HID lights on line

[grovlet]

I've got a 55W 6000K Slim Ballast DDM kit in the 98. Not a single issue in 1 1/2 years:d

 

Couldn't get any easier of an install... All harnesses are plug and play, and they even provide a nice 3M doubled sided sticky to stick the ballasts down if you want...

 

Probably the best kit for the $$. It's not worth the extra $$ for the high end quality when replacement bulbs are only $15/pair.

[TSiWRX]

Holy crap those 55w's are bright! Do people high beam you?

 

^ I'm beginning to think, more and more, that this is also highly related to the conditions in which you drive.

 

GTS Jeff routinely got flashed even on the +65 Osrams, so he's been rightfully leery of getting things any brighter.

 

I've finally started experimenting with my headlamps (I've run out of other things to do...so I'm now doing things just for fun), and I started off with a DDM 55W plug-and-play H7 setup, filling the squirrel finders, but still on the factory incandescent optics.

 

My biggest complaint has simply been that the throw isn't wide enough - and this, combined with the increased contrast between the lighted area and the unlighted, makes seeing to the periphery a bit more difficult to my eyes (which, admittedly, also prefer amber/straw/fire-light color temperatures).

 

My aim is conservative, and I also use LaserVEIL G4 on my lenses (which is the main reason why I wanted to go HID - so that I can recover my light-on-road), both may also make my lights less offensive in terms of glare, but I have not yet been flashed (and a fair bit of my night-time driving is on rural, unlit, undivided two-lane roadways) in the last 5 months or so, the duration which I've had this setup.

 

 

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I do not have fog lights tho. Do you guys thinks that I ll have problems when it snows and I use these HIDs?

 

Go with 4300-6000K color temperature, staying to the low side as much as possible. If you get the 55W kit, the 6000K should wash-down to a whiter color, so it should still be just fine.

 

Truthfully, it should be OK in all but a near-whiteout. And by then, you'd have parked the car, anyway, hopefully!

 

 

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Tsi: you are right...i was thinking more in the terms of price vs quality.

 

^ Ah, gotcha.

 

Truthfully, when going with the aftermarkets, I honestly don't believe that there's that much difference - that paying much more would necessarily get you something that's so much better.

 

Given my "toying around" goals, I was more than satisfied to just go with the DDMs, based on price alone.

 

I honestly haven't been keeping good track of the OE-take-off market for the last 5 years (my last full-optics retrofit was on my last DSM), so I have no clue what OE components now cost. But it looks like I'm going to be going down that route, sooner or later, given my complaint of lack of spread.

[lranchev]

Thanks for your full replies!!! I am getting my HID light from DDM next week i think.

[fishbone]

Please keep in mind and don't confuse glare with brightness.

I yanked my HID kit out after 2 weeks. Glare galore, hotspots, uneven beam spread. Bright as hell right in the front of the car, shitty lateral lighting and far ahead. When I switched to the halogen OSRAM Rallye+, I lost some light in front of the car but gained range and lateral lighting, not to mention a nice even spread. I drive on dark outside city limit roads often so this was a big deal for me.

Besides, I have a link here somewhere to a reaction test and HID drivers only reacted somewhere around 10-15% faster than halogen.

[lranchev]

I will put them on and i hope to like it. You are probably the first person who does not like HIDs.

[fishbone]

Far from it.

And I didn't say I don't like HIDs. I don't like them in a halogen housing, which is completely different. Halogen housings are not the same design/geometry as HID housings because the two technologies have different beam patterns. To use someone else's analogy, it is like wearing someone elses prescription glasses. I had HIDs in the car I had before the Legacy. The aftermarket kit I had in the Legacy wasn't even close in terms of quality, which to me means the ability to effectively use the light output. It was a Nissan Altima with OEM Philips HIDs.

[TSiWRX]

lranchev, like fishbone said, he's far from the only one.

 

The key is:

 

I don't like them in a halogen housing, which is completely different. Halogen housings are not the same design/geometry as HID housings because the two technologies have different beam patterns.

 

There's a lot of compromise that we get, from the plug-and-play, on our BL/BP Legacys.

 

Unless you go all-out with a well thought out full-optics retrofit, lranchev, those compromises are not something which will go away.

