Jeff_DML Posted August 26, 2004 Share Posted August 26, 2004 my previous car was a A4 and one of the reasons I bought a subaru was because it will hopefully be cheap and reliable. Like everyone said, might not be a technolgy leader but you cant have everything. I think German companies are going down the wrong path with all this technolgy "innovation". Mercedes even recently admitted that it is causing problems and trying to be more reliable by not being as technolgy advanced. Our current bmw might be our last new one with the way bmw is going. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
red beast Posted August 26, 2004 Share Posted August 26, 2004 maybe subaru is the "sensible leader" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SUBE555 Posted August 27, 2004 Share Posted August 27, 2004 I think you've got it red beast. Being on the cutting edge doesn't always mean technologically. Back to a discussion on Overhead Cam engines versus Pushrods, the pushrods might not be as technologically advanced, but they sure do get the job done and are effective in being fairly small and torquey, their purpose in the majority of vehicles they are in. Technology can be implemented, just having good discression as to what and how well it is tested is the key. It's already been stated that hybrids aren't living up to all the marketing hype. It's too bad, but it takes a long time to hammer things out and often things are overstated or stated for rediculously optimal conditions. We'll just have to see what the next big thing is. I'm hoping to see some of the [url=www.revetec.com]REVETEC[/url] ideas in powertrains in the USDM in the next 3-5 years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScoobySTi07 Posted August 27, 2004 Share Posted August 27, 2004 IMO it’s all about how each company views what their respective markets are and where they think they will go in the future. Each in there own right is an innovator for whatever reason. VW sees themselves as a car company comprised of German technology for the average person. Audi on the other hand I think takes on the view of we can't be BMW but we can still cater to the upper end of the social demographic with a mix of German and pacific technology. Subaru sees themselves as a provider of reliable cars first and performance cars second hence their participation in the WRC. It not only proves the reliability of their designs but shows off the performance they can produce. You don't see VW and Audi participating in the WRC do you. The Ridiculousness is no more But you can have your very own piece of it. **The Ridiculous Part Out.** Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff_DML Posted August 27, 2004 Share Posted August 27, 2004 [quote name='ScoobySTi07'] It not only proves the reliability of their designs but shows off the performance they can produce. You don't see VW and Audi participating in the WRC do you.[/quote] Audi participates in 24hr Le Mans, got to reliable to run that :P They also did run WRC in the 80s and cleaned up so they moved on. You can tell I am a ex-audi owner :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
racerdave Posted August 27, 2004 Share Posted August 27, 2004 Go Jeff! :) He's right... but it goes to prove that you can't compare racing success and reliability to street car reliability. There's NO correlation there. Sure, the marketers would like you to believe that. But other than the pure basics of the car (AWD, number of cylinders, engine displacement) NOTHING is the same between racing at the highest levels and street cars. Production car rallying or racing is a slightly different story, but only slightly... those cars are tweaked quite a bit too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MtnSub Posted August 27, 2004 Share Posted August 27, 2004 What makes a car company a tech leader? Most patents for original engineering? Most unique packaging of tech for a niche market? Is being first at something enough? Must you have an exclusive tech that nobody else can use? Does this have anything to do with why I am leaving my BMW past for a Subaru? No Subaru has done an outstanding job of implementing technologies in a package that best meets my needs/wants today. IMO, inovation today is often part mktg, part mechanical and a brave mgmt decision to build and expand a profitable business from a unique niche core group. During my years in CAD/CAM/CAE for auto/plane/train/boat industry, engineers all over the world (Kroea to Germany) talked about Subaru's engineering build tolerances being more like aircraft industry than auto industry. They would laugh about a company that built cheap little AWD cars with dumb names and no asthetics, but with aircarft specs. Don't know if this is still true, but I think it is part of the general market myth/perseption. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fan42025 Posted August 29, 2004 Share Posted August 29, 2004 [quote name='red beast']maybe subaru is the "sensible leader"[/quote] Exactly. As I said before, it's the thinking person's car. Sure other cars like BMW, Merc, etc. have more advanced electronics and features, some useful, most a waste of time and a few dam stupid ones (eg, i-drive), but are atractive to the mostly non-thinking, badge licking, snob-valued drivers who have too much money and not enough sense. Having said that, if a BMW M3 was the same price as a Sub GT, then I might go for the M3 - it just feels much nicer to drive in some conditions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GT Ski Posted August 29, 2004 Share Posted August 29, 2004 [quote name='fan42025'][quote name='red beast']maybe subaru is the "sensible leader"[/quote] Exactly. As I said before, it's the thinking person's car. Sure other cars like BMW, Merc, etc. have more advanced electronics and features, some useful, most a waste of time and a few dam stupid ones (eg, i-drive), but are atractive to the mostly non-thinking, badge licking, snob-valued drivers who have too much money and not enough sense. Having said that, if a BMW M3 was the same price as a Sub GT, then I might go for the M3 - it just feels much nicer to drive in some conditions.[/quote] I'm sure BMWs drive very nice, BUT they really drive me nuts. Getting stuck behind someone driving a new 3 series 15 miles below the posted speed limit on a one lane secondary road dives me crazy. This happens to me alot around here and while I know not everyone likes to drive fast it just seems like a waste of potential. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fan42025 Posted August 29, 2004 Share Posted August 29, 2004 [quote name='GT Ski'] I'm sure BMWs drive very nice, BUT they really drive me nuts. Getting stuck behind someone driving a new 3 series 15 miles below the posted speed limit on a one lane secondary road dives me crazy. This happens to me alot around here and while I know not everyone likes to drive fast it just seems like a waste of potential.[/quote] Hmmm. The M3 that came out of nowhere and clearly exceeding the limit didn't stay in front of me for long :roll: :o Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GT Ski Posted August 30, 2004 Share Posted August 30, 2004 [quote name='fan42025'][quote name='GT Ski'] I'm sure BMWs drive very nice, BUT they really drive me nuts. Getting stuck behind someone driving a new 3 series 15 miles below the posted speed limit on a one lane secondary road dives me crazy. This happens to me alot around here and while I know not everyone likes to drive fast it just seems like a waste of potential.[/quote] Hmmm. The M3 that came out of nowhere and clearly exceeding the limit didn't stay in front of me for long :roll: :o[/quote] Normally I encounter the opposite, then again Bimmers are a dime a dozen in this area too... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fan42025 Posted August 30, 2004 Share Posted August 30, 2004 [quote name='GT Ski'] Normally I encounter the opposite, then again Bimmers are a dime a dozen in this area too...[/quote] Yes, BMWs are becoming way to common here, especially the low end 3 series ones. The M3's are much less common but the drivers appear to have much more lead in their right foot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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