5EAT stutter on 2-3 shift

[usedtobeaJusty]

My 2006 LGT with 5EAT is running stage 1 (for about 15k miles now) with almost 70k on the car. I get the hard 2-3 cold shift everyone else is commenting on. But I also have an issue when under moderate acceleration the tranny feels like it stutters on the 2-3 shift. It seems to be getting more pronounced.

 

It has the original tranny fluid in it as far as I know.

 

 

Any thoughts? I'm worried I'm in for a heap of $$ on this one.

[RIPjeep2002]

Get a flush and fill first. You need to describe the stutter better. Mine does it cold but goes away once warmed up.

[usedtobeaJusty]

When it is cold it shifts hard in the 2-3 shift just like everyone else, so I'm not worried that is a problem. What is a problem (I think) is when the car is fully up to temp, moderate acceleration, the 2-3 shift sends a brief shudder through the car (lasts less than a second). It feels like the tranny is having trouble making the gear change.

[RIPjeep2002]

Well first like said get a flush and fill. If it still happens after that, have the TCU reflashed. Sounds like a torque converter problem

[ClimberDHexMods]

I wish people would stop spreading the idea that a fluid flush is somehow a good idea. If you dislodge some junk and clog something, your trans will NEED TO BE REPLACED OR TAKEN APART AND CLEANED AND REBUILT AND YOU WILL BE SCREWED. Do a bunch of drain and fills, if you have the ability to. Either way, if you really are on 70k with original fluid, then that is very likely a/the cause of the problem.

 

Well first like said get a flush and fill. If it still happens after that, have the TCU reflashed. Sounds like a torque converter problem

 

06 TCU mapping wasn't an issue AFAIK. Why would it get out of wack only after 70k miles? TC definitely should start producing this issue after almost 70k miles of not.

 

Fact is, you need to be very seriously concerned about that trans fluid getting swapped and becoming completely clean in there, as that will otherwise just keep causing more and more of a problem until your trans goes off to the dumpster.

 

Was this always your car?

 

Worst case, post back here. There's a replacement for $1400 shipped, and $600 to install. $2000 would be a blessing for you. FWIW many car companies tell consumers to never change their atf. But then those transmissions are always in need of replacement unless someone had the luck of going to a non-dealer shop and having their smart mechanic do it every, say, 30k miles... And if you keep your fluid fresh, a flush is not a major risk. Still always some risk involved though. Think about what it's doing.

[usedtobeaJusty]

I bought the car with 40k on it from a dealer so I don't have any of the prior maintenance records. I'll replace the fluid as a starting point. What fluid should I be putting in, any recommendations?

[ClimberDHexMods]

Anything that's within spec. Oem fluid (just make absolutely sure it's not for the 4eat), any other fluid listed in the owner's manual (which is rare), or Amsoil ATF has worked very well too. An experienced mechanic will be able to take one look at the fluid and tell you if it was changed recently, or not. If it comes out brown, no good. If it comes out red, good.

[usedtobeaJusty]

i just checked the fluid and it definitely needs to be replaced. It's brownish/red. Doesn't smell burned, but seems it may be on the way.

 

Is there any way to drain the converter? When I put an oversize tranny pan on my F-150 there was a bolt on the converter itself to drain it to get all the fluid out.

[usedtobeaJusty]

How much fluid do I actually need for a drain and fill? I saw 10 qts mentioned, but Fred Beans says you need around 5 just for a drain and fill.

[ClimberDHexMods]

Not that I've ever heard of. If you have balls and a buddy, you can do the drain and fill method, followed by disconnect the front ATF lines, add extra hose to route the out line to a pan or bucket, and add hose to the fill tube and/or stick on a funnel, and feed it new ATF until the out fluid comes out bright red, or whatever color if you get a weird ATF that still meets spec but with whatever color. Make sure your partner can turn off the car when you say so though. Also make sure you somewhat match fluid out to fluid in, either with a clear container, or stopping and checking the fluid level several times. BTW this is not something to do if you have not played with cars much before.

 

FWIW, my fiancee's Volvo has 60k on original ATF. Just checked it. HOLY DARK BROWN!!! FML and F&@$ Volvo's service schedule. The only point of that is to charge old ladies and other inept people thousands for new transmissions.

[fishbone]

ClimberD, you definitely have a valid point about dislodging stuff, but my vote is with a dealer performed tranny flush using Subaru OEM 5EAT fluid and replacement of fluid filter and call it a day. If shit goes wrong afterwards, you can blame it on the dealer. 70K/4 years is not enough to cause those kinds of deposits unless with really hard driving. Opie stated there's still red to the color of the ATF and no burnt smell, which means it's not trashed, but definitely needs replacement.

[ClimberDHexMods]

OP, definitely get confirmation that your dealer will replace your transmission if the dealer does the flush and it goes badly. If they are not willing to promise that, then absolutely do not get a flush, in my opinion.

Fish, the only point upon which I disagree is that stuff could have most definitely built up after 70k with 1 previous atf service at most. It certainly wouldn't be sludgy and such, but it would likely have enough crap in there that could easily go clogging stuff up if it got washed loose and did not leave the trans. Of course you must also realize this is coming from a guy who changes the ATF almost at an oil interval. My standard is probably a bit excessive, but that's what it takes IMO. Hopefully it will prove to keep major costs down. With all the reports of flushes resulting in a car not shifting right afterwards, I believe it to be far from a sure thing.

[fishbone]

The truth is that SOA does not recommend flushes as routine maintenance. Flushes are to be performed when troubleshooting a problem, during service, etc. Your perspective and mine differ based on our own anecdotal evidence, I think. Best compromise would be to perform 2 or 3 drains at a short interval. Opie, to clarify, a drain only replaces the fluid that is in the pan. This is roughly 5 quarts out of the 10 that are in the system. Doing this twice should ensure you've got good fluid in the system.

[ClimberDHexMods]

What SOA says and what the individual dealer will say are two completely different things in practice. Some dealers say synthetic oil voids the warranty, while others will sell you it.

That all said, a flush is just an expedited, convenient way of getting new fluid in. All that washing is completely unnecessary. Also, if you can find a dealer who will change your atf filter, or even know how to get to it, I'd be a bit surprised.

[fishbone]

The problem with drains is that you mix old with new fluid. That's about the only reason I prefer a flush, but if you drain frequently like your situation and mine, I see absolutely no reason to go with a flush.

[ClimberDHexMods]

The problem with drains is that you mix old with new fluid. That's about the only reason I prefer a flush, but if you drain frequently like your situation and mine, I see absolutely no reason to go with a flush.

 

I don't think that's a problem at all. Can you point me to data or expert statement that it is bad? I read it from some guy who took off all the oil hoses on his ferrari to get out all the old stuff, but that is all I have seen. They don't react to each other AFAIK. They just mix in. Heck, synthetic blend oil is a mix of synthetic and regular oils, and that's no problem.

[RIPjeep2002]

So, I'm comming up on my 30k, which I plan on doing a few k early. SOA will be doing it. Should I go with just a drain and have new mix with old? Or get a flush and have all new?

[ClimberDHexMods]

So, I'm comming up on my 30k, which I plan on doing a few k early. SOA will be doing it. Should I go with just a drain and have new mix with old? Or get a flush and have all new?

 

You should have enough information by now to make that decision for yourself. Not trying to be a dick, just saying there are benefits and drawbacks to each approach.