 

Given the low cost of today's aftermarket units and ease of the simple plug-and-play modification, combined with the capability of our incandescent halogen optics to sufficiently harness the extra light while holding the worst of the glare in-check, this particular modification has become "acceptable" in our community, and in many cases, yes, the extra light cast actually can be of good use to the driver.

 

But in total honesty, it's also far from perfect - and in certain other cases, the narrow beam pattern as well as simply too much foreground lighting can well play a similar, but negative, effect: all the moreso if the unique/individual driver's eyes take less kindly to whiter light (versus "firelight").

 

HIDs aren't the "end all and be all" that most of its marketing would want you to believe. Just as with halogen incandescents, there's compromises.

 

If it were truly that insanely good, why would the technology-leading manufacturers already have moved on to LED lighting?

[fishbone]

Supposebly us blue-eyed/green-eyed folks have more sensitive vision. I am not sure if that is true, but there it is. I have green eyes and I simply did not like how the aftermarket HID kit performed. I could not be happier with the Rallye bulbs I have now.

[lranchev]

It is interesting that you guys are talking about differences in the housing of each HIDs and halogen bulbs. I mean, is it really that much of difference or just the quality of those after market kits is not as good? Are those Rallye bulbs better than original H7?

[OhBe1]

... Are those Rallye bulbs better than original H7?

 

Yes. Not dramatically, but enough to be worthwhile.

[RJS5689]

Far from it.

And I didn't say I don't like HIDs. I don't like them in a halogen housing, which is completely different. Halogen housings are not the same design/geometry as HID housings because the two technologies have different beam patterns. To use someone else's analogy, it is like wearing someone elses prescription glasses. I had HIDs in the car I had before the Legacy. The aftermarket kit I had in the Legacy wasn't even close in terms of quality, which to me means the ability to effectively use the light output. It was a Nissan Altima with OEM Philips HIDs.

You've changed my mind on these. It seems quite a few places I have looked on say this same thing. Every vehicle I have had prior has had factory HIDs. I'd much prefer to do something right rather than half-ass the job. Looks like I'll tinker elsewhere.

[WagSubGTL]

what is the model of headlight that you ordered from ddm? H7? 9005?

[TSiWRX]

You've changed my mind on these. It seems quite a few places I have looked on say this same thing. Every vehicle I have had prior has had factory HIDs. I'd much prefer to do something right rather than half-ass the job. Looks like I'll tinker elsewhere.

 

^ If you've had prior experience with either full-optics retrofits or other OEM optics - particularly if you've been spoiled and had one of the better systems - then you'll likely be somewhat unhappy with the plug-and-play H7 solution.

 

In your case, I'd say that the trouble and/or expense of a full-optics retrofit will definitely be worth it.

 

 

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It is interesting that you guys are talking about differences in the housing of each HIDs and halogen bulbs. I mean, is it really that much of difference or just the quality of those after market kits is not as good?

 

It's not just the housing - it's the entire optical assembly.

 

Look at your typical household 60W standard incandescent bulb. That sucker should produce somewhere around 800 lumen worth of lighting power. It certainly lights up your bedroom nicely, no? Even the dust-bunnies in the corner are pretty apparent, right?

 

Hang that bulb outside on your porch. How far can you see into your back yard? Not a whole lot, right?

 

Now take a simple 100-lumen output handheld, battery-operated flashlight.

 

Shine that thing around in your room, and yes, you've got one heck of a bright spot on one wall or the ceiling, but I'd bet it's hard to make out the rest of the details in the room.

 

Take it to your back porch, and shine it into your back yard. Note that the light "throws" much farther than your hanging 60W household light, right - so you're able to see farther - but that the light doesn't "spill" much to the sides.

 

That's the difference the optics make. It's the design of the reflectors and the forward optics (i.e. lens) - mated to the specific type of lighting it's designed for, to do a specific task it's designed to do. That's why a 100-lumen flashlight can "shine out" further than a 800-lumen naked household bulb: it's because, for lack of better words, the light produced by the latter just isn't harnessed for the purpose of "distance throw."

 

Optics make all the difference in the world.

 

More specific examples.

