rotaryracer Posted November 8, 2004 Share Posted November 8, 2004 Since it's just starting to sleet here in NY, I figured I better get my butt in gear and order snows. I'm probably going through Tire Rack to get a combo already mounted, balanced, and ready to bolt on. I've decided on a wheel (Kazera KZ-R) and just need to finalize on tires - Bridgestone Blizzak WS-50s or Dunlop Graspic DS-2s? [b]Blizzaks:[/b] [img]http://www.tirerack.com/images/tires/bridgestone/bs_blizzak_ws_50_dir_ci2_l.jpg[/img] [b]Graspics:[/b] [img]http://www.tirerack.com/images/tires/dunlop/du_graspic_ds2_ci2_l.jpg[/img] I had a set of Graspic HS-1s on a FWD Honduh Accord and they did GREAT - really made the car usable in the snow compared to the OE Michelins. Decent treadwear, too. I don't have any experience with Blizzaks, but they appear to be a kick-butt snow/ice tire (as long as the magic rubber layer is still there). The Graspic DS-2s also have a magic rubber layer that will burn away after 55% wear. Bottom line - Graspics are $97/tire, Blizzaks are $127/tire. Are the Blizzaks worth the extra $120? I'd rather spend the money now rather than cheap out and be disappointed when the white stuff flies. I'm placing the order tonight, so please let me know thoughts/feedback ASAP! Thanks! Jason Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emosound Posted November 9, 2004 Share Posted November 9, 2004 I have the Blizzak WS-50 for my Miata, and I love them in the snow. The car moves as long as the snow isn't higher than the front spoiler. However, I HATE them on dry pavement. Feels like the car is on jello, the tread blocks are so soft. No turn-in response, and the braking is abysmal, to the point of dangerous, IMO. I put Blizzak LM-22s on my wife's Jetta, and they don't work quite as well in the snow, but still goes, stops and turns well, and they feel good in the dry, too. I also had a GTI VR6 with Pirelli 210 Snowsport tires. They were great in the dry, but less than impressive in the snow. Tire Rack seems to agree with me: [url="http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tests/testResultsModel.jsp?tireMake=Dunlop&tireModel=Winter+Sport+M2"]http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tests/testResultsModel.jsp?tireMake=Dunlop&tireModel=Winter+Sport+M2[/url] I never tried the Graspic. Tire Rack puts it in the same camp with the WS-50, IE, serious snow and ice tire. Personally, with the added benefit of AWD, I would get the LM-22, but I'm in SE PA, where the roads get cleared pretty quickly. If in NY it's more hilly, or you spend more time on snow rather than dry roads, get the kick-butt snow tires. :) -Paul Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TeeLoo Posted November 9, 2004 Share Posted November 9, 2004 My father just bought himself a of set of graspic DS-1 for his E300 1996 Mercedes. He has no experience with these tires but got them for what seems to be a great quality/price ratio. Dry pavement performance needed to be decent since he will drive on these tires all seasons for 2-3 years. Maybe you should give the dunlops a try, save money and report to us during winter on the tire's behavior in winter conditions.:) From what I know you'd be the only one on this forum with winter dunlops on a LGT. And I'm probably the only one with ContiWinterContacts, together we'll provide valuable feedback on different winter tire models/manufacturer. 2005 Legacy GT Wagon Ltd 5EAT Garnet Red 1999 GTI VR6 Black - sold but not forgotten... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
racerdave Posted November 10, 2004 Share Posted November 10, 2004 [quote name='emosound']I have the Blizzak WS-50 for my Miata, and I love them in the snow. The car moves as long as the snow isn't higher than the front spoiler. However, I HATE them on dry pavement. Feels like the car is on jello, the tread blocks are so soft..... Personally, with the added benefit of AWD, I would get the LM-22, but I'm in SE PA, where the roads get cleared pretty quickly. If in NY it's more hilly, or you spend more time on snow rather than dry roads, get the kick-butt snow tires. :) -Paul[/QUOTE] I agree with Paul... the WS-50s are good in the snow for sure. As good as any studless tire I've experienced to date. Dry, they are jello. But if you drive accordingly, you can manage. Also... Paul, thanks for the LM-22 mini-review. In SE WI, the main roads are cleared (and salted and soon slushy) pretty quickly too. So I'm debating between the LM-25s ($150 a tire) and the Dunlop M3's ($113 a tire). I'd always gone with full-on snows, but after spending some time in Steamboat Springs last year, I learned what real snow is all about... and that full-on snows are needed in Colorado. The SE WI winters, while cold and capable of producing decent amounts of snow, just seem to be better suited for a "performance" snow tire, at least where I live. