Anyone else have poor handling?

[derp]

Maybe we're being a tad too rough on new people round here lately? Idk.

 

We're as harsh (or not) as we've always been, but as the price of these cars keeps dipping lower and the age that can afford them drops with it, we're going to run into situations where the age range happens to coincide with the delicate flower, can't handle some shit-talk, instant gratification generation that the internet safe-spaces are shitting out.

[apexi]

If I'm being honest I think people here have always been too harsh on newbies, for years now.

[derp]

Honest question, is that around the same time as the age people could afford these things began dropping to include millenials?

 

*innocent whistle*

[sshole]

Honest question, is that around the same time as the age people could afford these things began dropping to include millenials?

 

*innocent whistle*

 

Hah! I'm a millennial, but I'm not posting terrible question-threads, right?

 

*looks at post history*

 

Right?

 

*quickly deletes the one about my leaking CV boots*

 

......right?

[derp]

[Rhitter]

If I'm being honest I think people here have always been too harsh on newbies, for years now.

 

Be the change you want to see.

 

I fully support badgering newbies who can't bothering searching.

 

Hell if they started with "I tired searching here is what I tried here is what I saw."

 

They would get a much better response. The problem is so often there seems to be no effort put in on their part and then they get pissed when they get called out for it.

[boxkita]

I bought it because for $3900 there was nothing else with 100k miles that was stick and not front wheel drive. I like it now but just bought it as a temporary car but I want to have fun with it

 

Lol any chance you guys are selling sway bars?

 

If I said yes, would that make a difference?

 

I'm an old guy who turned his street wagon into a racecar. Then bought a racecar wagon because adding a cage was too much money.

 

I'm not sure what you mean by canyon carving, however, when I looked it up it looks like driving fast on the county roads. Driving fast on a county roads pretty well exceeds the limits of a LGT, as the standard suspension can't keep up. Adding lowering springs & 595-rsr isn't going to help you much.

 

Your tires are better than stock but not really great for handling, just cheapest speed rated tire. Look for a summer rated high-performance tire on tirerack or discount tire. 225/40/17 is a good start. Expect to pay 200/corner. Tire pressure should be 2 to 5 lbs over the door sticker (prevents rollover). Look for treadwear in the 200 range.

 

Lowering springs don't make your car stop rolling over, they just limit wheel travel up/down. For the type of driving you are doing wheel travel is required.

 

On a 12 year old car, everything related to the suspension is old and worn out (passage of time hardens the soft suspension bits). Replace it all with Whiteline or Group-N if you have money. buy OEM if you don't. New OEM is far better than 12 year old OEM.

 

I know you want a quick fix. I really do. Swaybars with re-inforced mounting brackets and new mounts will make a difference. A huge difference. Read this: http://legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php/comparison-usdm-jdm-cobb-bars-38084.html and this: http://legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php/mach-v-dans-mega-suspension-guide-5941.html . If you can't find the cobb bars look for Whiteline. You'll see them in the forsale section fairly regularly.

 

One of the quick fixes for your canyon carving is a steering dampener lockdown - http://perrinperformance.com/i-22342620-steering-dampener-lockdown-for-subarus.html . This removes the rubber dampener from causing your steering to lock during fast side-to-side maneuvers. You feel this when you are in a tight series of S turns and the car refuses to turn. Your palms get sweaty as the car keeps moving towards the cliff side or guard rail. At the last minute, the inertia in the system catches up and the steering starts working again.

 

Next up is brakes. If you are like most, you think a BBK will fix all your problems. Sorry, a BBK on a street is all about bling. By the time your car needs the caliper in the BBK, you're doing 130 into a 10 mph turn on slicks and praying the guy next to you doesn't have an aneurysm. Just saying. That said, you do need better brake pads (Hawk HPS is a nice linear brake pad. Others in the "street performance" category work well too). With better pads comes stainless steel brake lines & high temp brake fluid. Brakes used in canyon carving should be linear (the more travel on the pedal, the more brake you get), not instantaneous (full braking in the first 2mm of travel). You don't need slotted drilled etc disks. Centric premium disks are good enough (you'll be going thru them at a prodigious rate, same rate as your tires). If you want a great upgrade for your braking system, get front ducts (this company is great - http://rooducts.com/ ). Keeping the front brakes cool will do the most for your braking performance.

 

Once you get all that done, look at your suspension. I know you want coilovers. Everyone is telling you that will fix your problems. They are lying. Sorry. It sucks. However, when you do buy them, get something nice - BC Racing, Feal, Tein, Ohlins, AST, etc. If someone is ranting about how much something sucks, ask what they use? Then ask how it rides. You'll get a long story about how the ride could be better. I know. I have BC Racing coilovers. They suck. Except they don't. My wagon clocked 1.5G instanenaous and 1.25G sustained lap after lap. What's different about my off the rack BC Racing coilovers? I had them tuned for my car and my driving style. I spent more on tuning than I did on the coilovers. Off the rack settings on coilovers suck. For all coilovers, even $8000 Ohlins. Because they are not customized for your car and your driving style. When you go looking for a shop to do your alignment (required after changing the suspension) and corner-balance (required after buying coilovers to get your money's worth), look for a shop with a Hunter Hawkeye Elite with a drive-on rack with weight plates - http://www.hunter.com/alignment-systems/hawkeye-elite . Ask for their most experienced guy and to be present while they are working your car. Be sure to tell them you will be doing track days and need lots of camber (if you tell them you drive in the canyons, good luck). Tuning your suspension is like paying for an engine tuner, you get what you pay for.

