Touge Tuning Posted August 8, 2007 Share Posted August 8, 2007 Does anyone know if the Throttle body on the Legacy 2.5i is the same as the one on the Imprezza 2.5 non-turbo's? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CDN 2.5i Posted August 14, 2007 Share Posted August 14, 2007 the Group A website suggests the fitment is the same... I'd be willing to test fit one for you - Canada Post shipment to K2K 3P3... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JayMitch2.5i Posted August 15, 2007 Share Posted August 15, 2007 i was lookig into getting a dif throttle body a while back and i think i found a few but the years didnt match. Like with th CAI for the 05 Impeza it will fit the legacy withought mods. So if you can find and aftermarket matching the years its worth a try. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JayMitch2.5i Posted August 15, 2007 Share Posted August 15, 2007 http://www.area1320.com/products.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhatV8 Posted August 17, 2007 Share Posted August 17, 2007 "http://www.area1320.com/products.html" Why not just stick a Vornado in your intake...ugghh more crap. It is a cool looking $109 paper weight though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CDN 2.5i Posted August 17, 2007 Share Posted August 17, 2007 Got my Group A TBS en route... will advise fitment asap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Touge Tuning Posted August 18, 2007 Author Share Posted August 18, 2007 "http://www.area1320.com/products.html" Why not just stick a Vornado in your intake...ugghh more crap. It is a cool looking $109 paper weight though. While I dont personally think there is any gain in the "vortex" on the area1320 TBS, the Group A TBS has been dyno proven to improve hp and torque. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhatV8 Posted August 20, 2007 Share Posted August 20, 2007 While I dont personally think there is any gain in the "vortex" on the area1320 TBS, the Group A TBS has been dyno proven to improve hp and torque. Do you have any links to the info on the dyno tests for the Group A TBS? I would be interested in reading up on the results. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhatV8 Posted August 20, 2007 Share Posted August 20, 2007 Actually I don't need the links, I found the Group A website. Something is a little funny about those dyno graphs. Pay particular attention to the scale of each of the graphs. I just tried to overlay the two graphs, but can't seem to get things to match up with the before and after. If there isn't anything to 'hide' then why weren't the two runs plotted on the same graph? Also, I can almost bet that the repeatability tolerance of the dyno is more than the 2hp/2tq that they show as a gain. That amount could be accounted for by tire slip, engine temp, etc other than the spacer. Having been around the performance scene for 22 years makes me a bit cautious of performance claims for 'simple' things like this spacer. The spacer will add some additional port/intake volume, which would in theory give you some additional runner length and torque down low, but take some off the top end as well (i.e.- there is no free lunch). If you compare the overall intake/runner volume as compared to the volume of the TBS, the TBS is likely less than 1% of a volume increase. That small of an increase won't get you much of anything measurable on the dyno. I would spend the ~$100 on the suspension and tires well before the TBS. Just my $0.02. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loomie111 Posted August 20, 2007 Share Posted August 20, 2007 what exactly does this aftermarket throttle body do? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhatV8 Posted August 22, 2007 Share Posted August 22, 2007 what exactly does this aftermarket throttle body do? The product being discussed is a throttle body spacer, not the actual throttle body. With that out of the way, here is 'basic' understanding of said spacer. The trottle body spacer fits inbetween the throttle body and the intake manifold. The spacer increases the intake manifold volume and effective runner length (distance from the throttle plate to intake valve). By increasing volume/runner length you can increase your lower rpm torque, with the trade off of decreasing your higher rpm horsepower (i.e.- no free lunch). The inverse of this relationship is also true. Problem with TB spacers is that they do not usually increase the volume/runner length enough to get a measurable difference. Just assume that the intake manifold has a 500 cubic inch volume and you add a 5 cubic inch additional volume with the spacer. That amount of volume difference is negligible in most cases. Also, a 1" thick spacer will increase your runner length by an overall small percentage, which isn't enough to make a difference on a production intake runner length. To be fair, there may be a slight measurable gain in the amount of Torque "under the curve". A better way to evaluate the change would be to get 3-5 dyno runs in stock form and calculate the average HP & Torque under the curve from 2000 to 6000 rpm. Then swap in the TB spacer, bring the car to the same operating temperatures and perform 3-5 more runs. Again, calculate the average HP & Torque under the curve. Then you can have a better idea if the TB spacer really had any effect on things. Just a thought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CDN 2.5i Posted August 23, 2007 Share Posted August 23, 2007 TBS has arrived - I'll test fit it this weekend. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Touge Tuning Posted August 23, 2007 Author Share Posted August 23, 2007 Actually I don't need the links, I found the Group A website. Something is a little funny about those dyno graphs. Pay particular attention to the scale of each of the graphs. I just tried to overlay the two graphs, but can't seem to get things to match up with the before and after. If there isn't anything to 'hide' then why weren't the two runs plotted on the same graph? Also, I can almost bet that the repeatability tolerance of the dyno is more than the 2hp/2tq that they show as a gain. That amount could be accounted for by tire slip, engine temp, etc other than the spacer. Having been around the performance scene for 22 years makes me a bit cautious of performance claims for 'simple' things like this spacer. The spacer will add some additional port/intake volume, which would in theory give you some additional runner length and torque down low, but take some off the top end as well (i.e.- there is no free lunch). If you compare the overall intake/runner volume as compared to the volume of the TBS, the TBS is likely less than 1% of a volume increase. That small of an increase won't get you much of anything measurable on the dyno. I would spend the ~$100 on the suspension and tires well before the TBS. Just my $0.02. Alot of doubts but we have dyno results showing the gains, numbers were not fudged or anything like that. Also your looking at peak differences, there is alot of gain throughought the powerband with the TBS over without it, its not all about the peak numbers. If the results werent there then we wouldnt have sold as many as we do and there wouldnt be 3-4 companies selling TBS. If you feel our results arent real then feel free to prove us wrong with some of your own results rather than posting up your theories without actual proof. Please dont take what I am saying the wrong way, it just seems your doubting a product you have never had, held, tried, tested or anything like that because your "cautious". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Touge Tuning Posted August 23, 2007 Author Share Posted August 23, 2007 TBS has arrived - I'll test fit it this weekend. Let me know how it goes, I am pretty sure it should fit but this will tell us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JayMitch2.5i Posted August 23, 2007 Share Posted August 23, 2007 +1 get some pics up as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CDN 2.5i Posted August 27, 2007 Share Posted August 27, 2007 +1 get some pics up as well. You want pics? I got pics. Bottom line, it fits. Simple install. No printed instructions, but Group A has an excellent set on their site here: http://groupa.ca/installs/DBW_TBS_Install_Instructions.pdf Very minor issue - you have to tweak the uprights for the airbox ever so slightly due to the new position of the throttle body - but this is obviously to be expected due to the installation of the TBS. First impressions driving - I'd say there is an improvement but hard to quantify really. The gf said definitely faster - felt like we were flying, she said . It was cooler out tonight when I went to test it out so that could be a factor too. Definitely didn't slow down the car . On to the pics: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JayMitch2.5i Posted August 27, 2007 Share Posted August 27, 2007 are you running a stock intake with the spacer? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CDN 2.5i Posted August 28, 2007 Share Posted August 28, 2007 Stock intake but with silencer (box) removed and perrin free flow filter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smack Posted August 28, 2007 Share Posted August 28, 2007 i know this wont fit 2007 2.5i's with the injen cai unless the intake is attached to the throttle body on an angle (not a good idea) so the intake is still the best choice for our cars i guess, almost got excited reading this though... i think ill try to make something custom like this instead of spending the money on it, just need some metal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CDN 2.5i Posted August 30, 2007 Share Posted August 30, 2007 After having driven a few hundred kms with the new TBS, can say I am quite pleased with the results. No driveability issues whatsoever. Performance and power are smooth across the entire rpm range. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OhBe1 Posted August 30, 2007 Share Posted August 30, 2007 Actually I don't need the links, I found the Group A website. Something is a little funny about those dyno graphs. .... I looked at the Group A graphs, & my opinion isn't as high as yours. Are they for a Subaru? At least Group A does have decent muffler bearings. Hard-to-get items, those. 06LOB2.5i MT, JDMRSB, GYTTs, HPS, LGT Mufflers & Leather Wheel, SubiMomo Knob, Inalfa Moonroof, Clutch Switch Bypass, DeDRLd, DeChimed, & Straight Headrest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Touge Tuning Posted August 31, 2007 Author Share Posted August 31, 2007 Thanks for the test fit, this is a great item especially since N/A performance stuff is very limited. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CDN 2.5i Posted August 31, 2007 Share Posted August 31, 2007 Yah, no worries. Very simple install, <30 minutes. Anything to coax a little more power out of these engines is a bonus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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