twisty Posted September 13, 2012 Share Posted September 13, 2012 ive had other makes of cars get clogged/ bad cats after barely 100k miles. one of my girlfriends back before i got married had a K car that started a desert fire with a red hot glowing cat converter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silentguy Posted September 24, 2012 Share Posted September 24, 2012 Get the NAPA test kit, and verify for sure it's not the Head Gasket. It still could be..... See my post here, I just did the head gaskets and theres a pic on the last page of the test kit. http://legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php/1998-legacy-gt-2-5l-head-gasket-replacement-192635.html You have NAPA's in Hawaii ? Otherwise you could probably get it shipped. It does cost a fortune to ship to Hawaii I bet though. Edit: I looked it up, there are 2 NAPAs on Kauai. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silentguy Posted September 24, 2012 Share Posted September 24, 2012 A temporary fix to get you running is just remove the thermostat, or drill a few holes in the flange, so that more coolant can pass through. I did this before. Its better than having the car overheat, but the engine wont operate at its recommended temperature, it will run too cold. Long term impact is probably not good, but a few days wont hurt it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silentguy Posted September 24, 2012 Share Posted September 24, 2012 The ONLY way to confirm that the head gaskets are good, or the head gaskets are bad is to do a hydrocarbon test. NEVER assume they are good if you still over heat. Even if it doesn't always do it. My head gaskets went and it didn't always overheat at first. You can't always tell by lookimg at the coolant ant oil... These gasjets leak internally and super heat the coolant with combusted fuel/air. If you know BOTH fans run, have replacedthe thermostat, radiator, and cap, yet it still overheats after purging air from the system, I would bet it's the gaskets. 9 times out of 10, it is. Oh, and make sure everything is OEM Actually what happens as far as I undestand, is the exhaust gases get trapped at the thermostat, and keep it cool, not allowing it to open. So the thermostat stays closed and the car overheats. If you remove your thermostat it wont overheat, and could at least get you back home if needed. Caveat : Make sure to remove the thermostat when the engine and coolant is cold, and also be prepared to capture the coolant that is going to flow out of the hose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DurkaDur Posted September 25, 2012 Share Posted September 25, 2012 If it's the 2.5, I'd have to say it's your head gaskets gone bad. 2.2's are not known to blow head gaskets (why I am not sure) but I have a buddy with a 98 legacy outback wagon with a 2.5 and it did the same thing.. sometimes it would overheat and other times it just wouldn't. I'm sure its been said already but use MLS head gaskets when replacing them. I have tried the graphite head gaskets with no luck. If it's not the head gaskets it could possibly be a cracked head but I HIGHLY doubt that. Anyway, nice looking forester! You got a steal on a Subaru like I did! Paid 700 for my 97 legacy gt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silentguy Posted September 25, 2012 Share Posted September 25, 2012 The original post from the owner says that speedometer is broken too, so it could have something to do with the speedsensor in the tranmission. He also took it to a few mechanics, one of which said it was the head gaskets. From the symptoms you are giving, its most likely the head gaskets. For about $200-$300 in parts you can do it yourself, though you will need the time, tools, and patience. It's not too hard, but it does take some time. I just did mine, and people here can help you through the job. You can prob get the parts from NAPA, or have Amazon ship them, though I bet shipping from the mainland is very expensive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monkeyposeur Posted September 26, 2012 Share Posted September 26, 2012 Just for the record 22Es are not known for blowing HGs but the 22Ts can and will, leaking internally. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timbaru Posted September 26, 2012 Author Share Posted September 26, 2012 I took the thermostat out a good 2 weeks ago and I've been driving the car for a good 2 weeks everyday, and drove it HARD to really to TRY and get it to overheat and the needle didn't budge. I think it was just a faulty thermostat. Only time it overheated was the day I bought it (before taking out the thermostat) everyone said it was head gaskets though, so idk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kennyfvholla Posted September 26, 2012 Share Posted September 26, 2012 Pulling the thermostat will not allow a motor with failed gaskets to over heat. It circulating all of the coolant from the get go. So, the coolant never gets the chance to fully super heat. If you pull the thermostat in a motor that has good gaskets, it won't run at as high a temp as yours is running. My gaskets had gotten to the point that if I drove more than a mile, the car would overheat. I eventually removed the thermostat and it didn't over heat at all. You'll hurt the car over time by not running a thermostat. Don't make any assumption until you've narrowed down the issue one by one, completely eliminating all but one possibility. It's not a smart thing to do in the long run. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silentguy Posted September 26, 2012 Share Posted September 26, 2012 Do the hydrocarbon test, then you will know for sure, without having to guess. I drove my car for a few days without the thermostat. Not sure how long you can do that, but its probably better to figure out the problem. Once I knew it was the Head Gaskets for sure, I went ahead and did them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silentguy Posted September 26, 2012 Share Posted September 26, 2012 I took the thermostat out a good 2 weeks ago and I've been driving the car for a good 2 weeks everyday, and drove it HARD to really to TRY and get it to overheat and the needle didn't budge. I think it was just a faulty thermostat. Only time it overheated was the day I bought it (before taking out the thermostat) everyone said it was head gaskets though, so idk I simple way to prove it's not the thermostat, is to buy a brand new OEM one and put that in. I did that, and mine still overheated. I then did the Exhaust Gas/Hydro Carbon test, and it was positive. That told me it was the head gaskets. When I took off the Head, it was proven there were many leaks in the gasket. Another thing you can do is boil the old thermostat in a pot of water, and check that it opens. It should open at about 190 degrees F I think. Also check that it closes when it cools down. If this test works, then