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VXCL Posted November 10, 2004 Share Posted November 10, 2004 Highly recommend Dunlop Winter M3s. Awesome in the snow, great in the rain, better then oe on dry, and very quiet. treadware is great too. i got about 18k on them and have more then 50% tread left and thats with about 6k on them from the summer! last winter was awesome. i went through 9" of snow with only 3" ground clearance and never got stuck. steep hills were no problem. it was great to drive past people with trucks and suvs stuck in the middel of the road or slid off it. my only problem was the next day when all th esnow that was caked in the wheels and fenders turned to ice. had to wait for it to melt before i could drive my car again. MAYHEM #122/22 STS NNJR SCCA AUTOX4U.COM XENON RETRO GUIDE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akscooby Posted November 11, 2004 Share Posted November 11, 2004 Hey everyone...I'm pretty new to the LGT site, but I live in Alaska and have for 30 years, so I know a little about driving in snow. I just got the LGT Wagon a couple of months ago, did some research, and settled with the Blizzak WS-50's. Shortly after getting them from Tirerack.com (2 days shipping to freakin' Alaska...I LOVE good service), it snowed. Then it got cold. Then it snowed some more. In a two week period I've been in anywhere from 6-8 inches of snow, slush, rain, and -3 F temperatures. The roads are now solid ice at night and melting during the day. So...with that set up, I can only sing the praises of the Blizzaks. I've never had studless snow tires before, but I have to say I'm amazed. They stick to everything. They dig through the snow. The flat out get you through whatever crud is on the road. Add the AWD and turbo, and with a little playing around you can get some good rear-end washouts with easy control. Yes, they are soft tires. They are squishy feeling on dry pavement. I wouldn't recommend them if it is only going to snow once or twice all season. However, if you're in a winter wonderland and headed up into the mountains to the ski resort or whatever, I'd recommend spending the extra dough on the Blizzaks. I have no other studless snows to compare them to, but I am totally comfortable with them as a replacement to studded tires. And a side note: When it's below zero, the power increase from the turbo is noticeable. Smoother torque curve and the little boxer just plain seems to run better the cooler it gets. -SM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
racerdave Posted November 11, 2004 Share Posted November 11, 2004 VXCL... thanks for the M3 opinion. I'm definitely leaning that way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gtguy Posted November 11, 2004 Share Posted November 11, 2004 I'd still love to see a comprehensive tire test that looks at everything. Tire Rack doesn't carry Nokian, so they don't include Nokian in any of their tests, for example. We've seen tests that include some snows, but not all the significant ones, say all of the studless snow tires, then all of the performance snows. The Snow Tire site did a test, but not with the different tires on the same car, and they also used different drivers for said cars, which makes the data set so scrambled as to be almost worthless. I would go with the Graspics. The Blizzaks wear quickly, and once the magic stuff is gone, they're just a mediocre all-season tire. Kevin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
racerdave Posted November 11, 2004 Share Posted November 11, 2004 But the Graspics are supposed to have the chewy outside with the crunchy center too... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gtguy Posted November 11, 2004 Share Posted November 11, 2004 [quote name='racerdave']But the Graspics are supposed to have the chewy outside with the crunchy center too...[/QUOTE] Aye, 'tis true. In that case, I'd still go with the Graspics, just because I like Dunlop's summer tires so much. :lol: Kevin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Siorange Posted November 11, 2004 Share Posted November 11, 2004 I absolutely loved the WS-50's when i had them on my 93' 525i. On the highway they were very quiet rode very nicely on dry pavement. Even though the car was RWD i never had any traction problems from all the snow we got last winter. Since my WRX(current car) is AWD i just ordered some good M+S rated all season tires (ToyoProxe4). Should be fun to see how it compares. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rotaryracer Posted November 11, 2004 Author Share Posted November 11, 2004 Well, with work interfering in the way of my snow tire ordering time (damn work!), I haven't had a chance to 'get to gettin'. Of course, in the meantime, Tire Rack sold out of the Kazera KZ-Rs, so it looks like I'll be going with KZ-Vs. For a 17x7 cast wheel, they actually are pretty light at 17 lbs.! [img]http://www.tirerack.com/images/wheels/kazera/swap/kazera_kzv_ci3_l.jpg[/img] On the tires, much as I'd love to save a buck or two, I'm leaning towards the Blizzaks. I'm sure the Graspics aren't a bad tire, but because the DS-2 is brand new there are no real-world experiences with them. I know someone has to be a guinea pig, but I'd rather it not be me. :D I'll probably order tomorrow or Monday and will let you know my impressions when I get everything mounted up. Jason Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rotaryracer Posted November 21, 2004 Author Share Posted November 21, 2004 Got my snow tire package on Friday from the Tire Rack and finally had a chance to get out there and mount 'em up. Here's a few pix from my old digital camera (please excuse the dirt - my baby needs a bath!). FYI, the wheels are supposed to be 17 lbs. each for the 17x7 size. Ship weight was 44 lbs, so a 215/45/17 Blizzak WS-50 should be right around 27 lbs. Bring on Ol' Man Winter! Jason Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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