 

In terms of the "behind/around-the-light" reflector design:

 

Back in the day, SureFire - makers of some of the world's best "Tactical Flashlights" - introduced what's then called their "Turbo head" component, a replacement/alternative forward reflector housing that's a much larger, deeper dish than what's typically on their standard offerings. Why? It was so as to allow the flashlight to throw farther out than how it was originally equipped.

 

Also, in the world of custom-made flashlights, search up the Mr. Bulk VIP. This unit came with the then-state-of-the-art LED and optics, and standard, carried an "EDC" - (e)very (d)ay ©arry - "head" unit with a reflector setup small enough to be able to fit in your pocket or to be holster-carried. Optional were increasingly large heads - the "Bulk Head" and "Big Bulk Head," which, while making the item increasingly no longer suitable for pocket carry, allowed the light to shine farther out.

 

In terms of forward-of-light "lens" design:

 

Look at this great review, on The Flashlight Reviews and LED Modifications hobbyist site, of the Inova X1 - http://www.flashlightreviews.com/reviews/inova_x1.htm . Look at the amazing difference in how the light output is controlled by the differences in optics (collimator design update as well as reflector considerations) between the initial and the revised variants of this handheld unit.

 

[RJS5689]

^ If you've had prior experience with either full-optics retrofits or other OEM optics - particularly if you've been spoiled and had one of the better systems - then you'll likely be somewhat unhappy with the plug-and-play H7 solution.

 

In your case, I'd say that the trouble and/or expense of a full-optics retrofit will definitely be worth it.

 

Thanks for the advice! I'm used to adaptive bi-xenon lighting from the factory on my prior vehicles. Looks like I'll be staying halogen with the Legacy until I decide I want to dump money into optics.

[TSiWRX]

^ NP.

 

I just wanted to give one man's honest opinion of things - my two cents, that's all.

 

The plug-and-play H7s interact pretty well with our incandescent-halogen factory optics: yes, you'll gain more "light on road" and there's sufficient glare-control. But to someone who's used to good factory HIDs, the artifacts, increased foreground lighting, and the lack of sufficient spread will be immediately noticeable, and more than likely, will prove less-than-satisfactory.

 

Given that the DDM kits are now in the $30 range, RJS, if you wanted to just play around with it - all the more easier if you're already experienced in these little aftermarket electrical upgrades/modifications ... these kits can literally "go in" in less than 30 minutes - it would be something that you may want to just play with and see.

 

All I'm saying is that I wouldn't get my hopes up.

[B-Power-B]

Thanks for the advice! I'm used to adaptive bi-xenon lighting from the factory on my prior vehicles. Looks like I'll be staying halogen with the Legacy until I decide I want to dump money into optics.

 

 

RJS5689...When are you going to do us all a favor and go back to Audi/VW?

 

There is not an aftermarket HID (plug and play) out there that will meet your standards. Trust me, I have similar experience with xenon..in my opinion the aftermarket kits can be spotted from a mile away. I feel the only true way to go HID on the legacy is to do a swap similar to this:

http://legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php/rx330-oem-conversion-full-oem-56028.html?t=56028&highlight=rx330+hid

 

Just my opinion. My buddy put a set of HID on his LGT and i didn't care for it at all.. It was brighter, yes, but not crisp. And it did not have the distinct light cut off that even our projected halogen lights have. Like said before, the Legacy housings are not dialed in for HID, especially a one size fits all plug and play.

 

I just ordered a set of Osram rallye H7 and s set of Toshibia 9011. I decided to stick with halogen because the aftermarket quality is not enough for me and our stock halogen lights are very good.

 

Here are a couple links I used:

http://forums.beyond.ca/showthread/t-164266.html

http://legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php/osram-h7-65w-toshiba-hir-124938.html?t=124938

[fishbone]

It is interesting that you guys are talking about differences in the housing of each HIDs and halogen bulbs. I mean, is it really that much of difference or just the quality of those after market kits is not as good? Are those Rallye bulbs better than original H7?

The stock halogen bulbs puts out about 1500-1700 lumens, the Rallyes are at 2100. HIDs are at 3200-3400 as long as you get them in the 4300-4500Kelvin range. The higher the Kelvin, the lower the lumens. The Rallye are brighter, they put out a better spread of light which is also whiter. Makes a nice difference.