you know there is nothing wrong with the thermostat, and the overheating is most likely due to the head gaskets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timbaru Posted September 26, 2012 Author Share Posted September 26, 2012 I've had my thermostat out in my legacy for about 3 years and nothing has happened. Even without a thermostat you can get the car up to normal operating temp, it just takes longer than usual. I've driven the forester for a solid 2 hours straight AFTER the temp got up to normal and it showed no signs. I just can't imagine how a blown head gasket could be dormant when the engine is up to temp and I'm driving it hard. I will still get the hydrocarbon test but the car is suiting my needs as of right now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silentguy Posted September 26, 2012 Share Posted September 26, 2012 I've had my thermostat out in my legacy for about 3 years and nothing has happened. Even without a thermostat you can get the car up to normal operating temp, it just takes longer than usual. I've driven the forester for a solid 2 hours straight AFTER the temp got up to normal and it showed no signs. I just can't imagine how a blown head gasket could be dormant when the engine is up to temp and I'm driving it hard. I will still get the hydrocarbon test but the car is suiting my needs as of right now Well, if you've driven for 3 years with no thermostat, maybe there are no real bad effects. As long as your head gasket leak is not too bad, you may be able to survive with the Forrester for a few years. Its better than overheating it and cracking the block. Eventually if the leaks get bad enough you may need to do the head gaskets. So why are you running without a thermostat in the Legacy ? Same overheating problem ? Just keep an eye on the coolant levels, and make sure the overflow coolant tank is not bubbling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silentguy Posted September 26, 2012 Share Posted September 26, 2012 I did a little research on running without a thermostat. Here are some comments: If you take out the thermostat you will use more gas because the engine will run too rich. Also, you won't have heat, not a big deal for you in Hawaii. If you go on a long, long drive, the car will eventually overheat. As you drive, the engine is trying to heat up the coolant (as a process of combustion). The radiator tries to cool it down. But the radiator doesn't cool faster that the engine heats up the coolant. So, slowly, over time, ALL of the coolant gets too hot - the car overheats. In the summer it could cause your car to run too hot especially if you are doing a lot of city driving. In the winter the car would run too cold (depending on where you live) never heating the water up enough to give you heat in the car and causing the engine to run cold all the time. -- You dont have to worry about the winter in Hawaii If your engine does not get up to temperature internal condensation raises he*l with motor oil. Soon varnish and sludge will cake inside the crankcase. Most cars can operate fine without a thermostat, with no long term problems. It means a longer warm up period in the winter months for cars that have a carburetor. But with fuel injection it should be no problem. But you should keep an eye on the temperature gauge or light, because some vehicles may even overheat without a thermostat because the water is running through the radiator too quickly and not getting a chance to cool off before it goes back to the engine. And in the winter time a missing thermostat will mean a longer period before the antifreeze warms up and provides heat to the inside of the car. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drift Motion Posted September 26, 2012 Share Posted September 26, 2012 From my experience, running no thermostat just creates a "open system", same as having a thermostat stuck open. Thermostat is closed until around 180 degree IIRC, to let the engine warms up faster. It shouldn't cause the engine to run rich, but does use a little more gas, as the ECU is trying harder to warm up the car initially. Once it's up to operating temperature, thermostat stays open until it is cooled below that temperature. Basically only difference is the initial warm up takes longer, and might uses a bit more fuel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kennyfvholla Posted September 26, 2012 Share Posted September 26, 2012 Engines are designed the way they are for a REASON. Every little component. The thermostat is there for a reason. 3 years out of the Legacy? How many miles is that? Not too many, I'm sure. How many mile could you possibly drive in Hawaii.. As the miles add up, you will start to see effects. The catalytic converters will be one of the first things to go on that. More than likely, you will not see the Fozzy overheat one bit for quite some time. It won't. The coolant is circulating at such a high rate and volume, that it cools down enough before it is super heated again. This reduces the usefulness of it over time. The gaskets are STILL leaking. They will get worse. Eventually the motor will over heat with the thermostat out. By then you will have lost a lot of power (loss of compression), used more gas than you should have (loss of compressed fuel air mixed), will have reduce the life of the catalytic converters, and will have done damage to the bearings due to oil not heating up correctly (maybe that's not a problem where you live). That's all I have to say until you let us know what the hydrocarbon test says. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timbaru Posted September 26, 2012 Author Share Posted September 26, 2012 I've had my legacy for about 4 years and put 40,000 miles on it. It's surprising how much you can actually drive here because stuff is so spaced out. In Cali my drives were usually just a few minutes to get where I needed to go because cities have everything in close proximity. Hawaii not so much. I will get a carbon test and an OEM thermostat when I have some spare money. I'm broke as a joke. For now I'm enjoying my fozzy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silentguy Posted September 26, 2012 Share Posted September 26, 2012 You may not need the OEM thermostat. Maybe the old one is OEM too, and good. Just do the boil test on it. It's free.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timbaru Posted September 26, 2012 Author Share Posted September 26, 2012 I don't wanna put the old one back in, regardless if it opens or not. Looks like a piece of shit and has a generic ass name on it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monkeyposeur Posted September 27, 2012 Share Posted September 27, 2012 Only use OEM thermostats!!! All others are garbage. Subarus need Subaru thermostats, they're picky. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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