 

After you do all that, you'll have a 12 year old family sedan with some suspension work. It won't be as comfortable as it was when you bought it and it will be noiser. It'll carve better than it did but not as well as if you'd spent all that money on a sportscar.

 

Good luck. You're going to need it.

 

You want to know more, drop me a line.

[SamT07]

If I said yes, would that make a difference?

 

I'm an old guy who turned his street wagon into a racecar. Then bought a racecar wagon because adding a cage was too much money.

 

I'm not sure what you mean by canyon carving, however, when I looked it up it looks like driving fast on the county roads. Driving fast on a county roads pretty well exceeds the limits of a LGT, as the standard suspension can't keep up. Adding lowering springs & 595-rsr isn't going to help you much.

 

Your tires are better than stock but not really great for handling, just cheapest speed rated tire. Look for a summer rated high-performance tire on tirerack or discount tire. 225/40/17 is a good start. Expect to pay 200/corner. Tire pressure should be 2 to 5 lbs over the door sticker (prevents rollover). Look for treadwear in the 200 range.

 

Lowering springs don't make your car stop rolling over, they just limit wheel travel up/down. For the type of driving you are doing wheel travel is required.

 

On a 12 year old car, everything related to the suspension is old and worn out (passage of time hardens the soft suspension bits). Replace it all with Whiteline or Group-N if you have money. buy OEM if you don't. New OEM is far better than 12 year old OEM.

 

I know you want a quick fix. I really do. Swaybars with re-inforced mounting brackets and new mounts will make a difference. A huge difference. Read this: http://legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php/comparison-usdm-jdm-cobb-bars-38084.html and this: http://legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php/mach-v-dans-mega-suspension-guide-5941.html . If you can't find the cobb bars look for Whiteline. You'll see them in the forsale section fairly regularly.

 

One of the quick fixes for your canyon carving is a steering dampener lockdown - http://perrinperformance.com/i-22342620-steering-dampener-lockdown-for-subarus.html . This removes the rubber dampener from causing your steering to lock during fast side-to-side maneuvers. You feel this when you are in a tight series of S turns and the car refuses to turn. Your palms get sweaty as the car keeps moving towards the cliff side or guard rail. At the last minute, the inertia in the system catches up and the steering starts working again.

 

Next up is brakes. If you are like most, you think a BBK will fix all your problems. Sorry, a BBK on a street is all about bling. By the time your car needs the caliper in the BBK, you're doing 130 into a 10 mph turn on slicks and praying the guy next to you doesn't have an aneurysm. Just saying. That said, you do need better brake pads (Hawk HPS is a nice linear brake pad. Others in the "street performance" category work well too). With better pads comes stainless steel brake lines & high temp brake fluid. Brakes used in canyon carving should be linear (the more travel on the pedal, the more brake you get), not instantaneous (full braking in the first 2mm of travel). You don't need slotted drilled etc disks. Centric premium disks are good enough (you'll be going thru them at a prodigious rate, same rate as your tires). If you want a great upgrade for your braking system, get front ducts (this company is great - http://rooducts.com/ ). Keeping the front brakes cool will do the most for your braking performance.

 

Once you get all that done, look at your suspension. I know you want coilovers. Everyone is telling you that will fix your problems. They are lying. Sorry. It sucks. However, when you do buy them, get something nice - BC Racing, Feal, Tein, Ohlins, AST, etc. If someone is ranting about how much something sucks, ask what they use? Then ask how it rides. You'll get a long story about how the ride could be better. I know. I have BC Racing coilovers. They suck. Except they don't. My wagon clocked 1.5G instanenaous and 1.25G sustained lap after lap. What's different about my off the rack BC Racing coilovers? I had them tuned for my car and my driving style. I spent more on tuning than I did on the coilovers. Off the rack settings on coilovers suck. For all coilovers, even $8000 Ohlins. Because they are not customized for your car and your driving style. When you go looking for a shop to do your alignment (required after changing the suspension) and corner-balance (required after buying coilovers to get your money's worth), look for a shop with a Hunter Hawkeye Elite with a drive-on rack with weight plates - http://www.hunter.com/alignment-systems/hawkeye-elite . Ask for their most experienced guy and to be present while they are working your car. Be sure to tell them you will be doing track days and need lots of camber (if you tell them you drive in the canyons, good luck). Tuning your suspension is like paying for an engine tuner, you get what you pay for.

 

After you do all that, you'll have a 12 year old family sedan with some suspension work. It won't be as comfortable as it was when you bought it and it will be noiser. It'll carve better than it did but not as well as if you'd spent all that money on a sportscar.

 

Good luck. You're going to need it.

 

You want to know more, drop me a line.

 

 

 

I like this guy. Thank you.

 

Btw my treadwear is 140. I've had ha look Ventus v12's before but I didn't like them as much. And I had hankook rs3s as well and I'd say the federals are up there with the rs3's in grip. So far, as far I've pushed it, no break of traction or even tire squeal. I know a shop here that corner balances, they did all of my friends cars. I think I saw some Perrin steering lockdown for sale somewhere recently, I just didn't know what it was and didn't think I'd need it. So good to know it will help with my handling. I've been needing brakes for a while now, they aren't low but they just plain and simple suck. (Previous owner had them changed so I don't even know what they are). Out of all the reviews I've read hawk ceramics were one of the best with the only downside of it being they dust a lot but I can live with that. And coilovers are something I can wait for.

 

I'm not contradicting you or anything I'm just trying to tell you what I know so far. Thanks again man.

[SamT07]

I swear I feel like you guys stalk me everywhere

 

 

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