Kenshin Posted August 31, 2006 Share Posted August 31, 2006 Anyone ever try this stuff? http://www.engineice.cc/ I'm due for a coolant flush and was wondering if this is safe/useful at all for our cars. The cost (seems like it's 15 bucks for half a gallon, hefty but oh well) isn't a big deal and I'm curious in giving it a try. Yay, nay? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
schwinn Posted August 31, 2006 Share Posted August 31, 2006 Well, it's basically PG (Propylene Glycol) instead of EG (Ethylene Glycol) which is safer for the environment. Beyond that, they use DI water in there, instead of tap water. Contrary to popular belief, DI water is not magically "better" than clean water... DI is actually MORE corrosive than plain water. However, it's a better "starting point" than tap water. In the end, it makes little difference, since the additive package in antifreeze should be compensating for the "crap" in tap water anyway. PG doesn't perform significantly better than EG, per se. According to http://www.raypak.com/afreeze.htm PG is slightly worse at freezing points than EG, but has a slightly higher thermal conductivity. Regardless, assuming a properly functioning cooling system, the item that keeps the engine "cooler" is the thermostat. Any improvement in the fluid will simply mean that the thermostat will open to the radiator "less" for a given fluid. For a street car, this means it won't do much of anything. Lastly, as for "horsepower gains" from such mods... I doubt it. The engine temperature (as long as it's nominal) won't affect power output... and the engine temp is held more or less constant by the thermostat... so... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deneb Posted September 1, 2006 Share Posted September 1, 2006 I've heard using distilled or even de-ionized water is better because it doesn't contain the minerals most tap water contains, which can leave deposits in your cooling system. I've been using distilled water FWIW. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
schwinn Posted September 6, 2006 Share Posted September 6, 2006 Distilled water is good, as it doesn't contain these minerals. DI water is much more corrosive, and can actually cause more damage. DI water is not "stable" and will leech metals out from the wetted surfaces until it reaches equilibrium... hence it's corrosive. Again, decent tap water would be good enough, as the additives in the antifreeze should compensate for most of these anyway (at least with a quality antifreeze.) But if you must, Distilled is the way to go, not DI. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pillboy Posted September 6, 2006 Share Posted September 6, 2006 Well, when I flush out the system using the garden hose with the engine running to get most of the old coolant out, I am now left with some water in the system even after draining the radiator (I don't pull the plugs on the block). So...short of dumping in a few gallons of distilled water, just how am I supposed to get all of the tap water out? It is still ugly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SBT Posted September 6, 2006 Share Posted September 6, 2006 I've seen Sube engines that have had other than Subaru Genuine long-life coolant in them, or some mixture of coolants, and the result is not pretty at all. Subaru's position, which I support wholeheartedly for all of my Subes. http://endwrench.com/images/pdfs/WhatEWNov05.pdf... the why http://endwrench.com/images/pdfs/CoolantInsidEWMay05.pdf... the what happens if you don't Subaru Long-Life Coolant P/N SOA868V9210 - $16.09/gal at www.subaruparts.com... probably less at your local dealer SBT - Pro amore Dei et patriam et populum - Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
schwinn Posted September 7, 2006 Share Posted September 7, 2006 Interesting to note that the second article referenced also call for using tap water... not DI or distilled. While the first article says "it's foolish to use anything but distilled or DI water". I'm a little annoyed with that second article. They go on about this non-amine feature, and then simply drop the ball and say that pH is the key. So, does this mean that a proper pH is all that's needed? Based on their preaching about non-amine, I would think not, but nowhere do they explain what makes it good or bad... or where it is? I went through a few labels of stuff in my garage, and never saw an "amine" as an ingredient (though one of my older bottles did list silicates and nitrates, which are a problem for most cars these days.) A little websearch says that Peak Extended Life Antifreeze apparently contains "Ethylene Glycol (107-21-1), Diethylene Glycol (111-46-6), Water (7732-18-5), Sodium Benzoate (532-32-1)" Sounds safe to me, based on the label of the Subaru fluid... but it seems many modern antifreezes have similar ingredients (my bottle of Prestone has a similar lack of "amine" and no silicates either. So, as nice as Subaru makes their fluid sound, they are clearly not the only game in town, unless you can prove otherwise? Besides which, do you really think Subaru either makes their own coolant, or has someone make a custom mix for them alone? I doubt it. Also, what's this "amine" that they harp on about and then drop? Any examples of these "amines"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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