGT (or even a Rex). The Spec.B is just simply out of their league. And kudos to SOA's incredible marketing campaign where even LGTs are barely if ever shown.

 

 

 

And that is why I don't suggest axing one to offer the other. BOTH have a place, but SOA won't ante-up on the Legacy, and the competition keeps getting better. The STI's hardware, specifically more power, better brakes, and a driver-controlled differential to allow selectable rear-drive bias, would make the Legacy an even better sport sedan than it already is, and compete better with other cars on the market at the $35k price point, when the Legacy line (3.0R and Spec B) is low on amenities compared to other $35k cars.

 

First you have to drive a Spec.B. It is really on par with cars (if not better) costing $10k more from a performance and handling perspective. Second, the LGT platform is getting a little long in the tooth and with less than stellar sales I don't see SOA persuing an STi LGT.

 

Didn't I say that people *can* keep their halogens, and that I would just like the OPTION for factory HIDS? However, Do you see WRX STI owners binning their HIDs to put WRX halogens on? not so much, because they work better, especially the 06+ projectors. Name any car, like the G35 Coupe, or BMWs, or Porsches, which offers Halogens and HIDS in the same bodywork, and almost all of the headlight and housing swaps go from Halogen -> HID, not the other way around. People are buying them on the option list, and others are adding them after the original sale to cars that don't have it.

 

HIDs. Meh.

 

 

 

Analogue??? How about analog. And if you are listening to the music, the music is being produced in analog. That is what SPEAKERS DO!!! The source recording can be digital or analog, and you still hear them as reproduced sound waves, not analog electric current variation, or digital bit streams.

 

Digital signals are easier to reproduce cleanly, time after time, than any vinyl analog, or magnetic tape. It is also more compact to store much broader information digitally, and even compress it efficiently. iPods (or your MP3 player of choice) can't play records for a reason. Records are very big, and not very data dense. Yet MP3 players smaller than a deck of cards can hold thousands of times the amount of information, and reproduce it repeatedly for the life of the device, with consideration for power. The quality is only dependent on the quality of the digital signal source, and it's compression algorithm, or lack of compression.

 

And depending on your seats at a live concert, any good recording, analog or digital, might be better than bad seats... But Live performance is more than just listening to the music.

 

No one listens to uncompressed digital sound anymore. MP3 only contains 10% of the original sound data. Makes little difference to the electric/synthesized crap that most people listen to but makes a discerable difference when listening to acoutistic music.

 

 

 

Tell that to the people who have lower springs, and it has helped their legacy. Like ME. Mine is lower than most, and maybe even a bit too low for some. I bought it that way, and I might have gone a little differently had I chosen the aftermarket parts. As the car racks up mileage, I am seriously considering Bilsteins and Ion progressive rate springs... which is lower than stock, but not as low as GT struts and the whiteline springs I currently have. The car still handles better than stock with the whitelines.

 

Stock ride height on the GT is plenty tall, and the Spec B is even taller. Most OE sport packages (which is what the Spec B is, considering the equipment differences, not marketing speak) on other cars LOWER their respective chassis, not raise it. The Legacy GT is just as much a Grand Touring car as a Spec B.

 

Like I said, not crazy low, but why on earth does a GT car need to be so high that you can see daylight from the other side, under the car, and see the suspension struts in the wheel wells above the tops of the front tires? Most GTs are pretty low to the ground, compared to other less sporty cars. Look at just about any BMW sport package, AMG, Infiniti, Audi, Acura, etc... and if the ride height is at all different than the non-sport package, it is lower, not higher. The spec B is slightly higher than the Legacy GT, stock for stock.

 

Do you like increased aerodynamic drag, and big wheel well gaps for some reason? Are you sure you wouldn't have liked an Outback better?

 

I certainly hope you aren't calling lowered Legacy GTs, or my lowered Legacy GT specifically, a poser toy. It is better looking than a stock spec B, It'll hand that stock Spec B it's hat.

 

The Spec.B doesn't need to be lowered. It's a GT that comes from a rally heritage complete with inverted struts and Al control arms, etc. It should be able to handle a snow drift from time to time. After all, it's a Subaru.

[psi365]

My .02

 

In most cases the bluer the HID, the cheaper the set up. All of them will be blue when they are first turned on, but a lot of the better set ups go toward a more yellow tint when warmed up. It also depends on what gas they use in the bulb too (Lithium, Zenon, etc.). Depending on the setup some use a halogen bulb for the high beam, some use a shutter and just allow the full amount of light to go through from a HID. Either way for a car priced like a sB is, it should have HIDs at least optional if not standard for a Legacy above the Limited line.

 

From what I've read here for years people have been complaining about body roll from the LGT. The sB should have larger sway bars. Spec Bs also sit a little to high. THey remind me a lot of a Dodge Ram, huge wheel wells and small looking tires. I've seen pics of other people's sBs lowered and they look a lot better with just lowering it about 1/2"

[Vimy101]

^ No one who really knows about the Spec.B complains much about body roll because there really isn't that much. Larger sways would take away from the fine independent action of the Bilsteins. However, if one is inclined to mess up the suspension geometry by lowering their LGT or Spec.B, I say have at it.

 

There is a thread on this site where someone discusses using different connectors to restore the proper angle between the control arms and wheel when lowering. Of course, using shorter springs will preload the dampers which will create other issues. Frankly, I think the Subaru engineers had their sh1t together and created a really fine GT.

 

Took the Spec. out in 5 inches of snow last night and had an effing blast.

[psi365]

^^ Except Road and Track & Car and Driver both complaining as compared to similiar cars the spec B had noticablely more body roll. I'm used to driving german stuff which all corner pretty flat. My spec B doesn't roll nearly as much as some of my past cars, but it still is more then should for a car that is supposed to have a "sport tuned" suspension.