NSFW Posted November 22, 2006 Share Posted November 22, 2006 Some questions for those of you who have replaced intakes, exhausts, turbos, etc: Do your cars still pass the emissions tests? What extra work does that require for a modified engine? Does your insurance company know about the modifications? If so, how much does it raise your rates? If not, what is the risk that if you get into an accident they'll examine the car and try to deny coverage or something like that? I'm pondering various upgrades, but wondering how much it will cost me, beyond just the parts and labor costs... Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rudy Posted November 22, 2006 Share Posted November 22, 2006 I can't speak for my Legacy, but from past experience emissions is tested one of two ways: a.) Checking an ECU reading through the OBD-II port b.) Rolling dyno / tailpipe OBD-II is pretty easy to pass as long as you haven't done something crazy like go w/ a standalone engine management system. The rolling dyno, I know people without any cats that have passed these tests. Just make sure you run the car hard and get it nice and hot when you drive into the test center. It's when an engine is cold that its emissions are worse. Because Subarus are AWD, my suspicion is that you won't have to put it on rollers. I can't imagine many inspection centers have AWD roller setups. So, a quick check of your ECU should be no big deal to pass. I personally would not mention mods to the insurance company. By that same token, if my car is stolen or totalled I don't expect money for the mods. I tried to get coverage on a previous car for mods and Geico dropped me after my term was over. Generally, these places will only cover things like a basic stereo upgrade and maybe some wheels. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GTsleeper2 Posted November 22, 2006 Share Posted November 22, 2006 with mods & good tuning, u should be with stock emissions or better Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DukeTrout Posted November 22, 2006 Share Posted November 22, 2006 +1 to both. The stock tune is very conservative, which means less complete combustion = nastier emissions. Ich bin echt viel netter, wenn ich nuechtern bin. Echt! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NSFW Posted November 22, 2006 Author Share Posted November 22, 2006 My previous car is AWD as well, I did not have to put it on the 'dyno' but they did stick something up its tailpipe (oh the indignity). I didn't modify it though so emissions test results were never something I worried about. But what about insurance? I assume that very few people invite their insurer to raise their rates, but I wonder about the consequences if the shit hits the fan. Thanks for the responses so far. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beanboy Posted November 22, 2006 Share Posted November 22, 2006 You lose money. Same goes when it comes time to sell a modified car. 99% of the time, you aren't even going to get close to getting costs back from the aftermarket parts. In fact, most of the time it means your car will go for less/take longer to sell... If a modified car is totalled, most folks buy the car back from the insurance company, take the check from them, and then sell off the aftermarket parts. Lose the least amount of money that way. Same goes for when it comes time to sell. Revert to stock and sell the aftermarket parts off. -B http://www.standardshift.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mickeyd2005 Posted November 22, 2006 Share Posted November 22, 2006 If you're in WA, they don't do sniffer tests on newer cars. On my '98 Outback they did a fast idle sniffer test. On newer cars, they just check your OBDII. You won't have any codes if you "tune" it, i.e. turn them off. The insurance is going to vary so you need to call your insurance company. In CA, my friend wrecked his EVO8 because he was driving too fast and hit a large piece of debris in the road. The insurance company paid for his car plus all his mods (provided he had a receipt) minus depreciation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John M Posted November 22, 2006 Share Posted November 22, 2006 I don't care if the insurance company doesn't pay for my aftermarket parts. If they give me the value of the stock items, that's usually more than the part I added so I'm ok. I don't expect them to cover something like a FMIC because I haven't been paying to insure its value during the policy. My policy allows me to insure $X amount of aftermarket accessories, point blank. I pay extra, and if the car is totaled, I get a check for $X at that point. I'm not using this option right now because I don't really need it. As far as extra power, etc, it's nobody's business what I've done to my car. I don't know people who call and say "I've added a 150 shot to my F-body" so I don't see why they even care what turbo I've added. It'd only confuse them anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SLegacy99 Posted November 23, 2006 Share Posted November 23, 2006 Hope you dont mind if I stray away from the topic for a second. Im curious as to what makes a vehicle and a low emission vehicle. And where does the Legacy fall into that? I know all Legacies were LEVs in 2000, but does the turbo change things? I had always just assumed that vehicles that high fuel consumption could never be LEV, but I believe the Lexus LS is ULEV. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SLegacy99 Posted November 23, 2006 Share Posted November 23, 2006 Oh and Ive never failed an emissions test and this is my 3rd Subaru. Always passed with flying colors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NSFW Posted November 23, 2006 Author Share Posted November 23, 2006 I'm not worried about insuring my own stuff, I'm worried about liability insurance. Like, I make a mistake one day and the insurance company says "we insured you for a stock vehicle, not for a modified vehicle, so you'll have to cover the costs of that guy's Mercedes (or, god forbid, doctors) on your own." Or, if I tell them up front, "thank you for informing us of your modifications, your premiums shall henceforth be twice what they were before." When I got the policy (like 12 years ago) I remember there being stuff in there about changing the ride height or engine performance, I just don't remember the details anymore. My other car is still bone stock, so I never paid attention to this stuff. Maybe I'm just being paranoid, I guess nobody else considers it noteworthy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beanboy Posted November 23, 2006 Share Posted November 23, 2006 I'd rather be biking behind a new Ford Expedition than a 2-stoke Chinese scooter. Why? Even if the Ford is releasing more CO2 (oh no!) it doesn't bother humans at fairly low concentrations. Behind the back of a stinking 2-stoke without emissions the total C02 might be less, but you have particulates, more carbon monoxide, along with sulfur and nitrous/nitric oxides to deal with, which stink, burn your eyes, create smog, and acid rain. In other words, a lot more direct human health issues with a small dirty motor than a clean-burning larger motor. Why I yelled bullshit during Al Gore's movie about how China won't sell domestic cars in China... Might use more fuel, but a hell of a lot cleaner than the craptastic emissions their cars are putting out, at least for now. -B http://www.standardshift.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NSFW Posted November 23, 2006 Author Share Posted November 23, 2006 Does it give you any back trouble, carrying around that big chip on your shoulder? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
STG Posted November 24, 2006 Share Posted November 24, 2006 Here's something to ponder concerning aftermarket mods/parts. (I'm not against them - I've got a modified Mach1). Someone sold a modified Mach1 to a 17 year old kid who killed himself in it. Now, lawyers are not only suing Ford claiming the gasoline tank is defective, but.... They are also suing the seller who modded the car and the speed shop that installed chassis bracing commonly known as sub frame connectors. Nevermind that the Mach1 comes factory-equipped with bolt-on sub frame connectors - the aftermarket ones are welded on. It seems that the lawyers are fixated on the disclaimer "FOR OFF ROAD USE ONLY" commonly found on the bottom of most speed shop invoices. While I believe the case has little or no merit, the speed shop's record have been obtained and lawyersare tryiong to interview other customers that have installed these sub frame connectors. I for one would not like to explain to a jury why I put "OFF ROAD ONLY" parts on my car and then sold it without infoming the buyer that the vehicle has been modified from factory specs, may not perform or handle as designed and intended by the engineers and that crashworthiness make be compromised. Read the posts here and make sure you click on the links within the first post. This could get ugly as I can't imagine getting a jury of 12 car nuts. http://www.mach1mustang.org/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=8087 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DukeTrout Posted November 24, 2006 Share Posted November 24, 2006 Hope you dont mind if I stray away from the topic for a second. Im curious as to what makes a vehicle and a low emission vehicle. And where does the Legacy fall into that? I know all Legacies were LEVs in 2000, but does the turbo change things? I had always just assumed that vehicles that high fuel consumption could never be LEV, but I believe the Lexus LS is ULEV. Even the GTs and XTs are. I can't remember whether they are LEV or ULEV, but I'll check the sticker on the window tomorrow. Ich bin echt viel netter, wenn ich nuechtern bin. Echt! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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