[lranchev]

I ve had the HID light on my Subaru for a couple of months now and i ve been very happy with the extra light i get. Only concern now i have is that the kit i have is 55 watts and few people already told me that i will damage my stock housings(if i dont go down to 35 watts or buy Philips bulbs) and i might have problems with my stock wires if i dont get the direct wire to power the ballasts from my battery rather use the stock wires?

was i led to think in the wrong direction or these are legit problems that ones have experienced?

 

thanks

[TSiWRX]

^ We have many members who use the 55W units in their BL/BP headlamp housing - as well as fog housings on the '05-'07 models - without issues:

 

http://legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php/plug-and-play-hid-kiti-140664.html

 

When guys like MiniStiGuy weighs-in on the concern, it's easy to see what's what.

 

What we don't have good data-points on are the BMs (i.e. '10+), as well as, currently, we have very few '08-'09s with HIDs in their fog assemblies.

 

But in regard to the wiring? a dedicated wiring harness is a good idea, for more than one reason. Since it's also so easy to plug-and-play such a supplied/optional (if-optional, it tends to be pretty affordable, too: somewhere around the $15 range) harness, I'd just do it.

[lranchev]

Thanks ^

 

That info lets me to exhale a bit I use HIDs on my low beans only. I would not put on high beans cuz i barely use them.

[TSiWRX]

^ NP.

 

For the highs, if your factory fitment is 9005, go to HIR1.

 

It's an awesome compliment to any 4300-6000K color-temperature HID low-beam setup.

[Brock Samson]

Installed my DDM Apexcone 55W 5000K (which doesn't seem to be a popular temp choice, but IMO its awesome- a little purple/blue on spark but full bright white within 10secs. I went with the (very large) 'regular' size ballasts- I can't see any reason to spend the extra dough on the slim ballasts, finding space for the full sizes wasn't a problem at all. Did not get the add'l harness, although I believe there is a vendor on these forums that will give you the harness for free with DDM kits.

 

My oem battery is in shitty condition- mechanic that did the prepurchase inspection reported under 65%- and I've noticed that one of the lamps has trouble firing occasionally. this may be due to my reticence in getting the DRL disable done before installing the HID's , so we'll see once I replace the battery and get those DRL's disabled.

 

Finally, the cutoff on my drivers side seems totally eff'd- the passenger side is a nice crisp clear line right where the original halogens cutoff. The driver's side is NOTHING like that...its maybe a fuzzy line that is far below where the originals cutoff, and is honestly somewhat lost in the passenger side cutoff. I'm thinking the bulb might not be seated correctly? I have pics at home that may help, I'll get them posted soonish.

[Brock Samson]

^ NP.

 

For the highs, if your factory fitment is 9005, go to HIR1.

 

It's an awesome compliment to any 4300-6000K color-temperature HID low-beam setup.

 

 

HIR1's are awesome.

[TSiWRX]

^ What I love about the HIR is that it's a warm color, and compliments the HID's coolness very nicely, bringing some welcome added contrast, particularly for those long-reach scenarios.

 

The added benefit is that the HIRs are just like any other standard incandescent - instant on/off, with no consideration for a solenoid/shield, nada. Perfect for flash-to-pass needs or the need to immediately fire, when faced with the need to go to the far beams.

 

Finally, the cutoff on my drivers side seems totally eff'd- the passenger side is a nice crisp clear line right where the original halogens cutoff. The driver's side is NOTHING like that...its maybe a fuzzy line that is far below where the originals cutoff, and is honestly somewhat lost in the passenger side cutoff. I'm thinking the bulb might not be seated correctly? I have pics at home that may help, I'll get them posted soonish.

 

^ Bulb seating would be my first guess, too.

 

As for the battery, yep, I was approaching "year 5 winter" this past winter, and just decided to buy a new one and replace it, proactively. Here in NE-Ohio, for a daily-driver, that's always a worry.

 

I still find that on *really* cold days, when I've let the car sit overnight, that I get some far-side non-firing issues, but when it's that cold, hell, I don't want to fire, when I get up in the morning.